What Benz?

G_Body_Man wrote: I guess I've been unclear in what I need. After the Cutlass fiasco, I'm done with an insane project, at least until I have money, time and brains. A window regulator here and a bit of welding there is no problem. Replacing a fairly large section of frame? Problem. I just want an interesting car that I can fix the odd gremlin on and simply drive. Maybe listen to some music in, but otherwise just be comfortable with.

You know how everyone here always says that Miata is the answer? That's because they do things well (within their given parameters), they're easy to work on and parts are cheap.

I bought a fairly low mile, one owner Miata in January. I have lots of free time, an assload of tools and a lift in my garage. I have been working on it constantly for nine months.

I'm not advocating that you buy a Miata, because it's clearly not what you're looking for. All cheap/older cars are projects to some degree. If you want a Mercedes, get one. But a complicated German luxury car that's difficult and expensive to fix probably isn't a good choice if you were overwhelmed by the needs of a pedestrian 80's GM sedan.

Woody wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: I guess I've been unclear in what I need. After the Cutlass fiasco, I'm done with an insane project, at least until I have money, time and brains. A window regulator here and a bit of welding there is no problem. Replacing a fairly large section of frame? Problem. I just want an interesting car that I can fix the odd gremlin on and simply drive. Maybe listen to some music in, but otherwise just be comfortable with.

You know how everyone here always says that Miata is the answer? That's because they do things well (within their given parameters), they're easy to work on and parts are cheap. I bought a fairly low mile, one owner Miata in January. I have lots of free time, an assload of tools and a lift in my garage. I have been working on it *constantly* for nine months. I'm not advocating that you buy a Miata, because it's clearly not what you're looking for. All cheap/older cars are projects to some degree. If you want a Mercedes, get one. But a complicated German luxury car that's difficult and expensive to fix probably isn't a good choice if you were overwhelmed by the needs of a pedestrian 80's GM sedan.

Thank you for saying what I was thinking with post #1, but was too afraid to write for fear of being written off or being offensive.

pointofdeparture wrote: In reply to G_Body_Man: I have owned three Volvos and never once have I had a difficult-to-diagnose electrical problem. That was an issue on early 80's 240s, but my 740 turbo, 960 and 850R were all rock solid. Also, that statement implies a Benz electrical problem is easy to diagnose by comparison.

Yup, never had any electrical gremlins on either of mine (94 N/A 5 speed 850, 96 850 Turbo.) They really are solid cars, I was a stupid kid and beat the E36 M3 out of mine and neither ever complained. I think the only parts I ever had to replace were old rubber things (bushings, vacuum lines, motor mounts, ect) and wear components (brakes, ect.) The PCV system is really the only major maintenance issue I can recall hearing about.

What happened to the Astro van idea? Get the Astro van.

Your extremely set in your ways. Go ahead and buy one. Just don't bother making 20 threads about every little thing that goes wrong that you either can't afford or unable to replace because the only response here you'll see is "I told you so". Just being blunt

It seems like the only automotive experience you have is online, as other suggested get something simpler to work on so you can learn cars better then may you take on a task as daunting as an older Mercedes.

Let me also reiterate volvos don't have electrical problems unless it's built before 88 due to the same "biodegradable" harness issues as some of the mercs listed here and because there are basically no electronics on those cars it's not hard at all to figure out. I've owned 3 volvos and currently still own two, an 85 240 turbo and an 88 240 that's been converted to turbo.

Again sorry for being blunt and shiny happy person like but it's needed to be said and reiterated. Trust us we are grm.

Yeah, Volvos don't really have difficult-to-diagnose electrical problems. And with websites like ipd, parts are reasonable, too.

also between my 3 mentioned volvos, the combined mileage was 750,000 miles with factory motors. Only thing that broke was a non turbo trans I was forcing to "hold" over double the hp now with more power and a trans that has even more miles and not a problem mechanical, electrical or other.

I've had my 01 E320 for over 5 years. I bought it with 125k miles. in now has 175k. In those years I've replaced a brake switch that made the ABS light come on, motor mounts, headlight bulb, and front brake rotors. It has been dead reliable, fuel efficient, and easy to work on with the advice of the Benzworld forum. I don't know what the interiors are made of, but they wear like iron. I'd buy another today if I needed one. People think you're rich cause you drive a benz that books at $4500

tuna55 wrote:

Woody wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: I guess I've been unclear in what I need. After the Cutlass fiasco, I'm done with an insane project, at least until I have money, time and brains. A window regulator here and a bit of welding there is no problem. Replacing a fairly large section of frame? Problem. I just want an interesting car that I can fix the odd gremlin on and simply drive. Maybe listen to some music in, but otherwise just be comfortable with.

You know how everyone here always says that Miata is the answer? That's because they do things well (within their given parameters), they're easy to work on and parts are cheap. I'm not advocating that you buy a Miata, because it's clearly not what you're looking for. All cheap/older cars are projects to some degree. If you want a Mercedes, get one. But a complicated German luxury car that's difficult and expensive to fix probably isn't a good choice if you were overwhelmed by the needs of a pedestrian 80's GM sedan.

Thank you for saying what I was thinking with post #1, but was too afraid to write for fear of being written off or being offensive.

Easy guys... I've been where the OP is now. I don't think you're being offensive, but maybe a little prejudicial. Just because he was overwhelmed by heavy fabrication to fix a frame on a G-body doesn't mean he's incapable of fixing a European car. Maybe he just hates frame work. I went from a 66 Bonneville, 73 Impala, and a 96 Impala to an e30 and a w210. I was glad to have some electrical gremlins instead of rebuilding engines and transmissions for a while.

I just know that I've been in the same position on this board; I wanted something that wasn't "normal" or "typical" and I got all kinds of "dude, you shouldn't do that."

I'm just sticking with "here's what you can expect" and let him make his own choice.

^Fair enough.

As I said earlier, I wouldn't be advocating so heavily against it if I hadn't had my soul crushed by German cars in my own late teens. Truly, the lessons you learn the hard way are the most valuable; best case, a W210 will be great for him, worst case, he will learn some valuable lessons like I did!

At this point though, OP, I would just say buy the dang W210 and report back when you have it. This was not so much a "which Benz" thread (since you ruled out literally every other suggestion) as a "I really want a W210" thread and that is now clear!

So, since I'm partially the inspiration for this bad idea, let me tell you about my Benz experience.

First go: Restored the Fintail with my dad. That car was awesome, I loved every minute of it, and I knew I needed a Mercedes of my own.

Second go: Got offered a 1984 300SD at a party for $300. Picked it up, got it running, and proceeded to drop tons of time and money into it while never making it any better. If it possessed a feature or part, it was broken or broke while I owned it. Despite all this, I loved it, and drove it a ton. I finally punted when it broke the transmission in half, and was Benz free for a year or two.

Third go: I knew I wanted another W126, but I'd learned my lesson this time. I picked the exact model I wanted, and I waited. I'd been looking since I sold the last W126, and it's taken this long to find my creampuff. I wanted a low-milage, well-maintained 300SDL that hadn't been modified, didn't have any problems, and was being sold cheaply. Finally, it popped up in the Mercedes club magazine, so I jumped on it. I've put a few thousand miles on it so far, and it's been perfect. (I probably just jinxed it.)

The point I'm trying to make? Wait for a nice one. I ended up with about $4k in my first W126, and ended up with a car that drove nicely, but had no clear coat, needed every piece of wood refinished, had wonky A/C, didn't have working rear windows, and never had a watertight trunk. But hey, the car was cheap at only $300. This latest 300SDL, in comparison, is a way nicer car (thanks, extra cylinder) with half the mileage, no issues, and pretty paint. I have $3100 in it, plus an oil change to be safe.

16-year-old Tom would have never typed this post, but definitely wait for the right one. There is absolutely no reason to not buy a perfect Mercedes–these were all bought by wealthy people with garages and money for repairs, and many escaped the terrible chain of ownership that depreciation brings. We aren't talking about Chevy Aveos that lived on the street and have been neglected since day one.

In reply to oldtin:

Details?

after 20 years in the automotive industry in one capacity or another, I just bought my first Mercedes.

so far it's been very straightforward. more intuitive than I expected.

Loving mine so far but its a lot newer than we are discussing here

In all honesty, I don't like dropping old gas tanks. Gas gets everywhere, and you can't get the smell out for a month. Plus, I don't feel that I have the experience to weld something that, when done wrong, can and will result in fiery death. In terms of German car problems, I actually liked wrenching on Mark IV Jettas and Gen 2 MLs. Also, if you break a blower motor regulator, you just take the dash apart, pop in a junkyard unit, and put it back together. If you break a frame or an engine, that's where scary things happen.

In terms of Tom's comment on buying the nicest one I could, I learned that the hard way with the Cutlass. I had $2000 into that car and ended up giving it away to a very experienced gentleman in Kingston.

To pointofdeparture, I'd own an old RX-7 in a heartbeat. I'm way more masochistic than most people expect. I also don't have many options. I'll try looking at Siennas and Quests. They're good vans for the money, and make more sense to me than a Camry or Accord.

I'll also look at Volvos. S60s and 850s look very promising. A V70 would be ideal. Especially considering that electrical issues seem to be far less prominent than expected.

I'll probably end up with something like a Regal GS or GP GTP. They're just cheap beaters that I can play with a bit.

Also, 03+ full-size Cadillacs are appealing. I've found one that somehow got painted matte black. This might give me an excuse to try the rustoleum roller paint job.

Hey man, if owning an interesting car is important to you, don't ignore that. It's not very fun to go out to the driveway every morning and climb into a car that you resent because it's boring.

If you're like me and your daily driver is going to be your outlet for your car enthusiasm then it will be worth it to be patient in searching for the "right" vehicle.

You seem pretty set on the Merc. No ones mentioned a Crown Victoria, I'd recommend one. Not sure how rare they are in Canada, but in the PNW $5000 would buy a very nice loaded fairly low mileage Crown Victoria.

I bought a 1991 ex detective crown vic, back in 2001 When I was 18. It had the vinyl interior 351 v8 with cop everything else. I put that poor car through hell (jumps,burnouts ,donuts, jturns) on a regular basis for 75000 and it never died. All it ever really needed was 1 set of brake pads, oil, gas, and tires I couldn't kill it. I sold it with 150,000 hard miles on it, for a couple hundred bucks less than I originally paid for the car. I still see it driving in town to this day.

I've had very hot and cold experience with older benzes, although mine have either been 107s or 123s.

Interestingly, at least with the W123s, how much I've spent for the car has been an inverse relationship of how good the car has been. I had a $1200 240D manual trans car that was my daily driver and go-to trip car for years. It always started, everything except the cruise control worked, and it was cheap to run and drive. It did finally crap 3rd gear, and I had a replacement trans but had moved on by then, and so I sold the car.

By contrast, I had a very pretty light blue with ivory interior 300D that was an absolute crap-bucket. It sure looked good...sitting in my yard. Which was mostly what it did. The seller woefully misrepresented the car (eBay) and was a complete dick about it. The after a bunch of other niggling issues I won't get into here, the trans finally grenaded itself one day, taking out the driveshaft with it. I had a replacement trans put in and sold the car. Quickly.

Now I'm DD-ing an $800 300TD that has been an absolute joy to own. Even the hydraulic rear suspension still works. I think the reason I got it cheap was the floor under the driver's seat has rusted out, and the P/O was afraid of welding. That fixed, it's been dead reliable.

A buddy of mine just picked up a 300SD (W126) against my recommendation, but the buy-in was right so hopefully the transmission issue won't be a car-junking proposition. The P/O had deleted the EGR and the vacuum dor locks don't work, so we're assuming the trans shifting may be a vacuum issue. We'll see...

"AMG" the wind whispers softly....

G_Body_Man wrote: Also, 03+ full-size Cadillacs are appealing. I've found one that somehow got painted matte black. This might give me an excuse to try the rustoleum roller paint job.

Nooooope! Do not want Northstar. Northstar=Deathstar in my experience. Much better off with Buicks and whatnot.

midniteson wrote: You seem pretty set on the Merc. No ones mentioned a Crown Victoria, I'd recommend one. Not sure how rare they are in Canada, but in the PNW $5000 would buy a very nice loaded fairly low mileage Crown Victoria. I bought a 1991 ex detective crown vic, back in 2001 When I was 18. It had the vinyl interior 351 v8 with cop everything else. I put that poor car through hell (jumps,burnouts ,donuts, jturns) on a regular basis for 75000 and it never died. All it ever really needed was 1 set of brake pads, oil, gas, and tires I couldn't kill it. I sold it with 150,000 hard miles on it, for a couple hundred bucks less than I originally paid for the car. I still see it driving in town to this day.

Funny you should mention that. I might be going to look at an Aerovic next week.

Honestly, I had to look up what a 210 was or whatever. Then I learned they come in wagons.

I approve:

Other options you have mentioned recently:

All are awesome. Get a car (one that your dad/parents are on board with will help immensely). Start fixing/maintaining/modding/improving. Post pics in a build thread!

I'd rock that Merc wagon no questions asked