Shelby is at it again

http://www.ffcobra.com/forums/showthread.php?t=206492

Sueing FFR, the enthusiast forum website for FFR, and a FFR builder/dealer company.

Basically he is trying to put them out of business and make them pay him millions of dollars for "trade dress" use.

W. T. F.

Wow, Carroll Shelby is a big fat jerk.

To sue the company making the cars is one thing, but to sue the enthusiast website associated with them, is quite another. Berkeley Shelby.

It is disappointing that it has come to this. Creating a website, fanclub, or fanpage only to face the possibility of litigation is a regressive step in my eyes. Heck, why stop there, how about bringing back a good old book burning bonfire for good measure.Sheesh, when will the madness end??

Doesn't he have enough money from all this by now? Is he going to sue me for THINKING about Shelby Corbas? Do I have to pay a licensing fee if I take a picture of a Cobra (real or illegal replica) at a car show? Madness, pure madness?

Ya, he's just turned into a cranky old geezer that's got nothing better to do than sue everybody and everything that has anything even remotely to do with the original "Cobra". It's just disgusting. I have no respect for that man. Geeeez.

His legacy was all set for "great racer, master fabrictor, philanthropist and chili cooker". His legacy now will be "bitter old bastard". Pity.

ddavidv wrote: His legacy was all set for "great racer, master fabrictor, philanthropist and chili cooker". His legacy now will be "bitter old bastard". Pity.

+1.

One of my favorite life experiences was hearing him speak at a SEMA reception. I'm having to re-evaluate the admiration I have given him.

If the judge has any good sense this will get thrown out. It would set a REALLY bad precedent.

I think originally he was fine with the Factory 5 cars until they jumped on the Daytona type body.

Factory 5 should just say that they are building AC replicas with V8s not Shelby replicas. Carroll didn't design the Ace did he?

He didn't design the Daytona either. It was copied from a racing Ferrari of the day.

Man, what's up with this? Carroll Shelby has always been one of my heroes. You know, it would maybe be reasonable to ask for a percentage of the profits but the complaint says he wants ALL the profits FFR has received plus 3 times that amount in damages and also attorney's fees.

When I read though the legal complaint, it seems that 'Daytona Coupe' is an 'UNREGISTERED TRADEMARK'. WTF is an 'unregistered trademark'? It's my understanding that if you don't register a trademark then you have no cause to bitch if someone else uses it.

The Daytona Coupe shape is considered 'trade dress'. Due to the physics of aerodynamics pretty much anything that's designed to take advantage of aeros will wind up looking pretty much like all the rest, the way F1 cars all look pretty much alike. So how does that become 'trade dress'? You get right down to it, Shelby stole the nose design from Jaguar. Compare a Daytona Coupe and an E Type coupe to see what I mean.

Tim Baxter wrote: If the judge has any good sense this will get thrown out. It would set a REALLY bad precedent.

I agree this case seems a bit weak... but for better or worse, the precedent has already been set. BMW basically put a "cease & desist" order on a number of MINI sites/forums/aftermarket vendors a few years ago... causing most to change their names. The most notable was "MINI Cooper Online" which is now known as "North American Motoring". Knowing this and knowing Shelby owns the rights to the name "Cobra" as when it applies to a car, and knowing Shelby's past history of being a bit hawkish about protecting that trademakr, naming the forums "FFRCobra.com" was asking for trouble.

A. I thought FFR stopped calling their cars Cobras and Daytonas the last time Shelby sued them, and now just refer to them as the 65 Coupe and the Roadster.

B. Shelby et. al. owns the trademarks for "289" and "427" when they pertain to automobile parts?!?!? wtf? It blows me away that stuff like that can be trademarked... Doesn't Chevy sell a 427cu in LSx crate motor? Is Shelby gonna sue them, too?

Feedyurhed wrote: Ya, he's just turned into a cranky old geezer that's got nothing better to do than sue everybody and everything

From what I know, he's always been like that.

That's true, Ian, but the way this thing is worded (if I'm reading it right) it looks like it would set a terrible precedent for ALL fan sites of any kind. Not good.

I wonder if carrollshelbyisabitteroldbastard.com is an available domain.

Often times it's not whether the lawsuit is valid or not. The threat of a lawsuit on a company is enough to put off most investors. In this time of a credit crunch I can't help to think that this case looming over FFR will hurt their ability to get credit for operations. That can cripple a company as quickly as selling a crap product. If they want this to go away as quickly as possible the best bet, on their part, may be to just pay off ol'Shel and be done with it.

These are litigious times we live in.

Chuck Yeager had to sue his own kids in the last few years. Lawsuit article here. Turns out Chuck had himself a new, young bride and his kids from his previous marriage weren't too crazy about her. Then he supposedly found out the kids were already spending his estate and filed a counter suit.

I guess I associate the two men together because they seem like country boys that made good with common sense, a bit of luck, with some "can do" attitude thrown in.

"Demand for Jury Trial"

Man, what I wouldn't pay to be on that jury!!

I am/might still be a big fan of 'ol Shel and have quite a bit of Shelby memorbilia but crap like this just makes me want to throw it all in a box and sell it on eBay and be done with him.

Xceler8x wrote: Often times it's not whether the lawsuit is valid or not. The threat of a lawsuit on a company is enough to put off most investors. In this time of a credit crunch I can't help to think that this case looming over FFR will hurt their ability to get credit for operations. That can cripple a company as quickly as selling a crap product. If they want this to go away as quickly as possible the best bet, on their part, may be to just pay off ol'Shel and be done with it. These are litigious times we live in. Chuck Yeager had to sue his own kids in the last few years. Lawsuit article here. Turns out Chuck had himself a new, young bride and his kids from his previous marriage weren't too crazy about her. Then he supposedly found out the kids were already spending his estate and filed a counter suit. I guess I associate the two men together because they seem like country boys that made good with common sense, a bit of luck, with some "can do" attitude thrown in.

Indeed! Shakespear had it right, long ago:

" First , kill all the lawyers!"

Sad, just sad. I wonder if he puts as much effort into "defending" his rights on his other E36 M3. Like the Shelby Dakota.

He's definitely gone from idol/hero to grumpy old bastard in my book.

Tim Baxter wrote: That's true, Ian, but the way this thing is worded (if I'm reading it right) it looks like it would set a terrible precedent for ALL fan sites of any kind. Not good. I wonder if carrollshelbyisabitteroldbastard.com is an available domain.

Doesn't look like it...

But like I said, I think the precedent for fan sites has already been set. Most sites either have no name-connection to the car/brand focus, or have reached some type of agreement with the trademark holder. Obviously, this varies with the company in question. Some companies seem more tolerant than others. VW, for example, seems to let the VWVortex and TDIClub sites (as well as a few aftermarket vendors) use the VW and Audi symbols and names with impunity. Other sites I've been on seem to have similar agreements and/or arrangements.

In the end, a trademark is a trademark, and if a site looks to make money (a .com vs. a .org) of that trademark without providing some sort of benefit to the holder, then they have every right to protect their property. Many in the MINI complained that use of the MINI and Cooper names helped MINI... but in the end, BMW stood fast by their right/desire to protect the name (they've also come down on Cafe Press for anything containing MINI, Cooper or even the image of a MINI). Shelby has a history of taking this protection right to the extreme as well, so none of this surprises me.

All Shelby does is trade on his name. I think every manufacturer has had a Shelby something. But it's cars like the FFRs and the enthusiast sites like FFRCobra.com that make his name worth selling.

Cracking down on products that are nothing more than a trademark violation (ie, barstools with the logo, etc) makes sense to me. Cracking down on enthusiast websites that use the car's name don't. I think Mazda's got it right - you can't sell stuff with the Miata logo on it, but they support Miata.net.

This is way much like the Ford threatened lawsuit over the use of Mustang pictures on various message boards. I wonder if someone at Ford isn't ultimately behind this, using Shelby as a cat's paw in this instance.

I did a little more digging, Shelby sued Superformance for similar reasons. Shelby lost the case. http://performanceunlimited.com/superformance/pressrelease.html

By the way, Ford was a co plaintiff in that case.

Another thought: how come Porsche hasn't shut down the manufacturers of the Speedster and 356 replicas? Porsche jealously guards their replacement parts biz yet this flourishes. How come Jaguar hasn't shut down the XK120 replica business? Why hasn't Ford shut down the '32 Ford replica business that's the backbone of the street rod craze? In each case I think it's because they can't.

I'm thinking of trademarking the number "17" and the word "Fish" as applied to automobiles and broccoli.

That was brilliant Hess!