Just passed on a complete 5.3L the other day for $300 because the guy didn't know the history.
Just passed on a complete 5.3L the other day for $300 because the guy didn't know the history.
I am using a 305HP v6 from a 2012 mustang(the equivalent of the 350/370z engine). There are considerations when comparing against a LS-series engine:
1. Weight...this goes to the all aluminum v6 everytime...not sure what a VQ weighs, but the Ford v6 weights 270lbs...an LS engine is upwards of 390lbs
2. Torque...the LS engine will win here every time...torque will win a lot of races.
3. Packaging....the LS engine is physically much smaller
4. Aftermarket...the LS engine also has a bigger aftermarket, making for cheaper prices(cost on one cam is much cheaper than 4)
5. Simplicity...the LS engine is simpler and more reliable...there is a reason GM is still using pushrod engines after all this time
6. Power potential....again, the LS is the better choice for max power.
That is why people end up choosing it over a variety of other engines....if you are simply looking for a pre-packaged 300HP engine and have no need for anything more though....the VQ will do the job nicely.
In reply to Wicked93gs :
A complete aluminum LS will be right around the 390# mark with accessories (according to my bathroom scales).
maschinenbau said:VQ35DE swap is very difficult without going full standalone compared to an LS. The stock ECM is not DIY tuneable without a really expensive software. You can swap it without flashing the ECM, but you will need every component of the anti-theft system and the complete wiring harness.
The DE power is over-advertised and not quite 300 hp, even in the 350Z, and you won't get there with just a tune and bolt-ons. It's a good stout engine though. Very capable of handling a 100hp shot of nitrous
To get a manual, it's much cheaper to go VQ even with a paid tune and/or standalone. LS T56's are expensive.
Can't Nissan anti-theft be coded out using UpRev?
In reply to G_Body_Man :
I don't see it on their page. Also at $775 it's pretty expensive. Useful for Challenge math though.
Parameters that are supported in the ROM Editor include:
• Up to 5 Maps on cruise control equipped vehicles
• Idle RPM
• Speed Limiter
• Electronic Throttle Control to achieve Wide Open Throttle at all speeds.
• Rev Limiter
• AFR Targets
• Fuel Compensation
• Ignition Timing Advance
• Cam Phasing for equipped vehicles.
• MAF transfer function
• Cranking Enrichment and Ignition Advance
• Injector Latency
• K Fuel Multiplier
• Intake Temp
• Calculated Load vs. RPM
• Minimum Effective Injector Pulse Width
I think you can hack some of the Nissan ECUs with RomRaider. I was looking into that for doing a VK45 or VK56 swapped G35 for a bit.
In reply to Stampie :
Dig a little deeper on the romraider forum. It looks like Nissan people have been having success with it.
In reply to RacetruckRon :
Cool. Looks like I have some reading to do.
In reply to Wicked93gs :
I have questions. In no order; Why the 3.7 V6, what made you go that route, as your tradeoff study seems to shout LS as the better solution. What are you using for engine management / how did you make it happy out of a Mustang? What transmisison are you using? What's the car?
In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :
I chose the 3.7L v6 because of the weight. The car is a '66 mustang...and the choice was between a typical SBF and the 3.7L...but even with aluminum heads, a 5.0L would have clocked in at 120lbs heavier...and the car is being built with the main focus on handling...300-350HP was the goal, which is simple to get out of a SBF(or an LS...SBFs and LS engines are fairly close to equal in a lot of ways). The goal with the car was to keep it at stock weight(was originally an I6 car) even after adding about 100lbs of chassis stiffening...which required a lighter engine. I am still working on the car, so I can't say its done yet...but I am using Megasquirt 3 w/ a MS3X card to run the engine...fully capable of running any DOHC v6 with VVT.
Don't get me wrong...people chose the LS engine because it is simply a better choice for 90% of swaps...but for those who don't mind some work, there is a whole world of other engines out there. This 3.7L swap of mine...I have never in my life made so many parts from scratch for an engine swap...there is VERY little aftermarket support aside from the usual bolt-ons...and then there is the other reason...I will never swap an LS engine into anything, regardless of how much sense it makes, I just can't stomach how common and blah the swap is...just like I would never swap a 2JZ into anything for the same reason...they are great engines...but if I am going to the trouble to swap a custom engine...it will definately be something more unusual(or one-of)
In reply to Wicked93gs :
Good info, thanks. Do you have a build thread? Sounds like a great project.
In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/build-projects-and-project-cars/1966-ford-mustang-ford-37l-v6-cyclone-swap/162853/page1/
I haven't updated in a couple weeks though(doing tedious fiberglass work on an airbox lately)
RacetruckRon said:Solstice AR5 trans and a Fabbot adapter is the easy way to get a cheap manual LS drivetrain. I have a CD009 and a Collins Kit. I wish I knew about the AR5 when I bought my trans.
You say 300hp but is that to the wheels or at the crank? At the wheels the LS is the way to go, it's so easy to make power with even a junkyard 5.3.
^This!!
There are builds that far exceed the documented tq limit of the AR5. It's a stout piece.
Salvage yards have caught wind of this and have adjusted their prices. In my area, they went for $75-$150 . . . Now they are $300-700.
I'm temped to just buy one and squirrel it away.
RacetruckRon said:In reply to Stampie :
Dig a little deeper on the romraider forum. It looks like Nissan people have been having success with it.
Oooooo I need to do some reading...
In reply to maschinenbau :
Hopefully you'll understand it better and can explain it to me in DA redneck terms.
In reply to Strike_Zero :
Just FYI...the MA5(its only reffered to as the AR5 in Isuzu applications) is also found in the Colorado, the H2 Hummer, and GMC Canyon and has exactly the same gear ratios as the Solstice with the exception of 3rd gear...it also has a more conventional slip yoke in those applications and a tailshaft mounted shifter as opposed to the remote mounted unit in the Solstice. Also, the MA5/AR5 is an Aisin transmission...essentially an upgraded R154. I used one of these behind a SRT4 neon engine I converted to RWD using a Jeep Liberty bellhousing....bought it brand new with 0 miles for $300...its a great transmission.
I wish I could find a MA5 or AR5 for $300 with 0 miles LOL!
From my local yards:
They disappear as soon as it hit Pull-a-Part.
<threadjack>Celica build on SRT forums??</threadjack>
In reply to Strike_Zero :
Yeah, that Celica was mine(assuming its the brown 77 RA29...since the link doesnt work for me)...miss that car....was a lot of fun...and for $2000 invested total was probably the best budget build I ever accomplished.
P.S. I don't think you have to worry much about 150k on one of those things, I guarantee you that 95% of them still look like new inside...they were almost never abused....and even if they were, they were built to take it. The biggest downside in using one behind a v8 is the first gear ratio....pretty worthless...even behind the SRT4 engine I was never real happy with it.
You'll need to log in to post.
