There is something to be said for old-school mechanical mechanisms and feedback.

Like knowing for sure if your car is in Park based on the position of the gearshift.

http://consumerist.com/2016/02/08/more-than-100-crashes-caused-by-confusing-jeep-chrysler-dodge-gear-shifters/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

I guess this is confusing:

Audi's ZF version:

BMW's mess:

Someone who's license should be revoked said: “When I put the car into ‘park,’ it pops into reverse,” the owner of a Chrysler 300 writes in a complaint. “Then I hit the engine off button, but since it is in reverse, the engine stays on. Then I open the door to get out, thinking the engine is off and the car is in ‘park,’ and it starts rolling backward. This has happened six times.”

I'm a FIRM believer that the more nannys modern cars have, the more stupid drivers become. I get blinded by high beams in the daylight EVERY SINGLE DAY. I attribute it to automatic lights turning people retarded.

So I don't understand. Are the vehicles indicating they are in park when they are not,(which would obviously be a real issue) or are the owners believing they put it in park but they did not, or are people just too stupid to realize that you need to make sure the vehicle is in park before you open the fricken door and get out. The person says it's happened 6 times. So, they've never noticed that an engine makes some amount of noise when it's running and none when it's off? And this has happened 6 times??? GAAHAHHHHHHHH!

Totally agreed: modern safety nannies are contributing to stupidity.

I have a '14 Grand Cherokee, and I'll admit it's kind of stupid. The shifter moves through the positions but pops back to center. You never truly get a feel of where the positions are located. I'll miss a 'Drive' to 'Reverse' and hit park maybe once a week. Since I back into my driveway from a very quiet road it hasn't been much of an issue, but if I was trying to back in somewhere under traffic pressure, I'd probably bitch about it. The shift feeling is not a very firm one and although there is a bit of a 'bump' in the movement it's not very affirming.

I have not hit anything yet, so I got that going for me, which is nice.

Every time I see more "help the morons that can't drive" nannies added to new cars (and more mandated by the government), I become more convinced that there's very few cars made in this millennium (and even fewer after the mid 2000s) that I'll ever be willing to own. And I get more and more scared to let anyone else drive anything of mine (even the soccer-mom Jeep, as so many people can't be trusted to handle a RWD V8 with no traction control, ABS, etc.) And I'm not even a cranky old guy yet!

Six times is a bit excessive, but the way I read it is that it is a kind of wobble stick that doesn't have distinct positions for Park, Drive, etc. You just tap it forward or back and the computer puts the transmission where it thinks you want it.

Brett_Murphy wrote: Six times is a bit excessive, but the way I read it is that it is a kind of wobble stick that doesn't have distinct positions for Park, Drive, etc. You just tap it forward or back and the computer puts the transmission where it thinks you want it.

The bigger issue is that the guy pushed the button and didn't notice that the engine failed to shut off. It's like he was just going through the motions wearing a blindfold and ear plugs

If you go slow you can definitely feel the 'detent' for each position but if you move it with any bit of hustle, you can land anywhere in the direction you're pushing. Honestly, I'd rather have a push button, if they didn't want to give a real shifter with actual positions.

In reply to rslifkin:

You sound like me, the newest car I've owned was a 2001 vw and I sold it because it was too frivolous for me, I now daily a car that is 6 years older than me.

Another thing, cars these days are too quiet! So I can kinda understand when people don't know if it's running or not but also, ever notice how these days when the traffic light turns green people are real slow to go? I also theorize that to because modern cars are so quieter people don't hear other cars leaving (like two or three ahead) and take longer. That and cell phone distraction but I swear it's because everyone needs straight pipes!

The Ram ZF 8HP shifter:

I wonder if has any tactile feedback when shifting? I haven't driven one yet.

My Jeep has a real shifter, like God intended:

Maybe dodge just wants to recreate the old push button dash shifter ( it was Chrysler who had that right?)

I like the Mercedes system. If the driver's door opens, the transmission shifts to Park.

Even if you're rolling at the time. With your head out the doorframe so you can see how you're aligned on a drive on lift.

I don't know what hurt more, my head hitting the A-pillar or the sensation of the drivetrain finding the limits of all of its stops as it slammed into Park and then bounced back and forth a few cycles.

(this offer only applicable for sarcastic levels of "like")

rslifkin wrote:

Brett_Murphy wrote: Six times is a bit excessive, but the way I read it is that it is a kind of wobble stick that doesn't have distinct positions for Park, Drive, etc. You just tap it forward or back and the computer puts the transmission where it thinks you want it.

The bigger issue is that the guy pushed the button and didn't notice that the engine failed to shut off. It's like he was just going through the motions wearing a blindfold and ear plugs

It's probably got auto-stop-start, so the engine isn't running. It just automatically starts up again when you take your foot off the brake.

Or burn all the automatics, then when people forget to take it out of gear before they get out it just lurches 6in and dies

On our '14 T&C, there are no labels next to the actual shifter positions, just on the dash display. Call me old-school(or just old), but when I change the gears I look at the shifter to see what position it's in. Because it's not the typical PRNDL(LL...) of the olden-days, I do get confused sometimes on what gear it's in - like when I'm distracted by...well pretty much anything. Also, the fact it's a zig-zag pattern, instead of straight with detents, makes it easy to shift it upward toward Park, but end up in reverse.

So I do tend to agree that it's a potential problem - luckily I think I'd notice the van was moving before I actually stepped out of it though.

From the article: “My wife parked the car and had exited the vehicle, when after about 30 seconds it rolled forward and struck headstones in a cemetery. The car still indicated it was in ‘park’ when my son reentered the vehicle.”

So taken at face value at least in this instance, this is not a "stupid operator" issue but a "car not going into park even though it is told to and claims to have gone into park."

I mean, it's a Chrysler product under Fiat ownership, who would have ever thought that a fully electronic transmission shifter would malfunction?

More seriously, file this under "transmissions I never want to own." And also under "dculberson uses too many quotation marks."

I blame it on the demise of the column shifter.

chiodos wrote: I'm a FIRM believer that the more nannys modern cars have, the more stupid drivers become. I get blinded by high beams in the daylight EVERY SINGLE DAY. I attribute it to automatic lights turning people retarded.

Yup, give them an inch and they'll take a mile. I wonder if rear endings (and when the system works, the sound of screeching tires) will go up now that cheaper cars are getting auto braking systems. We'll probably see semi truck wheel bolt pattern sized circles on car doors more often when auto lane keeping gets common.

stanger_missle wrote: I guess this is confusing: BMW's mess:

I had a rental BMW this past week that had this shifter. Definitely takes some getting used to, but it very definitely tells you with a warning chime and display that the car isn't in park before trying to shut it off.

Oh and cars tend not to move if you apply the parking break, even if you are an idiot and leave them in drive.. Berk me, no one seems to know what a parking brake is anymore.

chiodos wrote: Maybe dodge just wants to recreate the old push button dash shifter ( it was Chrysler who had that right?)

Yep, it was Chrysler. IIRC American Motors had it too in the early 60s.

The Chrysler rotory knob is fairly intuitive. I found it followed muscle memory pretty well.

Pretty much dont give a sh#@t. If it has a steering wheel and it runs, I`ll drive it

My wife asked me the other day if I would ever buy a car without a manual transmission. I should show her the linked article.

My wife's Prius has Toyota's unconventional shifter that springs back to a center point after you select a gear. You have to press a separate button to get park. I have, on couple of occasions, been in the wrong gear and started to go backward when I intended to forward.

We both adopted the habit of engaging the parking brake as soon we are stopped where we intend to be.