Nugi
Nugi Reader
11/21/19 6:44 p.m.

Are there any guides/books/posts/builds/rules-of-thumb for suspension tuning a top-heavy car/cuv/suv for hard driving? Anyone drive one on the track? Have knowledge about a good setup for a particular suv? Lets assume the easy-mode of lowering the thing is not an option (not even with low profile tires), and a high center of gravity is a fact-of-life. 

The usual trade-offs seem a bit different than I am used to... do you stiffen suspension or does that lead to rollover? Springs or swaybars? Promote oversteer? Some guys suggest heavy wide wheels, while others say to keep skinny to promote skids before rolls... This is new territory for me, I am used to the roll-center being underground, or damn close. 

Should I start looking at whatever porsche is doing with their suvs? Baja/rally/trophytruck guys? Just start buying springs and trying it out? Everything I am finding just repeats the obvious (lower! Stiffer! Wider?) and offers little insight for asphalt cornering. 

I live high in the colorado mountains, and my driving is 75% twisties, at speeds between 45-80, 10% rough unmaintained dirt roads at whatever speed keeps my teeth in my head, 15% 65mph straight highway crusing. Hence the somewhat odd stipulations.

High sidewall snows in winter are nice, and currently shod, but I would consider going +1, +2, etc if ride height is maintained. I can jack up one side to find the balance point for calculations if needed. Just looking for a good starting point. I have my suspicions, but would like to hear from someone who might actually know. 

Any general info is appreciated, even if it may not directly apply to my situation, if it can help some other suv/cuv/truck/lifted miata drivers enjoy themselves more.

rslifkin
rslifkin UltraDork
11/21/19 7:39 p.m.

First thing is to lower the center of gravity as much as you reasonably can.  Even little things like roof rack deletes are worth it.  Stiffen suspension and adjust it for handling balance as needed.  Wider track width (within the bounds of what you can do without causing steering geometry problems) is good. 

Let's look at my Jeep as an example.  Ride height is basically right at stock.  Better shocks, much stiffer springs (280 lb/in front compared to 190 stock, progressive in the rear, around 350 at ride height compared to 160 stock).  Deleted rear sway bar to get rid of suspension binding issue.  Bigger front sway bar.  Added a little camber up front to get more grip.  Wheel spacers for more track width (3/4" up front, 1" in the rear).  Summer wheels and tires are 255/60R17s on 17x8s with +10 offset compared to 16x7 +13 stock (so track width goes up an extra 1/4" for 1.75" wider up front, 2.25" wider in the rear).  Currently it's on Toyo Proxes T1 Sports.  Unfortunately for me, tire choices in that particular size are drying up. 

It's been off-road on that suspension and performed better than the stock suspension did at the same ride height.  Ride quality is stiff, but not particularly harsh.  Handling is much improved over stock, both in responsiveness and grip. 

As far as rollover risk, that's pretty much a matter of "don't be stupid with it."  That said, I've (unintentionally) had the tail quite far out at 60-ish mph on dirt and nothing got sketchy. 

ebonyandivory
ebonyandivory PowerDork
11/22/19 6:11 a.m.

The WIDTH of Baja/Trophy trucks is crazy. And their tire and wheel package, while being in the 40" range is allowed 20+ inches of travel with relatively little lift as the chassis is designed to swallow up the tires and the fenders are designed similarly.

Id think firming up the suspension, maybe poly bushings in the sway bars will help significantly. I can vouch for Bilstein 5100 shocks. I'm looking at 2" spacers but haven't bought them yet.

With a daily driver, my experience is lots of little tweaks add up. (2006 Sierra 4x4)

Duke
Duke MegaDork
11/22/19 8:58 a.m.

FuzzWuzzy
FuzzWuzzy HalfDork
11/22/19 8:58 a.m.

Just how crazy do you wanna get in to it?

If your SUV is relatively new, I can assume there's likely a nice and heavy sunroof/panoramic roof right above your head.

Beyond that, go with everything rslifkin just said haha.

Nugi
Nugi Reader
11/23/19 3:57 p.m.

No sunroof, car is a 1st gen 5-speed '4wd' CRV. Double wishbone/multilink (almost) fully adjustable suspension (basically a lifted 90s civic), and 15x6.5" wheels. I do a lot of driving around my local mountain towns with unimproved roads, replete with stream crossings and large runoff ruts. Original plan included mild lowering, etc, but the ground clearance turns out to be quite a useful (if not required) feature out here. As mentioned in the OP, not much can be done for the COG for my particular use case (excepting maybe ballast, f/r l/r distribution, etc) hence my bag of usual tricks in empty. 

Already have a selection of new rubber and urethane in the suspension, new sway links, proforged balljoints and tierods, new wheel bearings, steering rack rebuild and copied the alignment of my last integra. I have a toolkit stowed low in the unused wheelweel which seems to benefit balance a bit. Shocks and low offset wheels/spacers seem like the next logical conclusion I suppose. I am also pondering a bigger rear sway, of which I have a few options. I just wondered if there were any suspension geometrys, alignments, setups, or other trickery that might benefit cornering when cog is higher. 

Thanks for all the input so far. 

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