It seems in the past few years, there have been more innovations with motors than ever before. 15 years ago 60 grand would have gotten you what, 350hp out of a Mustang Cobra? Today you can get 600hp for the same price. Gas mileage is the same thing. Engineers have figured out ways to get crazy numbers out of a gallon of gas. What has changed to allow what we are seeing today?
Magnets..
Smarter compooters and gooder sensors.
Streetwiseguy wrote: Smarter compooters and gooder sensors.
I understand you have limitless powers with computers & sensors that can tell you anything and everything, but the limitations with an engine have always been the same. What do those sensors and computers take advantage of?
Wide spread use of gasoline direct injection (quite similar to diesel fuel injection), variable valve timing and well controlled turbo chargers. Better automatic transmissions have helped a lot too.
Just think of how well these engines could do in cars that weren't weighed down with every electronic nanny and safety device known to man.
I hope the day comes when FoMoCo starts selling ecoboost crate engine packages. I'd love to drop one of those into an early falcon or possibly a maverick.
I think the ability to do modeling and analysis before a single part is built would help. Modeling of combustion and chamber design analysis, transmission efficiency improvements, more power in the average car's ECU to where direct injection is actually worth the effort. Stuff like that.
In reply to lnlogauge:
Its not only the ones on the vehicle, the massive amount of technology available during the design and testing phase has yielded better designs. John Doe back in the 50's designing the SBC with an abacus, straight edge, box of toothpicks, and a bottle of elmers glue never could have imagined the wonders ahead.
I think Direct Injection has helped on smaller displacement motors for sure, for both power and efficiency.
Efficiency can also be from extra gears in the transmission. I think most compact cars are running 6-speed automatics now, which is getting a lot of small cars up around the 40 mpg range.
Efficiency goes both ways - maximum power per unit of fuel isn't just about miles per gallon 
I suspect there's been a lot of improvement in control of the combustion process.
Compression ratios are ratcheting up, probably due to more precise fuel metering and better understanding of what's going on inside the cylinder.
Direct injection and VVT is most of it. These new gas engines run a lot like a diesel at cruise. The line between gas and diesel architecture keeps blurring, eventually I suspect the only difference will be programming and different injectors for the different viscosity fuels.
science!
cheeky answer:
SAE stopped changing the way HP is calculated so people can actually see the progress vs that "475 HP" ford coupe they had in high school.
Don't forget the advances in machining tech and coatings. In the 50's it was hard as hell to machine a round hole 5 inches deep for a cyl now its easier and chrome / nicklesil etc bores are often used. Cast iron rings that wore in quick and "seated" were the norm now you got hard as alloys that seem to never wear out. why cause the hole they started in is rounder and straighter. Also design work do to computer modeling is lots quicker and closer to real world then ever before this makes it easier to make a strong light weigh part that flexes where it should but not were it shouldn't. Also look at the internal clearances and oil viscosity's.
MURICA!
lnlogauge wrote: It seems in the past few years, there have been more innovations with motors than ever before. 15 years ago 60 grand would have gotten you what, 350hp out of a Mustang Cobra? Today you can get 600hp for the same price. Gas mileage is the same thing. Engineers have figured out ways to get crazy numbers out of a gallon of gas. What has changed to allow what we are seeing today?
Oh, the high power engines will still drain a fuel tank with alarming speed. C&Ds blurb on the Hellcat said that at full chat it drinks a pint of fuel in seven seconds.
I think what we are seeing are the benefits of drive by wire and variable cam timing to allow good drivability characteristics (no jumpy tip-in or saggy throttle response) along with better materials to allow for such power numbers, better cooling system engineering, and larger cars that can actually use that kind of power. They have always been able to make the power, the hard part is taming it so Joe Commondoofus can drive it and making it live through the warranty period.
Note that drivability standards are really important to an OEM. Ford left a lot of power on the table in the 60s because of some of their requirements, like cold-start and pulling away from idle. Chrysler, meanwhile, started using manual chokes again to limp certain hi-po cars past emissions test standards, and some of their as-stock engines idled like a drum solo and were expressly sold with no warranty because you were probably going to blow it up within a couple months.
fidelity101 wrote: MURICA!
berkeley YEAH!!
Engines used to be optimized to work efficiently in one small range (race car) or semi optimized to run over a large range (passenger cars). Not always the most efficient situation.
With today's computers and fuel injection technology, the engine can run pretty much in the sweet-spot at all times.
The introduction of variable cam timing is a large part of this improvement.
Don't discount the huge strides in the manufacturing tolerances that can be held by today's mass production tooling. An engine blueprinter would be hard pressed to improve on a lot of the engines being built on assembly lines today.
Simple.. A spark ignition otto cycle engine has what 20-25% thermodynamic efficiency if you are lucky. So for years we've been wasting ~80% of the energy in gasoline.. Now we are getting better at using it.
Almost immediately after I saw this thread, this article from Car and Driver popped up on my fb. Interesting coincidence.
In reply to Fueled by Caffeine:
Fwiw we are far closer to 30%.
A lot of it is that technology catches up with what is known.
Airflow = power. Spinning a small engine faster moves more air, therefore more power.
We have materials that can handle high speeds, can deliver accurate fuel to match that, and computers that can make the calculation fast enough to deliver the fuel and spark correctly.
For passenger cars, the compromises that have been posted have been dealt with with the tech posted. So that it can deliver no to low power very well, make little emissions, and do that efficiently all the while being able to make lots of power.
It's really interesting to watch.
And things will continue to improve.
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:fidelity101 wrote: MURICA!berkeley YEAH!!
If anything it was Japan. We'd still be driving chromed barges with out of round cylinders, bias ply tires, sealed beam headlights, and drum brakes if our automakers had their way. Competition spurs advances. Not changing anything until you must to keep market share spurs profit. And yes, the Japanese are learning that lesson today just as we did in the '70s.
As long as the competition is there, we will see advances. If we end up with monopolies again, then we'll be back to sitting on the status quo until those monopolies are broken again.
Computer controls are obvious, but cylinder head design has come a long way.
Knurled wrote:lnlogauge wrote: It seems in the past few years, there have been more innovations with motors than ever before. 15 years ago 60 grand would have gotten you what, 350hp out of a Mustang Cobra? Today you can get 600hp for the same price. Gas mileage is the same thing. Engineers have figured out ways to get crazy numbers out of a gallon of gas. What has changed to allow what we are seeing today?Oh, the high power engines will still drain a fuel tank with alarming speed. C&Ds blurb on the Hellcat said that at full chat it drinks a pint of fuel in seven seconds. I think what we are seeing are the benefits of drive by wire and variable cam timing to allow good drivability characteristics (no jumpy tip-in or saggy throttle response) along with better materials to allow for such power numbers, better cooling system engineering, and larger cars that can actually use that kind of power. They have always been able to make the power, the hard part is taming it so Joe Commondoofus can drive it and making it live through the warranty period. Note that drivability standards are really important to an OEM. Ford left a lot of power on the table in the 60s because of some of their requirements, like cold-start and pulling away from idle. Chrysler, meanwhile, started using manual chokes again to limp certain hi-po cars past emissions test standards, and some of their as-stock engines idled like a drum solo and were expressly sold with no warranty because you were probably going to blow it up within a couple months.
I still haven't found a drive by wire that isn't laggy.
In reply to Rupert:
IMHO it was emission rules more than Japan that really has moved the needle. As I have seen the last 22 years.
In reply to alfadriver:
Yeah, but Japan kicked the whole thing off. If it weren't for them already having a ready to go solution of small and efficient cars (and thus proof to the world there was a solution) when the 1973 oil crisis hit, the US automakers would have bitched, moaned, and lobbied more effectively to slow the passing and reduce the restrictiveness of those emissions and fuel economy rules.
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