Sounds like something bad just happened at Lime Rock...

fasted58 wrote: According to Jalopnik.com....

Since when is Jalopnik a credible source of anything?

itsarebuild wrote: The difference is these kids parents are probably going to sue someone for what this "accident" costs them. My dad would have made me write an apology letter while I healed And made me mow everyone's lawn during every dry day lot moment of every weekend to earn money to repair the crashed carts. Big difference....

Big difference I agree. I dunno if I would condemn what anyone is 'probably' going to do at this point though. I will save my judgement for when it is all said and done.

For now, a few kids took a big chance and got caught. Let's hope they recover (physically and mentally), they are probably automotive enthusiasts after all...

If the kids spend the next two years mowing the track grass every week for free, then they would be invited to my parties (after they turn 21 of course). If instead they are suing the track for something, I likely wouldn't invite them.

I'd much rather my kids took chances like this than chances on other things - hard drugs being one example.

if kids stole my karts and damaged one, they are going to jail. Lifestar or not. Theft is theft.

bludroptop wrote:

fasted58 wrote: According to Jalopnik.com....

Since when is Jalopnik a credible source of anything?

They used to be good, but as soon as Nick Denton gobbled them up, they've been terrible.

I guess two of them learned their lesson.

I think this idea that "the good old days" meant you could get away with crimes is sad. The victims of those good old days probably still don't look back with fond memories of getting shafted or losing their savings repairing what some teenagers had fun with.

Yes they don't have to go to prison or youth home. Maybe required to work at the park for the next two years. Hope the parents have a good plan to correct this behavior too.

Somebody's kid, who made a bad decision, is in bad enough shape to be airlifted to the hospital. Yet some people are more concerned with passing judgement on both the parents and kids, and damage to a couple of karts.

At least Kreb isn't the only other person who actually remembers remembers the stupid and dangerous things every one of us has done at least once in our life, that could have gone very badly had luck been any less on our side such that the series of events occurred even slightly differently.

Yes the kids did something illegal and stupid, and yes they deserve some sort of consequences...But they certainly don't deserve what happened to them, nor the callous commentary of keyboard authorities who are so caught up in their own self-righteousness that they lack any sense of empathy, and my thoughts go out to the families involved. Hopefully the kids have a fully recovery, learn a valuable life-long lesson, take responsibility for their actions, and make restitution to the track.

Kreb wrote: To be clear, I'm not sanctioning anything. Just saying that being sanctimonious about it may be a tad hypocritical. Put another way, if they hadn't crashed, how many of us would have thought "cool!"?

Sanctimonious my ass.

This ain't the 60's or 70's where the cops would make ya pour your beer out or scarf your bag of weed. Serious E36 M3 these days... and for a good berkeleying reason. Me and my buds back then all had our share of bent sheetmetal for one reason or another, hoonin' and/ or alcohol. Some were 'pranksters' as you say. That's called trespassing, theft or even B&E, considering. We did some berkeleying crazy E36 M3 back then... and for the most part got away with it. Some penance was required but we berkeleying learned, well most of us anyway. Ain't gonna happen in today's world, they don't berkeley around anymore. Law enforcement is by the book unless you're very well connected, that's been proven to failure here too.

30 something girl at work lost her license for 18 months over a DUI, still drives tho. If she gets caught she'll do a mandatory 6 months in jail. She'll lose her good paying job, most likely lose custody of her two kids and lose her apartment. They don't berkeley around no more.

We had a absolute berkeleying blast growin' up, did a little damage along the way, nobody got hurt... well, not too bad anyway and lawyers were never involved. I ain't been no saint. Yea, have to admit I cherish some of those crazy times.... but we learned. We matured or were just lucky I 'spose.

Maybe it was our generation who brought about the changes today w/ our antics... and who ain't been there to some degree.

Word is out, ain't nobody gettin' breaks, kid stuff ain't kid stuff no more. Reign yourself and your kids in or suffer the consequences.

Driven5 wrote: Somebody's kid, who made a bad decision, is in bad enough shape to be airlifted to the hospital. Yet some people are more concerned with passing judgement on both the parents and kids, and damage to a couple of karts.

Turning the other cheek equates to legal precedence for when the next person does this... Limerock and Endurance karting MUST throw the book at them.

Edit: I'm also a parent and you better be damn sure that if my kids got caught(or didn't and I found out) doing this they would They would be made to pay. There is no excuses for this sort of behavior.

In reply to fasted58:

I disagree. All kids still do some kind of stupid E36 M3. Always have, always will. Maybe overall not as much of it and/or not as stupid...But a largely overlooked problem with the 'changing times' is with the ever increasing number of adults who are ignorant enough to think they can force (through strict rules and disproportionately harsh punishments) a change to the inherent biology of humans that prevents children and teens from thinking like adults.

There's a difference. Stupid E36 M3 is stupid E36 M3, but this is illegal E36 M3. I'm all for learning from experiences, but not when it puts the lives and/or property of others in danger, or breaks the law.

Driven5 wrote: inherent biology of humans

Wow.. so you're effectively saying EVERYONE does this sort of thing? Please provide proof.

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine:

Must be nice up there on that pedestal. That's not actually how our legal system is designed to work though.

Also, please feel free to provide proof of any adult who has never done anything illegal, dangerous, or stupid in their lifetime.

The world is a lot different today than even 20 years ago. I'm sure all of us on here have done our share of stupid crap. I know I did. One story comes to mind:

A bunch of friends and I went to an abandoned light bulb assembly building in town after school one day that was near my friend's house. The building was not roped off or caged in; just a simple NO TRESPASSING sign on the gate. All of my friends wanted to get on the roof, which was accessible by climbing on some old rickety wire spools, but I declined. After calling me some names for not joining them, they thought it would be smart to try and jump off the roof onto a hill that was close to the backside of the building. I went out back to watch. 3 friends successfully made the leap, but my last friend was unsure he would make it. Peer pressure prevailed, and he jumped and landed awkwardly on the hillside and instantly snapped both of his ankles! Someone in a nearby house must have heard the screams, because the police were waiting for us in minutes on the other side of the building.

Blah, blah, blah, so what? Well, we got a stern talking to by the police on why going into abandoned buildings and jumping off the roof is a dumb idea, they carted my friend off to the hospital, and we all got grounded by our angry parents. No one sued, no one went to the media, and we all learned that doing stupid things is not always the best idea. And even if they DID sue, the judge would laugh because there was a clearly posted sign stating NO TRESPASSING right on the gate. Today, a kid's parents would own half the town if that scenario happened, sign or not.

I hope that Lime Rock doesn't get punished for this, but in today's world, they probably will.

Driven5 wrote: ...Yes the kids did something illegal and stupid, and yes they deserve some sort of consequences...But they certainly don't deserve what happened to them

Everyone wants free speech, free will, and freedom to do what they want, but many of those same people won't accept the consequences of thier actions. I agree that we're wrong to be judging, but to say they "don't deserve what happened" doesn't fit. Action A had Consequence B, a basic rule of nature and physics. They made a choice and there were consequences, with no "deserving" involved.

It's like motorcyclists who complain about helmet laws and wear the bare minumum in protest. Do they "deserve" head injuries when they go down? Their actions have consequences.

Driven5 wrote: In reply to Fueled by Caffeine: Must be nice up there on that pedestal. That's not actually how our legal system works though.

All I have is my experience as a parent and a former child. If you make a mistake, you pay for such mistakes. That's how I grew up.

I'm sorry the kids got hurt, but they created this problem and while they need some love to help them through this.. They must learn their lesson.

Remember this kid: http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/05/us/texas-affluenza-teen/

This will be like when a toddler drowns in a neighbors pool. Lime Rock will get sued for creating an "attractive nuisance".

Some kids, who are probably good kids, did something very stupid on, and with, someone else's property. Unfortunately, the didn't just get caught, but a couple of them got hurt badly enough to incur some major medical expenses. Now, maybe these kids have good solid parents who would ground them for the next five years and make them cover the damage they've done. Those solid parents might have medical insurance to cover those huge expenses. Whether or not those parents blame Lime Rock, those insurance companies are going to look for someone else to fund those helicopter rides. It's the insurance company's attorneys who are going to make the sue/don't-sue call.

This is a bad day for Lime Rock and everyone who loves it.

And I doubt that anyone involved with the track wants to see those kids mowing the lawn there. I'm sure they'd prefer that they never set foot near the property again. Forget the idea of inviting them in to operate power equipment.

Driven5 wrote: In reply to Fueled by Caffeine: Must be nice up there on that pedestal. That's not actually how our legal system is designed to work though. Also, please feel free to provide proof of any adult who has never done anything illegal, dangerous, or stupid in their lifetime.

I'd nominate my wife, except she violated the third item when she said "yes" to me!

etifosi wrote:

Driven5 wrote: In reply to Fueled by Caffeine: Must be nice up there on that pedestal. That's not actually how our legal system is designed to work though. Also, please feel free to provide proof of any adult who has never done anything illegal, dangerous, or stupid in their lifetime.

I'd nominate my wife, except she violated the third item when she said "yes" to me!

same for my wife. She dosen't even speed. Catholics.. To get drunk as an underage college kid she drove to canada where it was legal at the time.. HA.

I was raised old school by my Southern Gentleman grandfather.
He always said "If its not yours keep your hands off". Seemed simple enough for me.

Driven5 wrote: But they certainly don't deserve what happened to them

Whoa, really? So real consequences that really happened in real life, just now, were somehow unfair?

In reply to Driven5:

My 21 year old son, currently at college, has never even had a parking ticket.

In reply to Woody:

Time for 5 sets of scizzors

tuna55 wrote:

Driven5 wrote: But they certainly don't deserve what happened to them

Whoa, really? So real consequences that really happened in real life, just now, were somehow unfair?

plus eleventy majillion.

Fueled by Caffeine wrote:

tuna55 wrote:

Driven5 wrote: But they certainly don't deserve what happened to them

Whoa, really? So real consequences that really happened in real life, just now, were somehow unfair?

plus eleventy majillion.

Squared! They did x and got y. Stating reality doesn't mean I am not sympathetic. Still they suffered one of the potential outcomes of their actions. I hope they get better with no permanent damage and the families are not harassed and that lime rock gets some funding from their insurance and local donations to recover any damage costs incurred.