I want to lower my daily driver 2011 Lexus ES 350 about 1 1/2" without losing the factory ride quality. I don't need the adjustability of coilovers. I'm just trying to close the gap between the fenders and the o.d. of my current wheel/tire combination. Any and all help appreciated.
Pay attention to how much bump travel you have between the car's static resting position and the bumpstops. As long as you have enough bump travel to keep the unsprung weight from crashing into the stops your ride quality shouldn't be much affected unless you add new dampers that are more firm than what you have now.
Do note though, that big bumps may still be more jarring as you're eliminating 1.5" of bump that would normally be used to slow the compression of the suspension before the stops are hit.
My 96 Impala SS got the lowering kit at 36,001 miles. Not that I was really worried about warranty issues, just didn't want to give the shysters any opportunity.
Dropped it 2" in the front and almost 3 in the back. Not sure about your suspension travel, but mine had tons of travel left. It was the best thing I ever did for that car.
I would think very strongly about keeping factory ride quality. The closer you get to the ground, the more you need a little extra stiffness to prevent bottoming out... either on the ground or the bumpstops
In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :
Appreciate it, even if I could only lower it an 1" and keep the ride quality that would do. I've read some camary's have shorter struts that fit my car. I haven't heard of anyone actually trying it though. Several companies offer lowering springs but the are for a firmer ride.
I have no specific knowledge but that's modern enough that there's probably only 1-2" of travel before bump stop engagement so you're definitely going to want shorter struts. Cutting bump stops does kind of the same thing, but also increases their spring rate which will make things a bit harsher. (Slightly) stiffer springs isn't necessarily a huge hit to ride quality, as long as the dampers are appropriate for them. The biggest thing will be keeping as much compliance as possible, which if you're not interested in coilovers probably won't be an issue.
I recommend cross-drilling the bumpstops vs cutting them. Yeah, you still hit them (and sooner), but their addition to spring rate is much more gradual (less abrupt).
Be very careful! Many cars lowered for 'looks' suffer serious performance issues because you may be introducing significant bump steer and ruining the handling. Depends on your particular suspension geometry. Suggest that you ask this question on a forum dedicated to your specific car.
Note that higher spring rates may actually give you better ride quality than a "stock rate" setup, because they'll keep you off the bumps. Just about every lowering spring out there is specified for looks and marketing over actual ride quality, hoping you won't notice the constant bump stop hits. Also, most big spring vendors never spend more than a few hours with the car and don't care so don't take their name as a sign of good engineering. You'd be better off with a specialist shop.
^^^ True.
It was a Tokico off-the-shelf "Advanced Handling" kit n my B13 Sentra that taught me suspension frequency and spring rates. And shock valving, if I'm honest.
While Tokico supplied the original suspension for the Sentra from the factory, their kit lowered it too much, and was only 50% stiffer. It looked sweet, but had diabolical handling. I ended up getting in on a Hypercoil group buy for springs 3X stiffer, and it rode the same but handled WAY better.
If you lower your car 2 inches, you lose 2 inches of bump travel. There's not much getting around that.
So you increase the spring rate so that it takes the same amount of force to get to what's left of full bump.
eg: 300lb/in spring with 3" travel (900lbs at full bump), or 450lb/in spring with 1.5" travel (900lbs at full bump).
In theory.
Would something like an Eibach Pro-Kit progressive spring work? I had therm on my '98 Camry and liked them (they were paired with KYB GR-2 struts). There should be some options out there to lower it slightly.
Should I just go ahead and install coilovers? If I do can anyone make a recommendation on what ones to buy that would retain my ride comfort? I've never ran coilovers on anything. Also my son has a lexus ls 400 with air suspension,is that an option I should consider? If so does anyone know of a system where I could just set the ride height and never adjust it again. Is there a way to get around having a tank and compressor? Sorry for all the questions.
SkinnyG (Forum Supporter) said:So you increase the spring rate so that it takes the same amount of force to get to what's left of full bump.
eg: 300lb/in spring with 3" travel (900lbs at full bump), or 450lb/in spring with 1.5" travel (900lbs at full bump).
In theory.
Totally correct. Although, you're still losing the travel, so if you hit a 2" bump which would have been soaked up by the suspension before, depending on how hard you hit it, you're either going to be half an inch into the bump stops, or the body is going to move at least half an inch that it wouldn't have before. You can have a good ride with less travel. It won't be the same.
For the OP, unfortunately you're probably going to have to experiment. I doubt you'll be able to retain your stock ride with it lowered, but you may be able to get it to something you like. Good shocks will be important to make it work.
Skinny G. You may be interested to know I actually pretty much copied your Sinister Sentra. 300/200 springs, AGX's, Progress rear bar. It was even the same colour. Super fun car for autocross, and made a great rallycrosser on smoother courses.
Sidewayze said:Skinny G. You may be interested to know I actually pretty much copied your Sinister Sentra.
That's super cool, and super flattering!
Sidewayze said:If you lower your car 2 inches, you lose 2 inches of bump travel. There's not much getting around that.
With a drop spring, yes. There are other methods that do not sacrifice bump travel, but they aren't nearly as common.
In reply to ProDarwin :
What are the other less common ways to lower it that doesn't sacrifice bump travel, thank you.
change the tire size
relocate the spring perch(es)
modify knuckle geometry
In reply to ProDarwin : Thanks for the advice. I relocated the spring perches on both a Volvo PV444 and a American Motor's Spirit. I never thought about doing it to a newer car. I'm gonna look into what's involved, thanks again.
dj06482 (Forum Supporter) said:Would something like an Eibach Pro-Kit progressive spring work? I had therm on my '98 Camry and liked them (they were paired with KYB GR-2 struts). There should be some options out there to lower it slightly.
I have put a Pro-kit on most of my daily drivers going back a long way. Currently I'm driving a Mazda3 with Koni's and a pro-kit.
Most applications seem to be a pretty OK compromise for a daily driver. That being said I have had to shorten the front bump stops slightly on a couple of applications to get the ride where I wanted it.
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