Okay, we're not really connecting here, and I imagine that's my fault. Forget the Harley-BMW comparison. Forget the Goldwing rider. Forget the bright jacket. Not the point. What I'd like to know specifically is what is it about a BMW bike that is better than another one? Now some have said it's very reliable - Okay. Some say it's the best long distance bike - Okay. But looks and dorkiness aside, what physically makes it better than "any" other touring bike?
I think it's down to personal preference. I test rode a BMW touring bike and just found the seating position too wide for me; it felt like sitting on a horse saddle and I got a cramp in my legs. But for some people that might be really comfy. I doubt you would find a consensus that a BMW is better than any other touring bike, any more than you would find a consensus that a Miata is the best sports car on the planet. It's just that some people like them so they choose to ride them. Why not?
bravenrace wrote: Okay, we're not really connecting here ....
Now do I get it?
I don't know what it is about BMWs either, I have two boxers. No BMW cars currently. My RT will do it all day long! It's comfy, I'm protected from the elements, heated grips and tons of space for luggage.
Why is that better than a Harley? Dunno. Better than a Wing? Wings aren't my thing but there's an ass for every seat. H-D guys will tell you about the fantastic resale value; meh. BMWs have done that all along based on build quality.
Perhaps I still don't understand your question.
Dan
bravenrace wrote: Okay, we're not really connecting here, and I imagine that's my fault. Forget the Harley-BMW comparison. Forget the Goldwing rider. Forget the bright jacket. Not the point. What I'd like to know specifically is what is it about a BMW bike that is better than another one? Now some have said it's very reliable - Okay. Some say it's the best long distance bike - Okay. But looks and dorkiness aside, what physically makes it better than "any" other touring bike?
Because they tend to be a "swiss army" knife of motorcycles.
Highway, city, backroads, twisty mountains, off-road and light trails........one bike and can do it all and do it all well.
z31maniac wrote:bravenrace wrote: Okay, we're not really connecting here, and I imagine that's my fault. Forget the Harley-BMW comparison. Forget the Goldwing rider. Forget the bright jacket. Not the point. What I'd like to know specifically is what is it about a BMW bike that is better than another one? Now some have said it's very reliable - Okay. Some say it's the best long distance bike - Okay. But looks and dorkiness aside, what physically makes it better than "any" other touring bike?Because they tend to be a "swiss army" knife of motorcycles. Highway, city, backroads, twisty mountains, off-road and light trails........one bike and can do it all and do it all well.
How? Why?
z31maniac wrote: Okay. But looks and dorkiness aside, what physically makes it better than "any" other touring bike?
Attention to detail. The same kind of quality thinking that led Honda to produce the VFR-750. Not the absolute greatest at any single category but pretty great at all of them.
disclaimer I have never owned a BMW bike and only ridden one for any length of time. I have, however, shopped them relentlessly since that ride. It will be the successor to my badly missed VFR. Unless I buy another VFR.
Mitchell wrote: Looking uncool is part of the BMW shtick. From my local observations, the SV650 riders are kind of a blend of sport bike riders and BMW riders--They (okay, we) think that we look cool, but we wear more gear than almost all of the other sportbike riders, so we never have that nonchalant lack of concern for our own safety.
hey I think my BMW k1200s is pretty cool lol.....I don't wear a dayglow jacket though and my bike isn't the style bravenrace is talking about. I have noticed a lot of the BMW riders I run into are a little...uh...different and have insane brand loyalty to a fault. And then there are the guys like me that bought them because it's the bike that fits there needs the best, understand the faults, and work around them because they love the bike.
As far as BMW reliability. I love my k1200s, but it is not the most reliable BMW model ever made and I've only seen one past 100k miles.
I still think HD brand loyalty is weirder than BMW.
In reply to pres589:
Got it. Thanks.
pres589 wrote: I still think HD brand loyalty is weirder than BMW.
I'm starting to think they are about equal, but I get what you're saying. I like both brands to be honest, but since I currently own a BMW I see more of the BMW side of things. I was at the dealer picking up some parts and a guy came in to have his air pressure checked in his tires...that just pissed me off.
One thing I can say in defense of some of the Harley owners....you see a lot of those guys doing there own work and actually modifying there bikes as opposed to taking them to the dealer. This was painfully obvious when I was installing a Power Commander V on my k1200s, which I installed primarily to get rid of the awful factory mapping.
Here is a quote from a company that used to make turbo kits for BMWs:
"Harley Customer: "How much is it"..."Here's the money"...."Thanks it works great!"
BMW Customer: "How much does it weigh?".... "Will it void my warranty? "If I bring my bike to you, will you install it for free while I wait ?"... "I don't want to pay shipping"..."Do you have any used ones around that I can try?". "My dealer charges too much money, will you do it for less?"."
I also have a Triumph and have no idea what their owners are like because no one else buys them around here!
Asking why a beemer is better than any other one is like asking why a camry is better than an accord. You can't answer that one really. BMW's are reliable but that matters little to some. BMW's are comfy, but not to all. But they are generally very good at more things than other bikes. Be it the flat engine that lowers the CG, or the longer travel suspension than most that soaks up bumps on nasty roads, etc.
And as for the day-glo vests and hard saddle bags. Well, I think hard saddle bags just look better than soft ones. And many of the folks I've met that do wear the day-glo vests are transplants from Europe where safety is taken more seriously (how many American cars have a hazzard triangle in the trunk lid?). HD guys say "loud pipes save lives" even though they are mainly audible from behind. Where a day-glo vest is visible from anywhere, and not obnoxious.
Just my thoughts.
Mitchell wrote: Looking uncool is part of the BMW shtick. From my local observations, the SV650 riders are kind of a blend of sport bike riders and BMW riders--They (okay, we) think that we look cool, but we wear more gear than almost all of the other sportbike riders, so we never have that nonchalant lack of concern for our own safety.
Haha, that is so true! I had a SV650 for a little while and wore full gear hot or cold outside. I desperately want a BMW GS as my next bike. I used to think BMWs looked stupid until I went out to Oregon and saw groups of people riding with all kinds of E36 M3 on the bike. I saw one dude had a set of skis and a bicycle folded up on the back. When I get another bike, it will be a BMW GS or a Kawi or I may get a touring bike.
I don't have a problem with HDs, touring bikes, "adventure" bikes like BMWs and Kawis, or sport bikes. To me, the HD riders are no more annoying than GSXR riders. You wanna talk about jackasses, seeing guys riding with a T-shirt on, shorts, and flip flops on looks dumber than anything. Difference is, I would buy a HD and mingle with that culture before I would the Gixxer crowd.
Cotton wrote:pres589 wrote: I still think HD brand loyalty is weirder than BMW.I'm starting to think they are about equal, but I get what you're saying.
I think it's weirder in that no one comes up to you at a gas station or other random spot and asks why you don't have a Suzuki. I get non-riders, usually while I'm tanking up the VFR, asking my why I'm on a Honda and not a Harley. That, to me, is weird.
pres589 wrote:Cotton wrote:I think it's weirder in that no one comes up to you at a gas station or other random spot and asks why you don't have a Suzuki. I get non-riders, usually while I'm tanking up the VFR, asking my why I'm on a Honda and not a Harley. That, to me, is weird.pres589 wrote: I still think HD brand loyalty is weirder than BMW.I'm starting to think they are about equal, but I get what you're saying.
True, most comments I get from non-riders about my BMW go like this: "I didn't know BMW made motorcycles"
In honor of this thread, I'm going to ride up into the mountains on my girly sportbike.
pres589 wrote:Cotton wrote:I think it's weirder in that no one comes up to you at a gas station or other random spot and asks why you don't have a Suzuki. I get non-riders, usually while I'm tanking up the VFR, asking my why I'm on a Honda and not a Harley. That, to me, is weird.pres589 wrote: I still think HD brand loyalty is weirder than BMW.I'm starting to think they are about equal, but I get what you're saying.
Are you wearing the requisite Harley Costume and sporting gutted pipes while you ride your Honda?
Anti-stance wrote:Mitchell wrote: Looking uncool is part of the BMW shtick. From my local observations, the SV650 riders are kind of a blend of sport bike riders and BMW riders--They (okay, we) think that we look cool, but we wear more gear than almost all of the other sportbike riders, so we never have that nonchalant lack of concern for our own safety.Haha, that is so true! I had a SV650 for a little while and wore full gear hot or cold outside.
Meh, when I had my R6. Sidi Corsa boots, thick jeans, back protector underneath my full leather jacket, leather forearm length gloves and helmet.........always..........even in July/August in OK.
And everyone one I rode with was the same. Not all sportbike owners are squids.
Oh, I agree not all are squids, just most GSXR riders. 
May not look as cool all geared up but having your skin ripped off is way less cool looking.
I seriously think the BMW guys have their stuff together, once I passed 4 guys touring on the freeway, it started raining so everyone stopped at an underpass to put on their rain suits. Doing 100k miles on a BMW is a lot different then doing 100k on a harley.
Anti-stance wrote: Oh, I agree not all are squids, just most GSXR riders.
I would agree. But I was also the type that put 25k miles on a sportbike in less than 30 months.
In reply to Dashpot:
Ha, no, most of my gear is textile and not leather, and the only exposed skin is my neck; riding in a t-shirt is almost always reserved for moving the bike across the driveway or in and out of the garage.
BMWs GSs are for this:
HD are for this:
Sport bikes are for this:
If you have not used one an Aerostich Roadcrafter is the most awesome piece of motorcycle kit ever. And now they are making it in black on black so it actually doesn't make you stand out as much.
The DL650 Wee strom guys are a lot like the Beemer guys in general its about the most practical application of a motorcycle. In fact a DL650 is considered a "UJM" or universal japanese motorcycle
Im pro anyone who ATTGATTs it but usually thats only 1) hardcore sportbikers on the weekend or 2) sport touring bike riding guys (not just Beemers)
Crashing even in full gear sucks. I lowsided at like 25mph and it still ate through my alpinestars gear in a couple spots
If your main concern is how cool you look, I'd suggest motorcycling is not your thing.
The look is a process of elimination. SOME BMW riders put a ton of miles on these machines (person I worked with had 3 in his gaage with over 300,000 mles before he "retired" them).
When you put that kind of miles in the saddle, your costume gets distilled down to what works. Staying alive, comfortable, warm and dry are what it all comes down to and what others think never comes into the picture.
You'll need to log in to post.
