Both of my Zs have manual racks and I daily drove one for 2 years with no complaints. My ae86 auto-x car is non-assisted and is fine with 275 width A6 on the front. Planning on de-powering the DD miata as well.
Im all about that manual rack life
Both of my Zs have manual racks and I daily drove one for 2 years with no complaints. My ae86 auto-x car is non-assisted and is fine with 275 width A6 on the front. Planning on de-powering the DD miata as well.
Im all about that manual rack life
I'll take the contrary opinion on this. While a manual rack is fun, overall I'll take the power assist. I've had a few NAs that had manual steering, and I'm pretty sure one of my AW11s had it. I know for sure my FFR Cobra was a manual rack...it was from Flaming River and was about 2 turns lock to lock. All of those cars were very light weight, so the manual rack gave tons of feedback without being insanely hard to use at lower speeds. The Cobra was a bit harder, because it had fat tires, so parking lot speed turning took a lot of effort.
As someone else mentioned, many automakers figured out how to give good feedback even with power assist. With as heavy as cars are now, and all the weight on the front end, I can't honestly say I'd enjoy a manual rack for daily use. Not that I want an '80's or '90's Honda assist...if you've driven an Accord of that vintage you know what I mean. But some assist is good. The FoST I had is a good example. Power steering, but still had great feel.
old civics
My 1991 Miata and my 1991 Jetta GLi both had manual steering. My 1953 CJ-3a did too.
grafmiata wrote: Which makes me wonder... Is this just a Mazda thing, or are most manufacturer's manual racks worse than their power racks, once de-powered???
If you prefer your manual steering to be super-heavy at low speeds but reasonably quick, you'll like the de-powered racks better. The full manual racks tend to be slower ratio (more turns lock to lock) to keep the effort reasonable.
Klayfish wrote: I'll take the contrary opinion on this. While a manual rack is fun, overall I'll take the power assist.
I'm with you on this one. I'd rather have decent feeling PS and not worry about an annoyingly slow ratio or overly heavy steering limiting my ability to turn the wheel fast enough when it really counts.
I've had friends end up regretting de-powering their autoX cars once they put Hoosiers on because it was a serious challenge to be able to steer it fast enough with the big, sticky tires.
Heck, with the reasonably quick ratio steering box, my Jeep is in that camp. It's basically un-driveable without PS on pavement at any speed. As in, a PS failure is pretty much an automatic AAA call. Disconnecting the steering damper would help a bit (it does add noticeable resistance), but the steering is still very heavy. Decent size tires with a good bit of weight on them and lots of caster is a recipe for needing hulk arms to steer it without power assist.
My Neon wouldn't have a de powered rack if could get the damn belt to stay on at 7400 rpm.
I've owned a couple Volvos with manual racks, but with 185 width tires, it wasn't an issue. I've also owned several vehicles with manual steering boxes, including a '73 Volvo 142, a 1995 Ford Ranger on 205s. and the beast of them all, a '79 Chevy C10 with manual everything. That one made for strong arm and leg muscles.
Streetwiseguy wrote: My Neon wouldn't have a de powered rack if could get the damn belt to stay on at 7400 rpm.
I ran a race weekend at PPIR with a de-powered box in my Camaro after it pitched the belt. Wrestling the 3,600lb car through the infield was tiring but it actually felt great up on the banking.
My 91 miata had a manual rack. Wasn't real fun in parking lots with the 205 Azenis and aggressive alignment but I dealt with it. Hilarity would ensue when I drove my buddy's 90 with power steering 
On the other hand, my 87 4x4 toyota was also manual steering. That got swapped for power steering fairly quickly. Driving that thing off-road was such a bear until the swap.
I remember going to test drive an '88-'91 Civic Wagovan that tuned out to be really rough and hopping in and getting going and going "Oh, no power steering." Wasn't bad once you were moving but I really didn't think it was anything to lust over.
1975 Ford Granada with the 250 straight six and manual transmission. It was a pig to steer, a pig to shift, and it was a pig to open the heavy doors. Over all, I'd say it was a pig.
My 1988 Ranger and my Samurais
Y'all need to hit the gym. I DD my manual rack 94 miata on 225s without issues and I love it.
In reply to calteg:
This guy gets it. Everyday is arm day
Lotus Elise. Best steering feel of any car I've owned or driven. Steering effort was pretty light to, but I think the Elise uses a 175 fronts so makes sense.
The Ford Pinto & Mustang II came with manual racks and their design is the basis for most of the "aftermarket" "Hot Rod" R&P steering racks offered by companies like Flaming River.
Keith Tanner wrote: The depowered Miata racks aren't really suitable for day to day use - track work is okay, but they're pretty heavy at slow speeds.
I'm not even a fan of them for track work. Sure, once you get up to speed it's less of a PITA than parallel parking, but it's still more work, which means more driver fatigue, which means slower lap times even if there's a marginal increase in steering feel.
Mike wrote: I mentioned that my first three cars all had manual racks. They were, in order: + 1983 RX-7 + 1986 Pontiac Fiero + 1992 Suzuki Samurai I think the Samurai was around until 1995, so that's probably a "twenty years, give or take" entry.
I'm certain that your RX-7 did not have a manual rack.
rslifkin wrote:grafmiata wrote: Which makes me wonder... Is this just a Mazda thing, or are most manufacturer's manual racks worse than their power racks, once de-powered???If you prefer your manual steering to be super-heavy at low speeds but reasonably quick, you'll like the de-powered racks better. The full manual racks tend to be slower ratio (more turns lock to lock) to keep the effort reasonable.
I have a depowered 2nd-gen RX-7 setup in my car (think slightly wider Miata) and the steering effort is still lower than the power steering in my front wheel drive Volvo.
Manual steering is ridiculously light in effort, and it sucks to have to wind the steering wheel like a ship's tiller in order to make directional changes.
Maybe I'm just weird, but I'd like full lock to lock to be 1/2 turn of the steering. If you're not using full lock in both directions in every corner, you're not driving aggressively enough and/or your handling is biased too much against acceleration grip
The RX7 will be my first car with manual steering once it's up and running. Glad to hear all positive reviews from the other RX7 owners.
Sounds like no one in the manual rack team lives in a super dense city, lol.
Parallel parking and low speed maneuvering is all you do when you drive in SF. I've owned a few manual rack cars, none of them would be even remotely tolerable around here.
In reply to accordionfolder:
I've watched TV and movies so i am expert in SF traffic. Y'all spend all your time in mid air jumping from hill to hill, losing hubcaps and passing the same VW eight times, and stuff. I found this video of a guy running late for work or something
Has anybody attempted a compromise of leaving the PS but shimming out the regulator for lower pressure? You can get a kit for doing that on a Saginaw pump.
My old EF civic had a manual rack. Ok at speed. Terrible for parallel parking. There was a point in time where a buddy of mine had an '86 Tercel and I had my '89 Civic. I think the Tercel with manual rack was better for low-speed, city going whereas the Civic seemed better on the highway.
I drove both my 88 Fiero GT (manual) and 09 Solstice (power) at the same time and always breathed a sigh of relief/delight when getting back into the Fiero - the steering was so direct and live. Funny thing is that when driving the Solstice the steering was actually quite good in terms of feel - much better than many power steering cars. But going back to pure manual was always so pleasing that driving the power steering cars seemed like making love while wearing mittens in comparison.
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