WW$2k - CAM (and CAxM) Challenge 2019

Hmmmmmm....I wonder if I could put down 650hp on 200tw tires

Just a tip. Maserati biturbo has 99 inch wheelbase. H m m m m m

Ford used to own a chunk of Mazda, so maybe Miatas are Allies!

Just a tip. Maserati biturbo has 99 inch wheelbase. H m m m m m

Car was originally available with v8?  6cyl Crammits could be converted and things like that?... 

BarryNorman said:

In reply to Ovid_and_Flem :

NC Miata (FM's Elvis) 105" if the internet is correct.

That would be Betty, and it's still only 91.7".

Keith Tanner said:

As for front engine - I would define front engine as a car that has the CG of the engine in front of the CG of the driver. Saying it just has to be in front of the rear wheels means there is no distinction between front and mid engined. This also opens up many interesting, hilarious and probably unsafe configurations.

So I'll relocate my controls, whatevs. You'll see me sitting up like im on a farm tractor!

If we're trying to make this a muscle car class, maybe we have a minimum trunk volume Must be able to carry five cases of beer cans or two kegs; or be able to smuggle two friends of average size or larger (no disassembly allowed) into the drive-in.

Better would be to require a true back seat.

AngryCorvair said:

Keith Tanner said:

As for front engine - I would define front engine as a car that has the CG of the engine in front of the CG of the driver. Saying it just has to be in front of the rear wheels means there is no distinction between front and mid engined. This also opens up many interesting, hilarious and probably unsafe configurations.

So I'll relocate my controls, whatevs. You'll see me sitting up like im on a farm tractor!

Interesting, hilarious and potentially unsafe. Check, check and check!

If I can get my Sonderklasse running and ready I think it would be a great detriment to the Axis team. A heavy 4 door sedan can be a muscle car right? I'm sitting at 3250lbs right now and a full 113" wheelbase which puts me in solid muscle car range. Just need to double, triple or quadruple my whp.

TheV8Kid said:

pimpm3 said:

I think drag runs should be done on 200tw tires for this class.  Drag slicks don't fit the class ethos.

Uh oh. I may have just been eliminated.

No, you just need more normal force on rear tires...

In reply to Keith Tanner :

add in it must do a burnout and that's a complete high school cool factor metric

How about instead of total Allies points vs total Axis points, we do Average vs average.

Personally I think a critical rule would be that you must run 200 treadwear tires for the entire event, both autocross and drags.

And I think the Allied vs. Axis competition should be a fun team exercise between the two factions . to that end I don't think there should be a true class for individual axis cars. Otherwise you're just creating more classes on top of more classes.

Also, are you following the cam rules that require windows in all positions, ie, no gutted doors

Keith Tanner said:

AngryCorvair said:

Keith Tanner said:

As for front engine - I would define front engine as a car that has the CG of the engine in front of the CG of the driver. Saying it just has to be in front of the rear wheels means there is no distinction between front and mid engined. This also opens up many interesting, hilarious and probably unsafe configurations.

So I'll relocate my controls, whatevs. You'll see me sitting up like im on a farm tractor!

Interesting, hilarious and potentially unsafe. Check, check and check!

*Potentially* unsafe?  I'm offended!

Ram50Ron said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

add in it must do a burnout and that's a complete high school cool factor metric

I'm bringing burnout tires then.

Keith Tanner said:

pimpm3 said:

In reply to Ovid_and_Flem :

Ovid and Flem has a good point.  Do we want a miata vs not miata class or are we looking for something a little different here.  A 96 inch wheelbase rule would be a way to prevent that.

Would it eliminate any other cars inadvertently?

If you're going to write a rule to specifically eliminate Miatas, stop pretending and just outlaw Miatas.

Not at all. A 96 inch wheelbase minimum would eliminate things like V8 powered MG Midget, MGB, tr8, Chevettes, TR6 s, Fiat 124 , spitfires, pintos, fireflys, etcetera. Clearly not muscle cars foreign or domestic

Alright, so im a year into building a v6 miata. Thats coming regardless of the sub class.

I have slicks already for it, but would be willing to take a look at 200tw tires on 14 steelies for the cam class. The rest of the car is cam-s legal (glass, wipers, lights, interior, etc) except for the american part and weight. And no top at all. 

Im going to sit back and watch. Either way this ends, there will be a nitrous fed gm v6 miata there named bockscar. 

Keith Tanner said:

I can build a 2700 hp Miata with 500 hp. Maybe not for $2019 (I'm not like you guys) but 2700 isn't high enough to really cut out the Miatas

Wait...is said Miata 2,700 HP or 500hp? 

What if you have an American body on an English chassis and a Japanese drivertrain?  Does that make you a double spy?

M. As in muscle. Doesn't matter if it's from the US or not, the M should be pretty self explanatory. 

Muscle cars are not a good match with Axis VS Allies. 

The RWD limitation knocks out a heck of a lot of Axis cars (and very few Allie cars), which leaves everyone arguing about Miatas. 

I say if it’s AVA, leave FWD in the mix.  If it’s CAM, forget AVA.

An AVA competition that keeps FWD ends up being a power VS nimble game- just like the Challenge.

The "I know it when I see it" definition.

SVreX said:

Muscle cars are not a good match with Axis VS Allies. 

The RWD limitation knocks out a heck of a lot of Axis cars (and very few Allie cars), which leaves everyone arguing about Miatas. 

I say if it’s AVA, leave FWD in the mix.  If it’s CAM, forget AVA.

An AVA competition that keeps FWD ends up being a power VS nimble game- just like the Challenge.

 

Nobody said it was a fair fight. 

Bring a muscle car. If it's wasn't made that way, make it so. Cars that are on the CAM list fit, the end. Cars not on the CAM list, so all the Axis cars and a hell of a lot of Allies need to be argued in. 

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

Yeah, that probably knocks me out. 

It sounds amusing, but with a team full of high schoolers, I’m gonna have a hard time explaining a “not fair fight”.

We’ll stick to the standard competition, plus perhaps a side bet with Spin_out. 

As I stated earlier, I’d be in for the AVA, but not for a CAM.