VR6 sound & MOAR POWAR!!

I'd never paid much attention to VR6s except to note their unconventional layout, but I kept hearing about what a different sound they made than traditional V6s so I finally searched for some videos.

This sounds awesome, kinda old school Grand Prix.

BUT, they don't seem to have any power, or at least I couldn't find a factory version that did.

Did it ever come with a turbo?

I know there are ways to make it RWD, but so far I haven't found a good way to hack the ecu except to go to an early system and that loses power.

Every person I know who has gone Megasquirt or other tuning system seems to always be tuning. To me, having grown up in the days of points & carbs, I've sworn I won't go back to any system that requires that much work. I rather not cut into the driving time so this is just another pipe dream.

But one day there will be a better way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWFzmH4vwGo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNXWW4QDFI4

The part of my brain that says i should do cool E36 M3 i never actually do says it would be a good idea to use the 'lower' half of a 2pc vr6 intake manifold and then design a couple of 3d-printed plenum/carb-adapter pieces to use a couple of weber 40 DCOEs or some such.

The VR6 was used in the base Porsche Cayenne, and the R32, so there's also little power available with the right parts from the factory. They aren't terribly big engines, so the power they do produce is still respectable, IMO.

As to the "tuners" well they are fine tuning or just dicking around with laptops. Completely different than carbs and points.

The sound comes from it being essentially a v6 that's as close to an inline 6 as it can't get. I think it's a 15° V. That said, I owned a 2002 vr6 Jetta. Nightmare.

The sound is different than a true V6 because of the way they have to do the valves and intake passageways. There's several graphics that pop up every time I search for anything VR6.

Stefan I don't believe their power is "respectable" for it's size when you compare it to almost any other sporty type engine out there. "Damn it Jim, it ought to come with a turbo somewhere!!!"

And actually due to the simplicity of the turbo on it vs. a real V6, since all the exhaust pipes come out on one side so you'd only need one turbo, you'd have thought they'd have done it by now.

I just saw the 2017 400 hp turbo 5 cylinder TT on Top Gear and I'd heard that was the VR6 minus a cylinder.

In reply to carguy123:

Think about how old that motor design is though, it debuted in the Corrado.

It's also the basis for the W engines in the Bugatti, etc.

Like most V6 options they just don't get much attention compared to the V8 or fuel efficient 4-cylinders, etc.

Wait, how is the VR6 not powerful enough? Compare its displacement and power in each generation and it's right there with comparable v6s while occupying a smaller footprint. I can't argue that boost is wonderful but the VR6 has always punched at or above its weight class when each new version came out.

In reply to carguy123:

250hp n/a VR6 in the R32 and TT. That seems pretty respectable, especially for the time it was produced in the early 2000's?

I currently have two VWs. A 2000 Passat with the 2.8 V6 mounted longitudinally. 190 hp and completely impossible to work on. Like no room anywhere impossible.

And a 2007 Passat with a 3.6 VR6. Tons of room under the hood and rated (conservatively) at 280 hp. The VR6 sounds like the seks too.

I really miss the soundtrack of my mostly stock MKIV R32. Not to mention the AWD, 6 speed engagement and the torque. You should check out VR5 soundtracks for really crazy sounds. They as good as or better than a VR6 (aftermarket exhaust dependent).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2zq8Ci2-rQ

I've had a few VR6s in my day (1994 Passat, 1990 AWD Turbo Corrado, 2003 Jetta 24v) and I've driven quite a few of them in the newer cars - as mentioned, the Passat had a 280 hp 3.6L version (shared with the Cayenne) and the R32 had a 240-250ish 3.2L version that also came in the Audi TT.

I have nothing but good things to say about them. No reliability issues whatsoever related to the engine.

They sound like a wookie once you add an exhaust.

Ricky Spanish said: They sound like a wookie once you add an exhaust.

I guess that explains the R32 with the vanity plate "WOOKEEE" that I saw on CL today.

Ricky Spanish wrote: 1990 AWD Turbo Corrado

That's hilarious. Last night in traffic a VR6 mk4 mashed the throttle and I said "Damn that sounds awesome!" The wife (who is not car savvy) said "it sounds like a wookie getting a blow job, I mean that in a good way "

In reply to Ricky Spanish:

You sir, have the best screen name. I'm jelly. You win all the internet!

So can we please stop posting information about what the different donors are, their stock specs, and what types of transmissions bolt up?

250 hp for 3.2 liters and 280 for 3.6 isn't stellar power outputs at all and puts them way down the list. Some 4 bangers at 2.0 put out that much from the factory.

They really should be putting out about 300 hp in today's market.

Robbie, I don't remember right off hand what RWD transmissions bolt up, but I know there are several because every time I search for info about the VR6 there are many posts about it.

People seem to prefer to work with stock ecus for reliable power increases, but that presupposes that you are using a full VW/Audi. I've read nothing that shows a simple way to use the engine in another car or Locost except going back to OBD1 ecus and a significant power loss which puts the engine even further down the desirability list.

Although one of the links I posted shows a guy taking out massive amounts of wiring and still having the car run well enough to do garage burnouts. So maybe it's not a hopeless case.

I have a Locost that is almost ready for a motor, but I'm not going to be the guinea pig when I've already got a motor that will work, but that sound!!!

WilD wrote:

Ricky Spanish said: They sound like a wookie once you add an exhaust.

I guess that explains the R32 with the vanity plate "WOOKEEE" that I saw on CL today.

I heard something about an R32 that crashed on the Dragon a few months ago and there was mention of the car being known as Wookee. I wonder if it's that car.

250 hp for 3.2 liters and 280 for 3.6 isn't stellar power outputs at all

Are we not talking about stock cars and stock rev limits and in their time period? Because if you're comparing a stock engine to a boosted engine from a newer era or some such than.... sure, you win i guess. Those hp/liter are not much worse than my Porsche 911 and probably the same if you moved my rev limit down into the 6s.

Um, after 2005 the 3.6L VR6 did make upwards of 300hp in stock form at 12:1 compression and producing 260ft-lb.

It's in the Wikipedia entry for the VR6 engine.

I had a Corrado SLC with a Borla exhaust, Schrick cams, and a Garrett chip when all that was modern stuff. Probably had about 200hp after all that work, but that sound was sweet.

They are sweet engines, but they only exist because VW didn't have the capital necessary to re-platform their fleet in 1992. They needed something that would fit in an A2 chassis.

It was a clever solution engineered around a compromise. A I6 accordioned into the length of an I4

Specific output isn't the only measure of an engine's worth to me. I think they fill an interesting niche in the automotive landscape.

they are an interesting engine. I put them in the same category as the Cologne V4 and the Lancia V4. Engines that should have found a better and bigger audience, but never did

The VR6 Wooky roar is pretty fantastic despite being down on hp vs more modern engines. My bolts on motor made 175whp and a buddy's rowdy turbo setup puts down 450wheel but that engine is not destined to last. With a mild turbo and good tune they can put down ~300hp and live long healthy lives.

The big thing with these engines is the cooling systems and timing chain setups. Pretty robust for VW's.

Aren't they still using the VR6?

And 3.6 liters making 300 hp? Not very good in the modern day performance world.

For VW hp go 1.8T for ~300 at the boneyard and hit 300hp for the price of a tune and down pipe.