Am I a good friend or a jerk?

mad_machine wrote: he's not working.. you have the tools but not a lot of time because you are playing Mr. Mom.. I think he should have it towed to your place and you can coach him how to fix his 911

I actually offered that to him. But he thought he had it figured out. Then last night he comes to borrow a 19mm socket "because I only have one more bolt on the bell-housing. Then I can take it out and see if there's a bolt in there like you said". Then I realized he hadn't borrowed my cherry-picker. I asked him if he was pulling the engine or torque-tube. He looked at me like I just asked why he doesn't dip his oreos in cat poop before he eats them. I explained that you can't just unbold the bell housing from the engine and the torque tube and pull it out.
He just told me he hired a mobile mechanic to finish it for him. I told him to get references and to look for an ASE cert. Oh boy!

Toyman01 wrote: I have a friend that was always needing to be bailed out when he was in his 20s. His much older sisters were forever helping him recover from his poor decisions. In his 30s he was still making poor decisions and getting in binds. He's now 45, has no job, no wife, and lives in a crappy old 10 X 20 office trailer. At this point no one will help him out except his sisters. They have managed to turn him into a fairly worthless individual. I don't see him ever changing at this point. He's still a friend, but he knows better than to ask me for help. My vote is to let him suffer the consequences of his decisions. It will be a learning experience. Hopefully he will recognize it as one. I'm not a jerk, I'm an shiny happy person.

I can vouch for this.

About your bud: the only way he's going to learn is to get hit over the head, it seems. He has dug himself into this hole so now he needs to dig himself out of it. That's called 'tough love' and while it sucks and hurts at the time in the long run he will be better for it. I just hope the responsibility of a baby gets him to get his head out of his ass, for the kid's sake.

curtis73 wrote: This is an old spiritual truth; help isn't necessarily help. Lending money to a crackhead isn't help. NOT lending money IS. You'll have to decide if he will actually be better off with your help or if he needs to do it himself. That is to say, will the amount you help be disproportionate to the amount that a handout will stunt his education?

This^

I have a buddy whom I cut myself off from around ten years ago because it was the only thing that would help him.

He ended up halfway across the country and doing pretty well for himself.

This year, he moved back here and when I went to visit him, he's back to the same old behaviour.

I love the guy but if he won the lottery, I'm sure I'd find him a week later, dead broke and needing a favour.

Shawn

LOL my sisters baby daddy tried pulling that stunt yesterday. His truck broke down on the way to work, and he was able to get a ride to work from a coworker. Left his truck sitting there in a parking lot. So Friday night after working on SWMBO's truck I asked my dad if he wanted to go get it and bring it back to the shop. And we did.

So Saturday morning I go over and look at his truck. He swears its just the gasket for the back plate on the water pump leaking.pour water in the top, watch it pour out the bottom. No way in hell that's a gasket. Call him and tell him to go get a pump and bring it over(actually made a bet with him that if it wasn't a bad pump I would pay for the gasket) he shows up 3 hours later, with a bag of gaskets and parts and hands me a new pump. I've had the old one sitting on the bench for 2.5 hours. So I put it on, button it up and tell him to go fill it with water and run it with water for a few days to make sure nothing else is going to leak.

He then produces valve cover and exhaust manifold gaskets and says those need to be changed too! My exact reaction was "and?" Told him that was on him, and to have fun.

If he showed up 3 hours earlier and asked I might have helped him. Hell if he would have said something before we towed it home I would have hosed everything down in penetrating oil. but I'll ve damned if you ask me to START an exhaust manifold job @ 5pm on a Saturday. Berk that noise.

Dude has talked a big game about working on cars, and he HAD to have a Chevy truck with a 350 cause he "liked that motor". I've had to help him twice before with oil changes, once the filter was on to tight and "needed a screwdriver through it". I slid under the truck and spun it off with my hand. The second he couldn't find the filter on my sisters civic. Again, in and out in less than a minute.

Don't get me wrong, he is good to my sister, holds a fairly steady job as an electrician, treats both of my nieces well(just don't ask the 11 year old, he actually makes her listen to her mother). But dang man, how. hard is an oil change?

Back on topic; no doc, you're not a D bag. Dude wants help and you've got the time to SUPERVISE. Great, if not. Oh well, live with it.

Something about leading a horse to water.....

Sometimes a good friend has to be a jerk. I am all the time to my best friends. Bluntly proves a point.

All signs point to Honda Accord.

friedgreencorrado wrote: The second (and last) new car I ever bought was when my daughter came along. He should be thinking about his kid, not himself. That's what parents *do*.

This. The first new car I (we) ever bought was a base Dodge Caravan. It was spring of 1992 and we seriously wanted to be shopping Miatae for my wife. Instead we bought a dull but massively useful, cost-effective, and dead-nuts reliable family hauler.

You're not being a jerk. Your friend sounds like my nephew, and a long series of similar helping hands from people hasn't done him a damn bit of meaningful good in 20 years.

mndsm wrote:

mad_machine wrote: he's not working.. you have the tools but not a lot of time because you are playing Mr. Mom.. I think he should have it towed to your place and you can coach him how to fix his 911

This- if you're feeling nice. I wouldn't go beyond that. Anytime you act as a crutch, he's not going to learn to walk, as it were. I quit helping friends like that a LONG time ago. I just sit and watch them berkeley themselves harder.

What they said!

My philosophy for charity of any kind is "never get out of the lifeboat". If you can help your friend without burning cash or home-karma points, then by all means, that is what friends are for. But if it is going to lower the quality of your domestic life, then let him solve his own issues.

So he has a newborn...and he bought a cheap old Porsche as a daily driver. What could go wrong?

Tell him you won't touch the Porsche but you will gladly help him work on a vehicle that is appropriate for his situation. And stop lending him tools.

slefain wrote: ...but you will gladly help him work on a vehicle that is appropriate for his situation...

berkeley that noise.

When my kids were born they rode in the back of an E30 with 200k on it, a Toyota PU with jump seats and then an old ac 911. All were my DD at the time and all were occasionally in need of something before they would move under their own power. I would argue all were "appropriate". Mediocrity is for the mediocre.

FWIW though to the topic, I don't fix anything for anyone unless they are in my garage dressed and ready to do the grunt work or trade something in return (week at their shore house, good scotch, handies... etc) unless they are really in a bind. When a "bind" happens too often... I reconsider whether they are a good friend to me.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: When my kids were born they rode in the back of an E30 with 200k on it, a Toyota PU with jump seats and then an old ac 911. All were my DD at the time and all were occasionally in need of something before they would move under their own power. I would argue all were "appropriate". Mediocrity is for the mediocre.

I agree with this, but we are a different group of folks here. Many of us have the ability, and usually the tools to pull of fairly major stuff. He does not. I mentioned (before he lost his job Friday) that he should really roll on down to Sears or the equivalent and drop $300 on a starter tool set.
Like slefain said, I ain't loaning him any more tools. That's a line I usually do NOT cross. I've had too many tools loaned out and either come back brokeded or or not at all.
My brother-in-law used my Snap-On torque wrench to try to break the pinion nut on his CJ7 "because it was longer than my breaker bar".

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

slefain wrote: ...but you will gladly help him work on a vehicle that is appropriate for his situation...

berkeley that noise. When my kids were born they rode in the back of an E30 with 200k on it, a Toyota PU with jump seats and then an old ac 911. All were my DD at the time and all were occasionally in need of something before they would move under their own power. I would argue all were "appropriate". Mediocrity is for the mediocre. FWIW though to the topic, I don't fix anything for anyone unless they are in my garage dressed and ready to do the grunt work or trade something in return (week at their shore house, good scotch, handies... etc) unless they are really in a bind. When a "bind" happens too often... I reconsider whether they are a good friend to me.

So in this guy's case it's OK for him to put himself and his family in a jam all in the interest of not being 'mediocre'?

Um, no. He swapped a boring but reliable DD for an older AC Porsche for 'stylin' and profilin' which he obviously cannot afford and doesn't know how to properly repair. That makes him an absolute dumbberkeley in my book. Might be a helluva nice guy but not real bright.

My hard and fast rule, which comes from the experience of driving Brit cars as DD's for a good many years: with a family relying on me a reliable DD is of paramount importance. My toy cars are just that, toys.

It doesn't mean I wouldn't try to help some if it were my friend (and I've had a few like that, also family members) but there is a limit to my time and generosity. I am not here to shore up someone else's desire to drive a 'lookit me' car, I have enough trouble keeping my fleet alive.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: FWIW though to the topic, I don't fix anything for anyone unless they are in my garage dressed and ready to do the grunt work or trade something in return (week at their shore house, good scotch, handies... etc) unless they are really in a bind. When a "bind" happens too often... I reconsider whether they are a good friend to me.

That is about how I was thinking about this. If you have the free time to come over to his place and help him work on the car - with him doing a lot of the heavy lifting - it would be the nice thing to do. If you don't have the time, you don't have the time, and do not need to feel bad for being unable to provide help you cannot provide.

DrBoost wrote: My brother-in-law used my Snap-On torque wrench to try to break the pinion nut on his CJ7 "because it was longer than my breaker bar".

Egad. I think I finally understand why "rage comics" exist.

It is possible to be both.

Curmudgeon wrote:

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

slefain wrote: ...but you will gladly help him work on a vehicle that is appropriate for his situation...

berkeley that noise. When my kids were born they rode in the back of an E30 with 200k on it, a Toyota PU with jump seats and then an old ac 911. All were my DD at the time and all were occasionally in need of something before they would move under their own power. I would argue all were "appropriate". Mediocrity is for the mediocre. FWIW though to the topic, I don't fix anything for anyone unless they are in my garage dressed and ready to do the grunt work or trade something in return (week at their shore house, good scotch, handies... etc) unless they are really in a bind. When a "bind" happens too often... I reconsider whether they are a good friend to me.

So in this guy's case it's OK for him to put himself and his family in a jam all in the interest of not being 'mediocre'? Um, no. He swapped a boring but reliable DD for an older AC Porsche for 'stylin' and profilin' which he obviously cannot afford and doesn't know how to properly repair. That makes him an absolute dumbberkeley in my book. Might be a helluva nice guy but not real bright. My hard and fast rule, which comes from the experience of driving Brit cars as DD's for a good many years: with a family relying on me a reliable DD is of paramount importance. My toy cars are just that, toys. It doesn't mean I wouldn't try to help some if it were my friend (and I've had a few like that, also family members) but there is a limit to my time and generosity. I am not here to shore up someone else's desire to drive a 'lookit me' car, I have enough trouble keeping my fleet alive.

I don't have a problem with what he drives. If he wants to tote his kid around in a Peterbuilt or a Model T or even a ragged out Porsche, I'm good with that. Hell, my wife's DD is a 180K mile Jeep and I send my daughter 100 miles away to college, in a 160K mile Camaro. All my cars are high mileage and basically worn out if you ask the general public. But, I've got spares, and know how fix them or afford to pay someone else to.

My problem is he can't, won't or can't afford to fix it and knowing that, he still bought one of the most expensive cars to repair, and thought it would be a good DD. The friend I posted about earlier bought a worn out POS F350 diesel dually to be his DD. It had issues when he bought it and he could barely afford to put fuel in it. He's had it for 6-7 years. It's run about 2 of those years because he can't fix it and has no money. I offered to buy it from him at probably twice what it's worth, but he won't sell it. He wanted me to pay to fix it and use it when I wanted to tow my race trailer. I bought another truck instead. He's still a little pissed about that.

There are a pile of beater BMW 7 series cars running around here. They are all driven by people that can't afford to fix them when they die. They will probably miss work when that happens. I won't feel sorry for them. The only way people like that will change their thought processes, is to suffer the consequences of their decisions. There was a reason I drove a POS Ford Pinto for a long time. It wasn't because I thought they were cool.

Hey I was responsible and bought a Volvo wagon when my daughter was born. Wanna help me with the tie rods and ball joints? I can provide any of the items GPS mentioned in his post.

bastomatic wrote: Hey I was responsible and bought a Volvo wagon when my daughter was born. Wanna help me with the tie rods and ball joints? I can provide any of the items GPS mentioned in his post.

Ask me like that and the answer is yes. Michigan is a little far though.

Here is another one for you.

I have two BILs. One is 30. I won't even answer the phone when he calls because I know it's a car question and I know he won't follow advice.

The other is 19. He came to me and asked for help buying a cheap used car. He had picked out 4 that were in his price range that he liked. I shot down one right off the bat because it was a beat to death BMW. He ended up buying a $1800, high mileage, Miata. I suggested he buy a manual for it and some tools and gave him a list of repairs I thought it needed. A week later he showed up at my house with a tool set, a new top and Hayes manual and a couple of bags of supplies. He wanted help changing the top, oil, belts and hoses and flushing the coolant. He had never worked on a car before in his life. At the end of the day, he was nasty, tired and proud. I did almost no work on the car because he did all of it. I answer questions, offered advice, an extra hand when needed and supplied the tools his kit didn't have. When he was done my shop was cleaner than when he started. I will help him work on a car any time he asks.

bastomatic wrote: Hey I was responsible and bought a Volvo wagon when my daughter was born. Wanna help me with the tie rods and ball joints? I can provide any of the items GPS mentioned in his post.

Sure. C'mon over. As much as I like a handie... bring scotch or the keys to the shore house unless you have unusually supple hands.

In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:

Always good for a laugh. Thanks.

In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:

I do moisturize...

Toyman01 wrote:

bastomatic wrote: Hey I was responsible and bought a Volvo wagon when my daughter was born. Wanna help me with the tie rods and ball joints? I can provide any of the items GPS mentioned in his post.

Ask me like that and the answer is yes. Michigan is a little far though. Here is another one for you. I have two BILs. One is 30. I won't even answer the phone when he calls because I know it's a car question and I know he won't follow advice. The other is 19. He came to me and asked for help buying a cheap used car. He had picked out 4 that were in his price range that he liked. I shot down one right off the bat because it was a beat to death BMW. He ended up buying a $1800, high mileage, Miata. I suggested he buy a manual for it and some tools and gave him a list of repairs I thought it needed. A week later he showed up at my house with a tool set, a new top and Hayes manual and a couple of bags of supplies. He wanted help changing the top, oil, belts and hoses and flushing the coolant. He had never worked on a car before in his life. At the end of the day, he was nasty, tired and proud. I did almost no work on the car because he did all of it. I answer questions, offered advice, an extra hand when needed and supplied the tools his kit didn't have. When he was done my shop was cleaner than when he started. I will help him work on a car any time he asks.

You're doin' it right.

On another board I frequent, a regular sold a Mercedes E320 wagon and bought a 4Runner because he was just disgusted with fixing the damn thing all the time. I guarantee you whoever bought that E320 is proud as Punch to be driving a Mercedes. Given that it was a 1998, it's not likely the buyer was in a position to buy new so they bought one in their price range. BIG mistake.

When (not if) it breaks reality will set in: for the same money he/she/it could have bought a newer Camry etc which would be cheaper and easier to fix. But nooooo, he/she/it had to have a Mercedes.

I have no sympathy for people who do that. They dig their own holes and ruin their own lives in order stroke their egos and present an image.

There's a reason I DD a rock reliable 200k mile Trooper and leave the Britmobiles in the garage. At some point said Trooper may need to be replaced and you can bet it won't be with a Land Rover, M class or whatever BMW calls their SUV's.

That so explains the 97 Range Rover I have