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Javelin
Javelin GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 4:00 p.m.

Has anybody else seen this yet? http://ultimatestreetcarassociation.com/

Looks like Optima is finally branching out their Invitational (which is for SEMA cars only, and was started as a way to prove they're not all hacked together non-runners) for everyone. For those unfamiliar, it's a road course, autocross, stop box, and road rally event (street livability) along with a concourse/engineering points area.

All years, makes, and models is very interesting. Obviously they want highly modified though. And they are coming to Portland in August!

So I guess the question is, do I step up the time frame on the 5's turbo install and lay waste with a minivan; or do I get my E36 M3 together and make a run at it in the Javelin?

Strike_Zero
Strike_Zero SuperDork
11/13/13 4:16 p.m.

Minivan

Hungary Bill
Hungary Bill GRM+ Memberand Dork
11/13/13 4:20 p.m.

Javelin

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
11/13/13 4:22 p.m.

Miniavelin?

ransom
ransom GRM+ Memberand UberDork
11/13/13 4:27 p.m.

I've just put it on the calendar... Curious to see what sort of stuff exists around here.

Would love to see either the Javelin or the 5 out there, but the Javelin is the clear favorite for me...

mad_machine
mad_machine GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 4:27 p.m.

this sounds like the contest that Sport Compact Car used to do.. so it lived on beyond the magazine?

Joe Gearin
Joe Gearin Associate Publisher
11/13/13 4:38 p.m.

I've just returned from the Optima Street Car Invitational--- held just after SEMA.

The builds were amazing! These are some very serious machines. Nearly all of the older American cars had Detroit Speed subframes, although a few may have had Schwartz underpinnings.

The road course portion would be the most difficult to contend in, as the top cars were ridiculously modified, and driven by near pro-level drivers. (Danny Popp won--- former UTCC Champion)

Where you may have a chance at making the biggest impact is on the autocross portion. Most of these guys are way slower than their cars are---especially at Auto-x. It was clear that most competitors didn't have much experience and there was a whole lotta sliding going on. That said, the winning 65 Corvette had 315 / 30 / 18 rubber at all four corners! and was well driven.

These cars are very real, very fast, and the drivers are catching up. You would have to build a complete monster to hold your own on the road course. The Auto-X competition on the other hand.......is very attainable.

It is a great movement, and GRM is getting involved. There is a lot we can teach these guys to make them faster.......and a lot they can teach us as well.

this has nothing to do with the old SCC contest. These are mostly pro-touring cars, with a Lambo, Porsche, BMW, Supra Turbo, Audi, or LS-powered Conquest thrown in for good measure.

icaneat50eggs
icaneat50eggs HalfDork
11/13/13 4:39 p.m.

Hmmm, no windshield or roof probably isn't what they are looking for but man I'd love to see what I can do performance wise against whatever shows up

Javelin
Javelin GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 4:56 p.m.
Strike_Zero wrote: Minivan

Seriously do-able. It's getting new suspension (Koni's) in the spring no matter what, and will be due for new tires anyway. If these guys do the same thing as OSCI or Goodguys, it will be 200TW (hello Ventus R-S3...). I already have crazy brakes. Theme would be easy, bolt the roof rack back on, keep the car seats in it, and grab a roll of woodgrain vinyl.

The hard part would be moving up my planned turbocharging swap. While an MS3-swap is theoretically the "easy button", the reality is the DFI isn't compatible with the 5, so you end up with a franken-dash (MS3 gauge pod), loss of a lot of the body control module functions, etc. I think a normal 3 turbo kit would still do very well (say, ~230-240 ish HP?) Curb weight is 3333 Lbs with 157 HP stock (21 Lbs/ HP). Figure 14-ish Lbs/HP after the turbo...

It would probably do well on the engineering (all custom kit), AX (it's a 3 and I rock at AX at PIR's E36 M3 surface), road rally (it is my DD), and the stop box (see brakes). It wouldn't do so hot on the road course (aero, heavyish, not much power even post-swap on a very power-heavy track).

Javelin
Javelin GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 5:00 p.m.
Hungary Bill wrote: Javelin

This one is more likely. The Javelin already runs great (when it's not cold out) and has a much better power/weight ratio. The problems would be traction and concourse. I have the old set of FR500's of the P71 (17x9 and 17x10.5) that I will be putting tires on anyway, and an Explorer 8.8 rear swap would give me 3.55's (over the current 2.73's), an LSD (over the current peg-leg), and rear discs (drums now). I'd need to completely solve the braking issues (likely a bad booster and/or m/c) and get the cosmetics up more.

AX would be the big issue with the slow steering box. I can get a much faster unit from a late 70's T/A to solve that. The suspension, while it will be all new, will still be all stock. Might have to change that. I can probably get some shorter/stiffer front springs, and add torque-links to the rear. Honestly, looser is better at PIR for AX.

Now if I can get it painted before then, I'd be in really good shape for some coverage/excitement...

icaneat50eggs
icaneat50eggs HalfDork
11/13/13 5:17 p.m.

Are there any good write ups on the previous competitors cars? I know it wasn't open to the public but I'd be interested

Javelin
Javelin GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 5:42 p.m.

In reply to icaneat50eggs:

It's all brand new, and there's no announcements yet. It's based off of the Optima Ultimate Street Car Invitational, which is after SEMA using SEMA cars. I'd imagine they are looking for cars close to that caliber, but if it's truly open to everyone, who knows? So far all it has to be is street legal.

icaneat50eggs
icaneat50eggs HalfDork
11/13/13 5:52 p.m.

Yeah my stuff is not what they want, but my brothers projects are right up there alley

Javelin
Javelin GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 6:09 p.m.

In reply to icaneat50eggs:

You never know!

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/13/13 6:19 p.m.

I'm pretty sure Hot Rod has been covering this from the start. I've always wondered about bringing out the Targa Miata

There's one test that's a bit gnarly from what I recall. Basically, you have a fixed distance to cover in the minimum time, starting and finishing at a standstill. Accelerate until you have to brake and don't blow the stop box. Sounds REALLY tough.

Hmm. I might have to give this a shot.

icaneat50eggs
icaneat50eggs HalfDork
11/13/13 6:22 p.m.

I'm Sure the first time they rolled out that get most of the Sema crowd passed out of at the mere thought.

OMG BRAKE DUST!!!!

Matthew Huizing
Matthew Huizing Reader
11/13/13 8:22 p.m.
icaneat50eggs wrote: Are there any good write ups on the previous competitors cars?

Brian Hobaugh's 1965 Chevrolet Corvette

JoeyM
JoeyM Mod Squad
11/13/13 8:31 p.m.
Joe Gearin wrote: The road course portion would be the most difficult to contend in, as the top cars were ridiculously modified, and driven by near pro-level drivers. (Danny Popp won--- former UTCC Champion) [...] It is a great movement, and GRM is getting involved. There is a lot we can teach these guys to make them faster.......and a lot they can teach us as well.

You've got my interest. How are you guys getting involved

Rad_Capz
Rad_Capz HalfDork
11/13/13 9:08 p.m.

I've been watching threads about this on a couple forums because I may try to attend the events at Daytona and Sebring. On one of the other forums Jimi Day made a couple posts that may answer questions people on this forum may have. I'm copying & pasting them here.


Full roll cages and harnesses will be encouraged, but will not be required to attend and have fun in these events. Safety is our primary concern, but we also understand this is a street car series and cages and harnesses are not always practical. As well, the series is for all makes, models and years of real street cars. Participants are not required to participate in the points series and there will be more than one way to earn a spot in the OPTIMA Ultimate Street Car invitational.

We are still ironing out the rules and points systems, but rest assured that each event will be safe, organized and fun and will offer a bucket-list experience for street car owners of all skill levels at a competitive price.

We have 10 USCA events, ASCS will have at least five events and GoodGuys will have almost 20 Autocross events across the country. There will be something for everyone. The street car perfromance marketplace is a viable and robust market, and all of these series and events will serve to bring more attention to our hobby. The combination of all these events provides an experience for every year make and model of street car and we support them all. Jimi Day FM3 Performance Marketing, Inc. http://www.fm3marketing.com


Ladies and gentlemen, enthusiasts, hot rodders,

The USCA is committed to safety first at all of these events. Secondly, we want to make the events fun and accessible to everyone, without regard to any specific economic demographics. And we are working hard to level the playing field. This series is not about prize money, it's about the cars and the people that drive them, that's what our street performance industry is all about. TV will not dictate the competition, it will cover it in a credible and respectable manner.

We don't have all the rules figured out yet, but we work on them daily. And safety requirements are at the top of our list. We know some of these tracks are very high speed or technical, and I've personally driven on every one of them, so I know. Our USCA group has organized and run hundreds of events at tracks all around the country and we have the necessary knowledge and experience to make the events fun and safe for all skill levels.

As for sharing track time with Chumpcar, I promise you will have a significant amount of track time at each one of these facilities. Our events will have five elements, and all the facilities have an adequate amount of space to run all the events. Our planned format will run Friday through Sunday, starting with a road rally and social event. Saturday will be Autocross and speed stop while Chumpcar is on the track, and we will run a track day on Sunday. At certain venues, we may take the track on Saturday and run AX and SS on Sunday. The format will be the same for every event, the run order may change based on facility.

We also know there will multiple ways to win your way into the Super Bowl, the OUSCI, besides just the points.

We will be posting important updates on our website, ultimatestreetcarassociation.com and to our facebook page, Ultimate Street Car Association. These are the only places where you will find the official information about the series.

I appreciate your patience as we work through the details - the time we spend we spend now will pay off in the near future. We will try to address any specific concerns as they are brought to our attention. We appreciate all of your enthusiasm, input and feedback as we move forward. Jimi Day FM3 Performance Marketing, Inc. http://www.fm3marketing.com

kazoospec
kazoospec HalfDork
11/13/13 9:12 p.m.

In reply to Joe Gearin:

You had me at "Detroit Speed Subframes". We had a 72 Nova with a Detroit Speed set up show for our last autocross. It . . . was . . . awesome. Loud, fast, and cool, and yet it handled like a modern Vette. Ended up 4th of 81 entries in raw time.

The down side is the "cubic dollar" factor. I would not be the least bit surprised to find it was a 100K+ car. Looks like they're coming to MIS, so I'll go to drool and watch.

oldeskewltoy
oldeskewltoy Dork
11/13/13 9:13 p.m.

looks like fun.....

my car might be upto the task

not sure I am....

mistanfo
mistanfo UltraDork
11/13/13 9:42 p.m.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

  1. Bring Targa Miata.
  2. Kick ass.
  3. Swap in Exocet chassis
  4. Kick previous kick ass time with new kick ass time.
  5. Profit?!?
Joe Gearin
Joe Gearin Associate Publisher
11/14/13 9:43 a.m.

Most of the builds I saw at the Optima Street Car Invitational would be deep into six figure territory. There were a few that seemed more "budget" builds, but most were extremely over the top--- both power wise, and quality wise.

It's a cool movement, but don't underestimate the competition---- it is fierce!

If you have a 3000 lb car.....plan on brining 400-600 hp, within a very well designed chassis, and a top-notch driver--- or you won't be a factor in the road course. I can see one of Keith's hairiest V8 Miatas having a shot.....but it would be tough. Thats how serious these cars are!

icaneat50eggs
icaneat50eggs HalfDork
11/14/13 9:48 a.m.

How about a 1450 lb car with 250 hp?

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
11/14/13 11:36 a.m.
Joe Gearin wrote: If you have a 3000 lb car.....plan on brining 400-600 hp, within a very well designed chassis, and a top-notch driver--- or you won't be a factor in the road course. I can see one of Keith's hairiest V8 Miatas having a shot.....but it would be tough. Thats how serious these cars are!

You and I are thinking the same way The Targa Miata might be good, it's 2400 lbs and about 500 at the crank. I know just the guy for the road course work, and a CSP champ who would love to take on the cones. Does it have to be the same driver for both? I'd suffer in the concours judging because racecar patina, though.

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