most magical of manuals

Last night My dad kept the kids so the wife and I could go on a date night. Even better, he wanted to take the kids places, so he took the minivan, and left the s2000! whoo hooo! The wife came down sick, so I spent all evening cruising the s2000. After a few hours of cruising, I have come to the conclusion that those incredible engineers at Honda built this transmission, they carved it out of compressed pixie dust, and the linkage is made out of unicorn horns. Honestly shifting this car is amazing, I've never driven anything that shifts this well.

Actually they build it by calling Aisin.

But i agree, it's pretty awesome.

It is the finest shifter I have ever used with the exception of the sequential on my old VFR 750. The best on any production road car ever for sure though.

Wow, why don't you all get a room with aisin.

Ok, it is that good.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: It is the finest shifter I have ever used with the exception of the sequential on my old VFR 750. The best on any production road car ever for sure though.

This is the first time I've ever heard such a comment about a Honda MC trans, usually the complaint is that they're notchy and need to be "pre-loaded" at the toe to get the smoothest results.

In reply to pres589:

The CBR1000 is like that - notchy and clunky on downshifts.

My VFR was smooth, snicky and with just a little throttle lift and toe tap it would go down thru the gears like butter. The only place it was a wee bit clunky was the drop to 1st at idle before rolling away from a stop. The whole bike was a different animal from other Hondas I've owned though so it would not surprise me at all to find the rest of the line using different transmissions or something.

Havent driven an s2000 but i have driven a LOT of cars as a tech and i do really enjoy the shifting in my Insight, although now at 330k miles i have to be REALLY accurate with my double clutch rev matched downshifting to get into 1st from a roll (going into 1st from a roll is 'necessary' frequently in this car).

But, overall, i still honestly think the best-shifting trans ive ever had or driven was the a523 in my 1990 Caravan, and i am completely serious when i say this. As far as the way it FEELS to use it.. it's been the best so far overall . And that trans has 230k on it. The one caveat is that it has aftermarket shifter bushings. Stock bushings feel like E36 M3 20+ years on, if they havent fallen out by now.

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: Actually they build it by calling Aisin. But i agree, it's pretty awesome.

Are you sure???? It IS NOT the same box as the S15/Altezza/Miata/RX8 - aka AZ6....

Here are 4 transmissions. The top photo is the S2000, the lower 3 are versions of the AZ6 (top is Toyota, 2nd is Mazda, 3rd is S15)

as can plainly be seen, the top one is significantly different from the lower 3... the lower 3 show very similar architecture, which is vastly different when compared to the S2000 transmission in the top frame

I've been looking into the AZ6 for nearly 6 years now... mine is almost ready

The case might be different, but every source i've seen calls the S2000 trans an Aisin AZ6.

I realize they aren't identical between the variants, but it remains an Aisin trans.

The trans in my S2000 (37k miles) is a bit finicky. I don't know if it is due to the PO, but 1-2 upshifts at street speeds (not winding it out) are pretty much always notchy and sometimes a bit crunchy/clunky. Not a lot, but enough to be noticeable. I've tried different fluids to no avail. Shifting slowly and deliberately smooths it out, but that's a bit annoying.

CLH wrote: The trans in my S2000 (37k miles) is a bit finicky. I don't know if it is due to the PO, but 1-2 upshifts at street speeds (not winding it out) are pretty much always notchy and sometimes a bit crunchy/clunky. Not a lot, but enough to be noticeable. I've tried different fluids to no avail. Shifting slowly and deliberately smooths it out, but that's a bit annoying.

My buddy's is like that as well, similar mileage to you. He's going to swap to Redline and see what happens.

The trans in my MSM does about the same thing.

It's easy to make a good shifting transmission when the internals don't have to handle torque

92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:

CLH wrote: The trans in my S2000 (37k miles) is a bit finicky. I don't know if it is due to the PO, but 1-2 upshifts at street speeds (not winding it out) are pretty much always notchy and sometimes a bit crunchy/clunky. Not a lot, but enough to be noticeable. I've tried different fluids to no avail. Shifting slowly and deliberately smooths it out, but that's a bit annoying.

My buddy's is like that as well, similar mileage to you. He's going to swap to Redline and see what happens. The trans in my MSM does about the same thing.

My 10ae does the same.

The best of the Miata 6-speeds is as good as the average Miata 5-speed Although that same trans in the NC (different housing and a self-destructing shift fork) seems to shift better.

CLH wrote: The trans in my S2000 (37k miles) is a bit finicky. I don't know if it is due to the PO, but 1-2 upshifts at street speeds (not winding it out) are pretty much always notchy and sometimes a bit crunchy/clunky. Not a lot, but enough to be noticeable. I've tried different fluids to no avail. Shifting slowly and deliberately smooths it out, but that's a bit annoying.

What year the 00-01 had a few escaped the factory with slightly bent shift fork's.

I know mine did.

Keith wrote: The best of the Miata 6-speeds is as good as the average Miata 5-speed Although that same trans in the NC (different housing and a self-destructing shift fork) seems to shift better.

Yeahhhh.... i have to say i really wish i had test driven a 6spd Miata before i bought mine. This transmission is a HUGE let down to an otherwise mostly awesome car.

Not to mention finding reverse is often a recipe for frustration.

I went on a test driving spree a few years ago and have to agree with the OP 100%. The S2000 probably had one of the best manuals I've ever had the opportunity to drive. (BTW - the Civic Si 6 speed isn't far behind) Incredibly smooth and easy shifting, short, precise throws, not much to complain about except that it may be too smooth. I could see mis-shifting in a moment of laziness or inattention. Wasn't an issue on a "you've got my full attention" test drive, but daily driving, I'd see it as a potential problem. For that reason, I prefer the shifter in my Miata. There's just enough of a catch/click into gear to let you know you are there. A little bit more idiot proof, in my opinion.

wearymicrobe wrote:

CLH wrote: The trans in my S2000 (37k miles) is a bit finicky. I don't know if it is due to the PO, but 1-2 upshifts at street speeds (not winding it out) are pretty much always notchy and sometimes a bit crunchy/clunky. Not a lot, but enough to be noticeable. I've tried different fluids to no avail. Shifting slowly and deliberately smooths it out, but that's a bit annoying.

What year the 00-01 had a few escaped the factory with slightly bent shift fork's. I know mine did.

It's an '05. I tried Amsoil Symchromesh MTF and switched back to Honda MTF. The Honda MTF seems to be a little better. I've not yet tried the GM Synchromesh friction-modified...there is a lot of positive commentary about it on S2K-related forums.

As good as Aisin's are, internal rail transmissions just don't have the same feel as external linkage ones. Drive a T-10 equipped car with new linkage (ie - tight, not 45 year old slop) and you will never be the same.

my S2000 (37k miles) is a bit finicky. I don't know if it is due to the PO, but 1-2 upshifts at street speeds (not winding it out) are pretty much always notchy and sometimes a bit crunchy/clunky. Not a lot, but enough to be noticeable. I've tried different fluids to no avail. Shifting slowly and deliberately smooths it out, but that's a bit annoying.

A BIT annoying? I'd say that would be DAMN annoying considering i have almost 10x that mileage on my honda trans and it is just now starting to 'feel different', let alone actually get crunchy! For a car with that low miles that's a load of crap.

it may be too smooth. I could see mis-shifting in a moment of laziness or inattention.

Whenever i put my 60oz drink right behind the shifter in my insight i sometimes go 4-3 instead of 4-5 due to having my arm at a funny angle. Going into both gears feels the same which is sort of disconcerting considering there's a 3000 rpm difference when i let the clutch out.. lol

I actually like the feel of a Ford Top Loader 4 speed.

When it has fresh syncros and bushings. Snick snick

the Fiat 124 Transmission is also very nice.. for the few miles that it lasts

In reply to oldeskewltoy:

Aisin called it an AZ6, but the research I've done says they have relatively little in common with the other AZ6s.

They do feel pretty damn wonderful either way.

BMW 6sp manual. I had a 2003 330i ZHP and it was the best trans I have ever driven. I have also had a2005 RX8 which was good but not as good. Plus it would grind every once in a while.

The Ford Capri V6 with external shift linkages had very nice, almost buttery slick, gear box change feel save for long throws. I hear Ford somehow messed that up when the trans grew a 5th gear, any XR4Ti guys care to chime in on that? To me, every other car's gear change feels like a box of notches in comparison.