Old NASCAR stockers suspension

I was looking at some pictures from '76 Le Mans of the stockers that ran at that event. What did they do to the suspension on those old stock cars? This picture looks like the fenders were cut for tire clearance.

That is the restored car running at the Le Mans Classic I believe.

This is the car at the actual event in '76.

I don't know what in specific they did to the suspension, but most of the reason for the sawzall work was so they could fit massively larger rubber under there. Look at some factory-stock pictures from that vintage and see just how little tire was used on street cars.

They ran stock cars at Le Mans? I didn't know that. How did they do? Who drove them? How many ran? Was it just that one year? Tired of my questions yet?

If memory serves, they stopped being stock cars by around 1970. After that they were custom chassis. I think the "truck arms" date that far back.

bravenrace wrote: They ran stock cars at Le Mans? I didn't know that. How did they do? Who drove them? How many ran? Was it just that one year? Tired of my questions yet?

Ditto. Didn't know that.

I heard stories of some of the Hemi cars being run being run at Lemans with drum brakes, and how much fun it was trying to slow those cars down. The story as relayed to me had Richard Petty being one of the drivers, but almost any interesting Mopar story of that time frame includes him, whether he was there or not.

Read about it: http://articles.dailypress.com/1996-06-12/sports/9606120004_1_junie-donlavey-lemans-winston-cup

In reply to ST_ZX2:

need access to read that article.

alfadriver wrote: In reply to ST_ZX2: need access to read that article.

I should have cut-n-pasted; now I need access as well. Two cars, a Torino and a Charger were entered. They were well received by the fans...sent as goodwill ambassadors of the USA during the Bicentennial year. Both cars were DNFs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=706LxcWZEkk

Check out this video. Go to 1:30 if you want to see the suspension, or lack there of. I saw some of these races on Wide World of Sports.

Worked for me:

Article said: RICHMOND — When the call came in March 1976, Junie Donlavey blinked twice to clear his head. His first thought was: Did the man really say LeMans? Indeed, that's exactly what John Cooper said when he called from NASCAR headquarters in Daytona Beach: Hey, Junie (or something reasonably close), wanna take a stock car to LeMans this summer? Today, exactly 20 years later, the longtime Winston Cup team owner still counts his entry in the world's most important endurance race among the highlights of his 45 years in racing. ``It was a wonderful trip, a special and memorable time for my team,'' Donlavey said from his shop. ``We saw things and did things we'd never seen or done, things we'll probably never see or do again. ``Talk about feeling special! There we were, a bunch of guys from Richmond, Va., running a Ford stock car against those Porsches and Ferraris and prototypes. ``Let me tell you, that was the last place I ever expected to race.'' The '76 LeMans race followed by two weeks the World 600 near Charlotte. During its 12 days in Europe, the mostly-volunteer team missed races in Riverside, Calif., and Brooklyn, Mich. It rejoined the tour for the July 4 event in Daytona Beach. Except for personal purchases, NASCAR covered all expenses: packing and shipping of cars and equipment, roundtrip air and ground transportation, and lodging and meals. Ever the financial wizard, Donlavey found a travel agent who could book a London-Paris-LeMans package for 15 people on the money NASCAR sent for 10. They were barely out of Richmond when trouble struck. ``Our van broke down on I-95, going to Dulles Airport,'' Donlavey said. ``I'm thinking, `Man, isn't this something? We're trying to get to Europe, but we can't even get past Fredericksburg.' '' Not to worry. At the top of a nearby off-ramp - within easy walking distance - was a charter bus garage. Without hesitation, Donlavey rented a jitney for the ride to Dulles. The six-hour flight to London seemed interminable. ``Which way are we going - over the icecap?'' Donlavey kept thinking. ``It was my first time to Europe,'' he said, ``and I didn't think we'd ever get there. That's one reason I'm not worried about missing Japan'' for a Winston Cup exhibition race ``in November. I can't imagine being on a plane that long.'' The crew spent two days in London and two in Paris, including a memorable evening at the famous Lido nightclub. ``Some of what we did is best left untold,'' said Ken Bell, one of three LeMans veterans still with Donlavey. ``Just let it go at this: We had a big time in Paris, but were happy to get to LeMans.'' When the crew arrived there by train, they discovered how excited European fans were to have them. ``They'd taken the car all over France on a flat-bed truck,'' Donlavey said. ``People had never seen a race car that big. They called it ``le grande monster'' - or something like that. ``You know, I never did learn exactly what they were saying.'' They've been running 24-hour races at LeMans since 1923, skipping only the war-and-recovery years of 1940-1948. The circuit has ranged from 10.7 miles to 8.3, and currently uses 8.5 miles of public highway and a permanent racing section. It has six right-hand turns, four lefts, a pair of esses, and a chicane near the pits. It also has the Mulsanne Straight, a 3.7-mile ribbon of public roadway where speeds approach 220 mph. Upwards of 250,000 fans watch from the grandstands along much of the course or from the infield, which encompasses another road circuit, a golf course, amusement park, automotive museum, shopping center, campground and go-kart track. Many well-off fans watch the opening and closing laps from outdoor cafes, separated from the Mulsanne by a strand of guardrail and some hay bales. The '76 race was the first and last time stock cars ran LeMans. It was designed as a one-shot deal as part of America's yearlong Bicentennial Celebration. Besides, few Cup teams were willing to miss two points races to compete in Europe. Cooper, a NASCAR executive at the time, was present when the idea was first broached at Daytona Beach in January of '76. ``Some people from LeMans were at our 24 Hours of Daytona, and Bill France Sr. asked why they didn't have a NASCAR class,'' he recalled. ``They said they'd create one if we'd send over some cars. That's how it happened, with people standing around, shooting the breeze.'' Donlavey took a short-track Ford for American drivers Dick Brooks and Dick Hutcherson, and LeMans resident Marcel Mignot. It carried No. 90 and was backed by Truxmore Industries. The other stock car was a Dodge Daytona owned, prepared, and driven by the Winston West father/son team of Hershel and Doug McGriff. Sponsored by Olympia beer, it carried No. 4. Cooper was careful in his choice of teams. ``We wanted people who'd represent us well, good ambassadors and good guys,'' he said. ``In that regard, Junie and Hershel always come to mind. It seemed natural to send them.'' Alas, the Dodge lasted only several laps, its engine mortally wounded by low-octane fuel. ``It was an 85 or 86 reading, and we expected 91 or 92,'' said Hershel McGriff, still an active racer at age 68. ``Because of that, we kept burning pistons. ``It was a good car. It had 440 cubic inches, a big carburetor, good brakes and a good transmission. It flew down that straightaway, but wouldn't corner like those sports cars.'' Even now, 20 years later, his clearest image of LeMans is the fans' reaction to his car. ``For a week, in almost every paper, there was a picture of it,'' he said. ``They loved it because it was big and loud and had a different engine roar. Too bad it didn't run any longer than it did.'' Noted engine-builder Bud Moore figured the fuel would be low-octane, so he built low-compression, 351 cubic-inch engines. Donlavey's car ran from the 4 p.m. start Saturday until the clutch failed at 3 a.m. Sunday. Hutcherson has no doubt it would have run all 24 hours. ``We were doing great, going right along,'' he said. ``There wasn't a sign of trouble until the clutch went out at the worst place. ``Brooks started the race and was driving when it quit. We were changing drivers each gas stop - about every three hours - and I was just about to get in.'' The clutch failed on the far side of the course, several miles from the pits. Brooks couldn't nurse the car around and didn't have the tools to fix it on the spot. ``When we found out he couldn't get the car back, the air went out of us,'' said Dave Bowlin, still a member of Donlavey's team. ``After everything we'd done to get there - the days and nights we spent getting ready - it was a huge letdown not finishing the race.'' Thirteen hours later - at 4 p.m. Sunday - the Porsche 936 of Jacky Ickx and co-driver Guy Van Lennap took the checkered flag after covering 2,964 miles. Not long afterward, with home their new top priority, Donlavey's crew headed out to retrieve their car. Thirty-six hours later - after Sunday night in Paris, a stopover in London, and a van ride from Dulles - they made it. ``It was a great trip and a neat deal,'' Bowlin said, ``but enough was enough.''

bravenrace wrote: They ran stock cars at Le Mans? I didn't know that. How did they do? Who drove them? How many ran? Was it just that one year? Tired of my questions yet?

A NASCAR Torino and Charger ran at Le Mans in '76. Both DNF. Drivers of the Torino were Dick Brooks, Dick Hutcherson and Marcel Mignot. Drivers of the Charger were Hershel McGriff and Doug McGriff.

That is a cool story. Its too bad they only did it one year.

It would be interesting to see a current Cup car running in the field at LeMans. Hell, just bring one of the Camping World trucks. Let it try to run down the Audi...or run it over as it's trying to get out of the way.

btp76 wrote: If memory serves, they stopped being stock cars by around 1970. After that they were custom chassis. I think the "truck arms" date that far back.

Really? I thought they were still using stock chassis.

Klayfish wrote: Hell, just bring one of the Camping World trucks. Let it try to run down the Audi...or run it over as it's trying to get out of the way.

You're kidding, right?

why not? An unrestricted cup car would bring 750-800hp, a slick aero package, competent cornering and braking and very strong construction. While they wouldn't be running down the Audis(although well over 200mph would be possible), they would still be running fast laps. It would be just as entertaining to see as the Delta wing was.

In reply to forzav12:

Yeah, a Camping World Truck is capable of winning LeMans. Ahuh. Audi must be really stupid to put all that effort and money into their car when they could have just gone and bought a NASCRAP car.

bravenrace wrote:

Klayfish wrote: It would be interesting to see a current Cup car running in the field at LeMans. Hell, just bring one of the Camping World trucks. Let it try to run down the Audi...or run it over as it's trying to get out of the way.

You're kidding, right?

I think he's trolling........modern LMP1 cars are hitting in excess of 200mph 3 times down the straight(due to the newer chicanes in it), and over 200 leading up to the turn called "Indianapolis"

Anyone know what the lowest speed for the lmp1 cars would be? I'm assuming the chicanes right before the grandstands/start finish.

Thats a great story, and definitely different for the fans at that time......they were used to 2cv citroens at that time after all

I'm with forza and klay, I think a modern Cup car would do quite well at LeMans. They seem to be beating the snot out of the SCCA all over (see the re-body threads popping up all over). I'd be interested in seeing that for sure. Send over Gordon, he likes road racing.

In reply to yamaha:

You know that cup cars hit over 200MPH every lap, right? Without restrictor plates they'll lap Talladega and Daytona at over 200 everywhere...

In reply to Javelin:

He didn't say it would do quite well. He said it would run over the Audi.

Also, to clarify, "A slick aero package" would not help there.......the name of the game at le mans is downforce, while the delta was light and sleek, it made considerable downforce.

In reply to bravenrace:

You really need to learn to separate the serious (a NASCAR at LeMans) from the hyperbole (running an Audi over), or you're going to die of a massive brain hemorrhage, man. When GRM says the FRS isn't as good as 2 Miatas welded together do you take that as literally?

It would be neat, and from a lap time standard, I would expect times to be similar to the GTpro field.....possibly a bit faster due to straightaway speeds.