paranoid_android74
paranoid_android74 SuperDork
8/2/16 6:47 p.m.

TL/DR:

I noticed while driving by today a local to me car lot of questionable repute has more than one imported vehicle on its lot with a hood scoop. That was unusual.

I checked their website later to learn three of them are Subarus with a bajillion miles on them, one of them is a "2005 Saab 9-2X AWD Linear 4dr Sport Wagon."

They state the engine is a 2.5l H4. This is where I need help.

My Google-fu tells me this is an EJ253 NA engine. Is this right?

Though it may not be as cool as a turbo, is this engine more reliable in comparison? Or is this the one that needs head gaskets with every oil change? (I'm kidding here)

I've tried to read up on which Subaru engines are the ones to own, but good golly. Can a guy get a simple matrix?

Thanks!

Ojala
Ojala GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
8/2/16 8:22 p.m.

You have it right, its a ej253. They can have headgasket problems, but if you use the turbo mls gasket it will be fine. How much do they want for the linear?

paranoid_android74
paranoid_android74 SuperDork
8/2/16 8:55 p.m.

They are asking $6991. They say it has 89,089 miles on it. Their listing is here.

I didn't see the Saab while I was driving by, but it is a small lot that is packed with cars. They usually put their "bling" right out by the street which is what I usually see.

NGTD
NGTD UberDork
8/2/16 9:06 p.m.

EJ 2.5's will need headgaskets once if they are done right. Use a MLS headgasket and be done. They leak externally normally and if you can put up with a little drip and the stain on your driveway, most can just keep going, just make sure you check the oil on a regular basis.

With the Saabaru - Linear is 2.5NA, Aero is 2.5 turbo.

Ojala
Ojala GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
8/2/16 9:25 p.m.

In reply to NGTD:

06 aero is ej255-pretty rare

05 aero is ej205-more common-ish

ScottyB
ScottyB Reader
8/2/16 9:48 p.m.
Ojala wrote: You have it right, its a ej253. They can have headgasket problems, but if you use the turbo mls gasket it will be fine. How much do they want for the linear?

this. the 253 in my '05 2.5RS started weeping at 88K and i had it resealed with the turbo MLS gaskets. currently at 130k and tight as a drum. its not a matter of "if" the stock head gaskets go, just a matter of when. and if they're resealed with the standard, non-MLS gaskets they'll be no better off.

some have a little appetite for oil, so just check it every gas station fillup or two. you might also get some piston slap when the weather's cold during startup. otherwise, they're pretty solid engines.

paranoid_android74
paranoid_android74 SuperDork
8/2/16 9:48 p.m.

I was pretty sold on the idea of a Forester XT, but reading about longevity woes here and other places kind of turned me off.

Maybe a NA 2.5 in Swedish guise would be a better package in the long run?

ssswitch
ssswitch HalfDork
8/2/16 10:02 p.m.

The 251 (essentially identical to the 253 in every way you care about) in my 03 TS has been going for a very long time with a bad driver-side head gasket. I would have pulled the motor and put MLS gaskets in by now but every time I think about refreshing the engine the Delta torque grind cams enter my mind and then it becomes a very expensive proposition that ends with me making stupid power.

In general, single slammer Subarus are anvils. Early DOHC cars are more trouble.

During normal operation: check the oil and coolant levels every couple of fillups and make sure they're good.

As for inspection/hammering the dealer on price:

Look for blow-by by removing the oil cap at idle - and if you see it, replace the PCV valve and clean the valve cover breather hoses after freaking out at the dealership how that means "bad piston rings" for a discount.

Note that many of the Saabaru body panels are becoming hard to find: this may impact insurance premiums if you choose to carry full coverage.

Fun fact, since you mentioned it: the Linear does not have a hood scoop. If this one does, I'd bet money that it was crashed and they chucked an Aero hood at it since that's all they could find.

If you do end up buying it, I would send it to an alignment shop to see if the caster numbers make sense or if the accident bent a control arm, which is very common for curb-involved accidents in Imprezas.

Other things I generally look for on Impreza wagons (boy have I bought a lot of these) include the removable rubber strips on the rear fenders (are they clean underneath? is the metal beneath rusted?), headlights that aren't the same level of 'worn' (again indicating a front end accident), cracked or missing timing cover, torn weatherstripping around the front windows (indicating failed theft attempt or leaks), loose or sagging front bumper covers, leaking or torn front CV boots, tires that aren't the same on all four corners.

It is really common for the passenger-side C-pillar trim to be 'popped out' a bit: the clip at the bottom gets strained over the years and lets go. You could probably use this as a negotiating lever but it depends how seedy this lot is and where they got the car from (auction?)

In my part of the world EVAP codes are very common: this is usually because the previous owners ignore the warning sticker inside the gas cap that tells you not to keep trying to fill the car up after the pump has already stopped. You see a lot of people who want to "round off" their purchase at the pump and just end up filling the charcoal canister with liquid gas. After a decade of this clownshoe idiocy, the charcoal falls apart and then things get bad for the rest of the EVAP system, which leads to me swearing at the previous owners for not being able to read a frickin' sticker. The vent valve wiring also sometimes becomes corroded from road salt and will throw codes when it shorts.

Good luck! I have been looking for a nice Saabaru for awhile to complete my descent into madness. Perhaps you will get there first.

paranoid_android74
paranoid_android74 SuperDork
8/3/16 10:09 a.m.

In reply to ssswitch:

Wow, thank you for the detailed information! I will take all of it into account if I decide to go look at it.

The NLA parts situation is in the back of my mind too. Did Saab reengineer any of the engine, or is a Subaru replacement a drop in?

ssswitch
ssswitch HalfDork
8/3/16 10:11 a.m.

In reply to paranoid_android74:

All of the hard parts are 100% Subaru, although some parts-binning has gone on.

The only Saab-specific parts are basically body panels (which can generally be replaced with Impreza panels if you have enough of them) and some interior bits.

Knurled
Knurled GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
8/3/16 12:50 p.m.

I want an Aero but couldn't find anyone to extend me credit, a lot of banks are leery of financing "orphan" makes like SAAB, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, and such. Probably for the parts-availability conundrum, even if the car is mechanically interchangeable with a common vehicle, the cosmetic stuff usually isn't, and the cosmetic stuff is what they want you to have comprehensive insurance for.

If Subaru has evap problems related to overfilling, that's news to me. Subaru helpfully put plastic shrouding all around the filler neck, keeping moist abrasive dirt in hard contact with it to helpfully rust many holes in it to prevent you from filling the tank too far. (So these are both probably region-specific issues)

Knurled
Knurled GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
8/3/16 12:52 p.m.

In reply to paranoid_android74:

The cars are 100% mechanically Subaru. SAAB did play some parts bin action, in particular the Aero has some STI suspension parts on it like the rack, and the SAABs have more/better interior sound deadening, but you won't run into anything mechanical you can't find on a contemporary Subaru.

BrokenYugo
BrokenYugo UltimaDork
8/3/16 3:47 p.m.

They don't need a headgasket every oil change, but the original ones (along with everything else responsible for holding oil in the motor) do tend to change the oil for you. Kinda like an old Chevy, if you want it dry, pull it out every 100k and replace all the seals and gaskets, but it doesn't care either way so long as it has oil in it.

paranoid_android74
paranoid_android74 SuperDork
8/3/16 3:56 p.m.

In reply to Knurled:

I did not think about the financing part- thank you for pointing that out.

So, I emailed them this am for a copy of the CarFax. No reply.

Stopped by there after work to give it a quick look and ask again for the report. Guy says "Oh- did you email us? CarFax has been down since yesterday." What evs...

He handed me the key for a quick look and came out to the lot with me. I popped the rear hatch first, and boy is it clean. Tried to close the rear hatch, release handle stuck- it looked fairly rusty in there. "I'll go get the WD-40" dude says. What evs...

I started the car, cranked AC and popped the hood while dude was looking for WD-40. Overall it looked clean, no funny noises or smells. Both cooling fans are turning. Popped the oil fill cap off- sure enough it's puffing air!

He got the hatch release freed as I was closing the hood. I opened the passenger door to turn it off and check for cold air, and cold it was (for a ten year old car).

I gave him the keys, and said thanks- I'll read the report over and maybe come back tomorrow- but he may want to put air in the drivers front tire before then.

It was in an accident, but no details (see below). There is an outstanding recall on an airbag. Based on the report the oil and filters have been changed on average at 9k intervals. It's a local trade in from across town.

Not sure yet if I'll go back tomorrow or not.

<img src=" photo image_zpsvhob8hzk.jpeg" />

ScottyB
ScottyB Reader
8/4/16 10:23 a.m.

wow, 9k mile oil changer intervals? these engines are very easy on oil in terms of wear, but that's pushing it a bit especially with standard dino stuff. hopefully they were checking the oil level in between changes as well, that's a lot of miles to potentially go low on oil if it uses a little and they weren't inclined to check it. that said, they put the miles on pretty fast in a short period of time so hopefully it was just a lot of easy highway miles.

airbag recall is nothing weird, seems like just about every car with a Takata in it is due for a replacement. my passenger side bag got replaced earlier this spring at the dealer, as a result of the same recall notice.

ssswitch
ssswitch HalfDork
8/4/16 10:27 a.m.

Fuel tank replaced? I'm guessing you live in the mega-rust belt then.

I'd definitely get that rear subframe inspected.

paranoid_android74
paranoid_android74 SuperDork
8/4/16 11:16 a.m.

In reply to ScottyB:

Yes, that's what I calculated from the CarFax report. The very first oil change was done at around 8k IIRC. It was very sporadic- maybe there were some changes done by a mom and pop place that didn't show up on the report? I don't know...

In reply to ssswitch:

In the winter up here, the answer to snowy roads is salt. If it doesn't work the first time, put more salt down.

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