Time to shoot for an overall win.

The last two years, a group of us have prepared and run a 98 and a 2000 Integra for the Edmonton Chumpcar race. 1-3 in class A last year in the 24, 1-2 in A both 12 hour days this year. Overall, the 2000 has two seconds and a third, the 98 two thirds and a 6th. We run up front on hard driving, reliability and gas mileage- this year we had a minimum required pit time of 25 minutes, we were there for 26.

The new Chump rules have just lowered the Integra price from $400 to $225, which opens up some prep points. We currently have front camber adjusters and coilovers on orange Konis, plus urethane bushings everywhere. I forget, but its only around $40 prep bucks per car, leaving us about $200 to spend.

We run 1:39-1:40's for the full 2 hour stints with 20-25 minutes of fuel left, both cars can run 1:37's if beaten with a pointy stick. The winning cars generally average 1:36-1:37's, but are capable of running 1:32's...but not for a full 2 hours.

So, then, to the math. Junkyard turbo? K24 swap? How much horsepower, on a track that sees us in 2nd gear three times, and to 6000 rpm in 4th once, do we need to (or can we afford to) gain to be able to comfortably run 1:36's without running into gas mileage and reliability issues?

Or do we spend our money on handling and bigger tires? I think its pretty optimistic to find 4 seconds per lap with sway bars...

It's always easier to pass with power versus handling

Dyno the car as is. If you're putting down less than 120 to the wheels, than go k24 swap. I wouldn't go turbo as you have a reliable finishing car without cooling issues. If you're north of 130hp to the wheels I'd focus on suspension and more rubber.

In reply to captdownshift:

I'll 1up that to torque, instead of horsepower. A Honda needs displacement. I agree with no turbo. Get bored out or bump the torque curve with cams. Or swap to a b20.

I've never understood the chump thing....you have a $200 budget and a K swap is an option?

I'll gladly trailer my miata out for this mythical $200 kswap.

kevlarcorolla wrote: I've never understood the chump thing....you have a $200 budget and a K swap is an option? I'll gladly trailer my miata out for this mythical $200 kswap.

No dollar signs.

They have 200 points to play with.

There is no dollar value associated with chumpcar any longer.

What about the various Honda V6 engines, which should be cheaper? More power is more power.

Is there anywhere you can still shed weight? That will get you better everything (acceleration, handling, fuel economy). Is there a maximum stint length (2 hours)? If so it sounds like you can carry less fuel weight.

For the sake of reliability, i'd consider b20 swaps. They're cheap and shouldn't bring into question the reliability of the rest of the components in the engine bay which you already know to be good.

The chump integra to beat in my neck of the woods belongs to Simon Says racing. It's a B20 bottom, B16 head swap (non-VTEC). They have the total package it takes to when one of these things, but the car is no slouch.

wvumtnbkr wrote:

kevlarcorolla wrote: I've never understood the chump thing....you have a $200 budget and a K swap is an option? I'll gladly trailer my miata out for this mythical $200 kswap.

No dollar signs. They have 200 points to play with. There is no dollar value associated with chumpcar any longer.

Not exactly true from what I'm seeing. It looks like the points are still representative of dollars. According to the "Major Component Swap Sheet" the average of 10 lowest car-part.com "A Grade" prices is the cost of your engine, transmission, and differential. Add in the cost of all other items required to complete the swap, and subtract out the value of the parts removed. Finally, add surcharges of $50 for an engine swap, $25 for a transmission swap, and $25 for a differential swap. And if you mix/match heads on your swap, there appears to be another 150 point assessment. That calculates the point assessment...So unless you're finding at least 10 "A Grade" engines on car-part.com for <$150 more than the current engine goes for, I still don't see how any of these swaps can be completed for only 200 points under the current rules.

I'm not sure where the 150$ comes from in your example.

Swap just the engine and it is a 50 pt hit. As long as your engine out is more expensive than the engine in.

Most swapped cars use the stock trans and diff.

You are right about dollar signs being present in the swap rules. However, this is going to change in the near future.

Are all of your drivers capable of getting the most out of the car? If you can increase the slowest 2 guys average pace by 1 second without buying anything at all.. It's money well spent.

I'm not sure where the 150$ comes from in your example.

That's the 200pt said to be available minus the automatic 50pt hit from the engine swap.

wvumtnbkr wrote: As long as your engine out is more expensive than the engine in.

Easier said than done...Especially in this case.

.

Vigo wrote:

I'm not sure where the 150$ comes from in your example.

That's the 200pt said to be available minus the automatic 50pt hit from the engine swap.

Correct. Of course, in the particular case of a B to K swap it also requires a transmission swap, among other cost (point) adding items...And a differential swap, depending on how they count it on FWD cars.

Deems like a h22 with a h2b adapter is the way to go. Cheap engines and the ability to keep the stock transmission... An easy 200+ hp eith lot of torque. Or just install a vtec head?

Huckleberry wrote: Are all of your drivers capable of getting the most out of the car? If you can increase the slowest 2 guys average pace by 1 second without buying anything at all.. It's money well spent.

Well, the obvious answer there, since we are not Kyle Busch, is no. As club racers, though we are all pretty good. The toughest part, to be honest, is remaining focused enough to hit your marks for two hours straight. An hour and a half in, my mind wants to wander, and I start to find myself in the wrong gear here and there. I worked on that pretty hard this year

physician wrote: Deems like a h22 with a h2b adapter is the way to go. Cheap engines and the ability to keep the stock transmission... An easy 200+ hp eith lot of torque. Or just install a vtec head?

This is a timely post. I had a Civic waiting at the shop for me to get around to caging, and when I opened the hood, its got an H22 in it, with a 14.8 dial in on the windshield. That's got to be 2 seconds faster than a B18... It has Hasport mounts, so obviously not a straight boltin, but can it use the B18 transmission?