Think Honda has Lost its Way?

In reply to 93EXCivic:

But is it badass as the badass Focus ST? See, that's the question! And if so, is it more badass than the yet to be released Focus RS? You have to answer these questions if you want to enter this black hole of a thread.

bravenrace wrote: But is it badass as the badass Focus ST? See, that's the question! And if so, is it more badass than the yet to be released Focus RS? You have to answer these questions if you want to enter this black hole of a thread.

I'm not badass enough to read this thread anymore...

In reply to Ian F:

I'm very sorry. The door is this way...

bravenrace wrote: In reply to 93EXCivic: But is it badass as the badass Focus ST? See, that's the question! And if so, is it more badass than the yet to be released Focus RS? You have to answer these questions if you want to enter this black hole of a thread.

They put the proper numbers of doors on it so duh.

bravenrace wrote: In reply to Knurled: "Why would I want a Civic when I could get a Focus ST, which is an altogether nicer car inside, outside, and in the driver's seat?" So what does that mean? Are you saying that it means you were comparing the Civic to the RS? Then why did you say ST? Please tell me how that works?

I was comparing the ST to the Civic. Unless Honda has changed by leaps and bounds, even a base model Focus feels and drives stellar compared to a Civic. They grabbed a bunch of European genetics when they were involved with all those Euro companies. Hondas still feel like chintzy Japanese crud. Maybe it's fast Japanese crud but it is still crud.

I brought up the RS only to point out that the ST isn't Ford's biggest gun, it's merely one of them. Sort of like comparing the 5.0 GT against the M3 then pointing out that the 5.0 GT isn't even the highest performance Mustang.

Cigar just a cigar, and all that.

Tactical Penguin wrote:

bravenrace wrote: In reply to Tactical Penguin: I don't know you, so I can't say for sure, but I have a feeling that no, you couldn't.

You lack imagination AND a sense of humor.

There is even a Ford Transit that could probably beat that civic.....

Wake me up when the next generation civic comes out. Maybe then I'll be interested. Honestly, the most recently launched Honda I'd buy would be the EP3 Si. That thing was great.

That track time is pretty amazing, especially for a FWD hot hatch. But, will magazine writers, editors, and us car enthusiasts think it's more fun than the Focus ST or Fiesta ST?

I thought this was a thread about a Civic....

Silly me.

I'm sure that it's typical Honda development, just a bit slower due to backing off from performance cars in late 2008 due to the economic crisis.

Personally I don't care if it is better than the Focus ST, as I would like to have either one...after the RS.

yamaha wrote:

Tactical Penguin wrote: There is even a Ford Transit that could probably beat that civic.....

yeah... one with Jaguar XJ220 underpinnings........

yamaha wrote:

Tactical Penguin wrote:

bravenrace wrote: In reply to Tactical Penguin: I don't know you, so I can't say for sure, but I have a feeling that no, you couldn't.

You lack imagination AND a sense of humor.

There is even a Ford Transit that could probably beat that civic.....

I doubt it. The XJ220 had a time of 7:43. Add that extra height and weight and I would be surprised if that broke 7:50.

If F1 is any indication, then yes, Honda is off its game.

So is it just me or do all of the newest Civic Type R reviews sound like fluff pieces? I don't mean to say the car is not great, but they all have the same message - stupid fast and engaging. But none of the reviews discuss any real comparisons with the competition or any performance figures beyond published data. Did Honda get these guys to agree to only discuss certain topics because it is still preproduction? I am waiting on some bonafide side by side comparisons. I suspect this car will win some of these comparos, but the current coverage seems a bit thin to the point of sounding evasive.

Can someone help Honda's design department 'find it's way'?
It's a crying shame to make so fun a car so ugly.