Run Rains when only some have them?

My brother is racing nationals (soec 944) and the forecast calls for rain.  He and 3 or 4 (out of about 10) brought rains. 
 

he told me that there are murmurings of a proposed gentleman's agreement to not run them to keep everyone equal. 
 

 on one side, equal cars (especially in a spec class) is great.  
 

but on the other, nothing changed to give some the advantage - anyone could have brought them and the weather forecast is equally available.  
 

there's also the safety factor.  
 

He isn't on grm here and will make his own decision but I enjoy hearing the thought process of intelligent people and wonder what some thoughts are on it. 
 

It's racing.  Those that brought them planned, went to the trouble, went to the expense to get them.  It's not cheating.  Run em!

*shrug*

That would seem to depend on the competitors.  Absent that, tires are just part of preparation, if you don't have the right tires then you prepped inappropriately.

But it would also be a D move if everyone agreed to not run them, and you ran them anyway.

This looks like a job for supps and a request to the organizer to hash out what to do with no ill will involved.  If the organizer says no rains, well, then that is a decision no longer available to you.  

But again, this is not a regional, it is Nationals, one should expect that people would come prepared.  With that in mind I can see the organizer just saying "lol wut?"

No "organization" is going to put their endorsement behind, "be less safe" if the common understanding is that rain tires makes the driving safer.  

If it were just a speed question I could see the organization getting behind it.  The argument is that drivers on rain tires will have a speed advantage but I think the reality is that drivers on rain tires will have a safety advantage.  And, done right, they can turn that safety advantage into a speed advantage.  

Not knowing any of the players, I think it would be interesting to see where/who the proposal is coming from.  

Rain can be a real game changer.  With it, an underpowered car is no longer disadvantaged.  Something like a slow guy from PWN who sees rain often during his local events now can use that experience over the guy from Vegas who never sees rain and always has hot grippy conditions.  

In reply to frenchyd :

Does not sound like an autocross to me. I believe spec 944 is a road racing class. 

If we were talking about something that was some crazy interpretation of the rules or that met the letter of the rule but very obviously violated the spirit, maybe that would be worth considering.  But this is a case of failing to properly prepare the car.  If some of the competitors didn't perform all of the performance enhancements available to the engine that were allowed in the rulebook, would it be cool to ask for a gentlemens' agreement to have the better-prepped cars take on ballast?

I would be very clear from the get-go that I was not interested in any such agreement and I'd be telling everyone that I was going to run my rains regardless.  I don't know if I actually would, but while everyone else was discussing it, I'd be pretty clear about it.

It's literally a national championship event, at a track on a dry hill with tons of elevation change, where there's likely to be literal flows of water across the pavement at points. Unless mandated by the stewards, I'd run the rains, even if just for safety. Even spec classes have rain tire options, and it should be up to the stewards, not the other competitors, whether the session is declared officially "wet" or not. 

John Welsh said:

Rain can be a real game changer.  With it, an underpowered car is no longer disadvantaged.  Something like a slow guy from PWN who sees rain often during his local events now can use that experience over the guy from Vegas who never sees rain and always has hot grippy conditions.  

I did this when I ran H-Production. I checked weather to see if there was a possible rain race I could get to. It helped. There were rain races in AZ (late season monsoons)

wvumtnbkr said:

It's racing.  Those that brought them planned, went to the trouble, went to the expense to get them.  It's not cheating.  Run em!

Let us ask an expert on what he thinks on the subject matter

berkeley em for not being prepared, I would not accept this bs as a competitor nor would I expect it of others if I showed up not ready

80% chance of rain at Laguna Seca tomorrow, I'm not sure if I would have planned for that but I'd be happy to have some rains if I brought them.

Edit, I know it's for a race but if it's wet enough for them, and I dragged them out there, then I'm getting that seat time on an awesome track.

Yeah, that's a no from me, dawg.  If they're legal and I brought them, I'm using them.

Hey, I know - I only brought a four-way lug wrench.  What say we agree that no one uses sockets or impact guns, k?

I don't have strong feelings either way.  If everyone wants to have a gentleman's agreement, fine.  If the people who brought rains want to run them, also fine. The only real problem I see is that the people who didn't bring rains and want to have a gentleman's agreement are telling the people who brought them that they have to waste the money they spent on rain tires.  Just my .02

At a national event?  I'm going to run anything legal that I can that improves performance.  At a local event I'm happy to go with the flow just to have fun as long as it's safe.   If the dry tires are slicks however, that's not safe in the rain and I'd rather load up and go home than race on those.

"Gentleman's" is not the noun I'd use to describe that agreement, lol.  My word wouldn't be as nice.

Only 3-4 cars have them; so the rest are in the same boat.

I see no reason not run them.

I've run my shaved Hoosiers in the rain. Not ideal but if enough cars are in the same boat its not a big deal.

Several years back we had this happen two of the 18 cars had rains; they lapped us all.

It's a safety issue.

I really tried to talk myself into being okay with keeping the group happy, but it kept coming back to making the trek to Nationals just to park it or drive on wets but stay out of the actual race.

If it's wet enough for wets, running other tires is dangerous. At that point, you're being asked to forfeit your race because someone else is less prepared and more willing to ball up their car or get hurt. And that's not a reasonable request for someone who's made that trip.

I can conceive of it being worthwhile to keep the peace, but I'd want to make it very clear that those people cost the prepared people a National race weekend, and next year the agreement will be "be prepared or be quiet about it."

Why would you show up to a national championship without enough equipment to account for the weather forecast? Especially when it's a safety issue as much as anything else? berkeley em, run the rain tires if conditions justify them. Maybe if it's 'intermediate' weather then everyone can agree to run dry tires even if the wets might be slightly faster. But if it's full wet, you're either running rain tires or sitting that race out.

dps214 said:

Why would you show up to a national championship without enough equipment to account for the weather forecast?

Because apparently, you're a "gentleman".

How close are the competitors? If it's me and 9 close friends, then sure, let's go. 

If it's me and 8 close friends with one new guy, I'm not asking him to waste his rain tire $$ at minimum, or potentially worse, so I can have fun with my 8 friends.

Honestly I bristle at the idea that there is any setup choice within the rules that is not made by the team. 

"Hey, let's all run 2 inches or rear toe out. Gentleman's agreement. It'll be fun."

As soon as a team enters a race knowing that at least one setup choice was not theirs, they are no longer taking responsibility for any negative outcomes. They aren't racing their car. Are they even racing? Or are they just playing someone elses game?

Running a car that is not prepared for the driving conditions is a safety issue. 
 

I'd ask for a gentleman's agreement that all the poorly prepared cars with the wrong tires be kept off the track for the safety of others.