Maybe they just made the automatics first then ran out of components while building the manuals.
Maybe they just made the automatics first then ran out of components while building the manuals.
What the other guy buys is not your concern
Appleseed said:What the other guy buys is not your concern
But what I'm trying to buy is.
This is nuts - I'm in the market for a new car. Worst time to be in the market for a new car but I have zero bills outside of a mortgage and in the process of selling my Techno E36 M3 and the twins were on my list. Really sad to hear this and the fact that so many of the Toyotas are Auto.
I have a close friend of mine who actually wants an auto and is looking for one at the moment. This big brain scientist/engineer who has more money than he knows what to do with "Goes I don't need a manual to drive to and from work!" I said "Nathan, you have 3 other vehicles, you can afford many other types of vehicles that have better performance as an auto, why the BRZ/86?" His response "They look great and Toyota/Subaru reliability is the best!" --- To each their own.
In reply to DirtyBird222 :
At least you have the theoretical option of having the transmission you want. Toyota and Subaru are making zero cars with manual steering, and steering feel is kind of the point of having a rear drive car (for me)
At least it should be fairly easy to depower the rack, if it doesn't throw the computers to a tizzy.
I wonder if this will push folks to buy a Miata instead.
The other option is to order one in June for an October delivery. Doesn't help get one immediately but is an option.
Why you would want to fly the A model of anything makes this pilot shudder.
Appleseed said:Why you would want to fly the A model of anything makes this pilot shudder.
Cars, though... the first model is the Vision and the later ones get focus-grouped to death.
I mean, for every Fiero and Corvair there are MR2s and RX-7s where the first series was the best and the mid-generation update softens and defuns them.
Everything thing i have read or watched regarding the new generation twins have indicated they are better than the 1st gens in pretty much every way.
In reply to pimpm3 (Forum Supporter) :
Well it is a new generation and not the midyear update I was complaining about (that even the 1st gen suffered from, when they somewhat tuned out the torque hole that made them fun to drive) but we'll see what they do to screw this up.
I can concur. Finally got enough miles to rip on it. Well.....I can agree that it's better than gen 1. In reality, there is not a ton mechanically that changed outside the motor. But man, did that change the feeling of the car. It just makes it a really solid car. I like it so much better than the 1st gen.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:Appleseed said:Why you would want to fly the A model of anything makes this pilot shudder.
Cars, though... the first model is the Vision and the later ones get focus-grouped to death.
I mean, for every Fiero and Corvair there are MR2s and RX-7s where the first series was the best and the mid-generation update softens and defuns them.
Focus groups suck the fun right out of everything. The two-tiered Civic dashboards from the 8th and 9th generations were amazing. Focus groups complained they were too complicated and spaceshippy. Then the 10th and 11th gen have terribly designed dash and instrument layouts.
I think the whole "A Model" argument doesn't carry as much weight as it used to. There's so much tech transfer from one generation to another that unless something revolutionary is happening in the A model you won't have the worries like there used to be. Although, there are a lot of grumblings about issues with the new Tundra V6TT.
Airframes though, yea, don't put be on the X or A models please.
In reply to DirtyBird222 :
While not platform threatening, the 2013 and 2014 BRZ/FR-S had issues like cooking the coil packs that my 2015 did not. If the engine as a whole, is a carryover from before, even a different model, I'd sweat less. But there are always pitfalls being an early adopter.
Look at it this way: if you got a 22, you get exclusiveness, if you wait, you get fixes to problems that may arise.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:In reply to pimpm3 (Forum Supporter) :
Well it is a new generation and not the midyear update I was complaining about (that even the 1st gen suffered from, when they somewhat tuned out the torque hole that made them fun to drive) but we'll see what they do to screw this up.
They also changed the rear end gearing in 17+ models.
But I can't really ever remember reading anyone enjoying the torque dip. And I owned a tuned '15 BRZ from new to 35k miles. Around town it was incredibly annoying. I'm not trying to drive on surface streets in 2nd/3rd gear to keep the RPMs up over 4500 when just putting around.
I'm looking forward to driving the new one that has more torque and a much lower peak, and much fatter and flatter torque curve.
Well, If anyone is in the Omaha area let me know and I'll toss you the keys for a drive.
Appleseed,
I jumped on it as there has been talks that they are not going to carry the 2nd gen for that long. The response so far may be changing that talk track. I figured if in 6-12 months, I didn't like it I would probably get most of not all of my money back on it.
That's another upside to this insane car market. Good thinking.
Appleseed said:In reply to DirtyBird222 :
While not platform threatening, the 2013 and 2014 BRZ/FR-S had issues like cooking the coil packs that my 2015 did not. If the engine as a whole, is a carryover from before, even a different model, I'd sweat less. But there are always pitfalls being an early adopter.
Look at it this way: if you got a 22, you get exclusiveness, if you wait, you get fixes to problems that may arise.
That is true but then there are times when companies like Honda again, changed the final drive in the last year of the 2020 the Si to make it feel slightly quicker. More people complained about that because 0-60 now required 3 gears and the AutoXers hated it.
Quick caveat before starting. Having started driving in the UK in the 80's, I used to be the most anti automatic person on the planet believing the only excuse to own an auto was if you were missing the requisite limbs to operate a 'real car'. But having been here for closing in on 30 years and seen a) the increase in power and torque for even the most basic of transport, b) the increase in the number of gears in a regular auto go from 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 and onto even 7, 8 and 9 speeds, and c) the improvement in electronic control and 'faked' DSG type gear changes with modern autos and torque convertors. These days I am a big defender of automatics in general, hell even the beater Boxster is an auto and for the first time ever there are no running manuals in the fleet. Having said that, if I ever order a Frisbee (not beyond the realms of possibility) it would certainly have three pedals.
Since there seems to be about 4:1 availability on existing unsold Frisbees Auto:manual, people might not want to automatically discount the automatic!! Has anyone watched the GRM video review of the new 2022 BRZ? They were sent an auto from the press fleet and considered not even taking it to the track, but they did and were, for a traditionally torque convertor auto, very very complimentary about it's behavior. It would interesting to hear some of the staff who drove it, to give some more feedback.
Slef hotlink from GRM to YouTube back to a GRM video: https://youtu.be/Fch6-FpTOS0
In reply to Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) :
I'm with you 100% I will defend DCT/DSG gearboxes, I loved the DCT in my 135i. Well I loved it 94% of the time, when you're hammering them they are great, but around town they can be bothersome.
But my next fun car will absolutely be a manual.
Bad programming can ruin any automatic. I didn't mind the 700R4 in my '87 IROC so much, especially since it had a shift kit, a Corvette servo and was behind a big torque engine. But in my 2012 4cyl Colorado the 700R4 descendent is terrible. The programming is clearly done to make up for the fact that it was a 4-speed auto trying to make 2010s emissions and MPG requirements in a truck.
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