David S. Wallens wrote: I spent more time just looking at it today--like just taking it in. I'm still in the "want" camp.
Me too. Visually a lot of similarities to a car I've very much admired: The Z4 coupe.
David S. Wallens wrote: I spent more time just looking at it today--like just taking it in. I'm still in the "want" camp.
Me too. Visually a lot of similarities to a car I've very much admired: The Z4 coupe.
DeadSkunk wrote: Is that a "roll hoop" behind the headrest in the last picture? I know the convertible has it, but why have it in the RF?
Because the "fastback" top is totally non-structural.
Mitchell wrote: If the Miata became a hardtop coupe, it would have to compete in price point with normal, sensible cars. As a powered hardtop, it remains an indulgence, which allows it to live in a price point that justifies its existence to Mazda.
The RX8 was the NC everyone wanted - hardtop with a hatchback, enough room for big guys and a rotary! And the sales were dramatically worse. So maybe Mazda has listened to the market. Although the Frisbee twins did outsell the aging NC Miata.
Keith Tanner wrote:Mitchell wrote: If the Miata became a hardtop coupe, it would have to compete in price point with normal, sensible cars. As a powered hardtop, it remains an indulgence, which allows it to live in a price point that justifies its existence to Mazda.The RX8 was the NC everyone wanted - hardtop with a hatchback, enough room for big guys and a rotary! And the sales were dramatically worse. So maybe Mazda has listened to the market. Although the Frisbee twins did outsell the aging NC Miata.
This is a funny-looking hatchback:
Also, when did anyone want an NC with a back seat?
Sorry, I thought they were a hatch. I really don't pay any attention to them at all. So it's got the same kind of hatchback as the Frisbee twins then...
Keith Tanner wrote: Sorry, I thought they were a hatch. I really don't pay any attention to them at all. So it's got the same kind of hatchback as the Frisbee twins then...
I dunno why, but I find it highly amusing that you thought the RX-8 was a hatchback.
I think the reason for the RX-8 failure was multiple.
There are other things, but those are the big ones. It's just not a practical car overall for the average consumer. None of those things apply to a hardtop Miata, but that said I tend to agree that the targa roof tends to fit this into a niche that more people will occupy vs a hardtop.
Keith Tanner wrote:Mitchell wrote: If the Miata became a hardtop coupe, it would have to compete in price point with normal, sensible cars. As a powered hardtop, it remains an indulgence, which allows it to live in a price point that justifies its existence to Mazda.The RX8 was the NC everyone wanted - hardtop with a hatchback, enough room for big guys and a rotary! And the sales were dramatically worse. So maybe Mazda has listened to the market. Although the Frisbee twins did outsell the aging NC Miata.
Also, the RX-8 was saddled with a love it or hate it engine to match its love it or hate it styling. I like the rotary, but I never warmed up to the RX-8's styling.
If the styling was toned down and the engine was shared with the NC, then it might have had better sales.
Like the Frisby twins did.
Jus' Sayin'
Two less seats and an engine with pistons and the RX8 would have been the Miata I wanted.
Keith Tanner wrote: Sorry, I thought they were a hatch. I really don't pay any attention to them at all. So it's got the same kind of hatchback as the Frisbee twins then...
IMHO, the problem with the Rx-8 was that it was an awkward, in-between size. It was too heavy for the motor they put in it, but the back seats were too small and the suicide doors too hard to use to be really useful as a sedan. The lousy fuel economy (right as gas prices started shooting up, of course) didn't help, nor did the reputation for 60K mile motors.
In reply to Mitchell: Its very true.
Like many sports cars the RX-8 had decent initial sales. I think the concept made sense, most people reject sports cars due to lack of practicality. They tried to make it more practical, while retaining the feel and performance goods, but it probably wasn't enough.
I don't think the RX-8 had excessive weight at ~2900-3000lbs. Name another car that seems more weight appropriate for its size class? NC was 4-500lbs less. The RX-8 weighed less than a Boxster and less to more than a Cayman (options depending) with an the engine made similar power to the base 2.7L. The FRS weighs ~1-200lbs less. I think the need to rev tar out of an engine was a bit of a turn off to a some potential buyers.
Mind if I ask, "what the **** is a Frisbee twin" ???
The RX8 was a failure because it was different. We (us here) like different, most people don't. Yes, it had other issues as previously mentioned but primarily it was weird and different. It was a car that required a certain level of owner participation to maintain and that's exactly what most owners don't want. I like rotaries, I have a RX7. So I know. But it's weird and different with special needs.
einy wrote: Mind if I ask, "what the **** is a Frisbee twin" ???
Subaru BRZ and Scion FRS.
FRS/BRZ. Frisbee is about the only way you could pronounce that.
On paper, the RX-8 was what people ask for.
The Miata needs a rotary! The Miata needs more space! The Miata needs to be a coupe!
I'm not sure that the motor would have fit under the bonnet, but I can pretty well guarantee that the Mazdaspeed 3 motor would have transformed that car into a sales success. Personally I love rotarys, but 120 more ft. pounds of torque is pretty damn profound.
Keith Tanner wrote: On paper, the RX-8 was what people ask for.
If it had the turbo MZR engine, it would have been much closer to what people were asking for.
Back on the original topic: the ND with a hardtop interests me. I sold my NA with the hardtop because it wasn't a great CAR. It was a fun car, for sure, but it leaked, smelled, rattled, was uncomfortable on long trips and was actually hard for me to get into and out of since it sat about 3" off the ground.
I'll get a manual with an LSD if it is offered.
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