Marjorie Suddard wrote: So the real answer is no, I'm not pulling, pumping or hoarding. Except the Spam. That stuff is good as hell. It and the Viennas are all belong to me. Margie
you know what's good for you and you'll save a few of those damn Viennies for me.
IF you know what's good.
jg
Who would have thought?
"Viennies" and "good for you" written in the same sentence.
fornetti14 wrote: Not moving any money or 401(k), just buying through payroll deductions as usual. THE MARKET IS FINALLY ON SALE PEOPLE!!!!!
Damn straight. Short term loss; long-term gain. I wish I could increase my deduction percentage more than once a year... I'm 38 years old... I'm still in the buying stage of life... I don't have to worry about selling for another couple of decades... at which point I'ld start shifting to less volatile investments.
Bank account-wise... there's not enough there to be concerned about... my 401(k) is my main savings for now.
I went to bed last night just a poor maintenance man, and woke up this morning to find out that I'm part owner of a huge insurance company, so I'm pretty stoked.
On the other hand, most of my assets are very liquid; my barn is full of priceless collectibles..
Yesterday, one of my banks felt the need to send me an e-mail telling me how healthy they are, and how safe and wonderfull it is to keep my money in them. Just out of the blue. A cheery "life is wonderfull with us" e-mail.
At the same time FDIC requested a treasury loan. They said they barely have the assets to cover the claims they've got right now, and cannot handle any more without help.
Wife and I talked last night, mattress stuffing will commence now.
I have the distinct impression that very soon I'm going to have a much better understanding of the crash of 29 and the great depression.
I most sincerely hope I'm wrong.
The price of gold is at new high with investors going back to traditional commodities.
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/18/less-than-zero/
T-bills now worth nothing.
Krugman is a damn good economist.. if he's facinated and scared at the same time... I'm scared.
my .02 if you are scared of the banks collapsing what makes you think that currency will be worth anything? the gold that is supposed to be behind it will be worth something. invest in tangibles if you are really that worried. currency is only worth the paper it is written on when E36 M3 really hits the fan.
internetautomart wrote: my .02 if you are scared of the banks collapsing what makes you think that currency will be worth anything? the gold that is supposed to be behind it will be worth something. invest in tangibles if you are really that worried. currency is only worth the paper it is written on when E36 M3 really hits the fan.
Gold hasn't been behind our currency for over half a century. It's backed by "faith" today.
An arguement over the worth of currency in the event of a global or at least a national collapse is worthwhile, but distinctly different than the effect of a bank collapse.
Currency in hand, even greatly devalued, is worth more than an empty palm.
In a total economic crash, I'm not sure gold would be worth much to most people in a time of need. I mean really, if most of the nearby population is scrambling for basic neccessities, what good would gold do for any of them - short-term, anyway.
Oh sure, there would be someone out there(or in other parts of the world)who was better prepared & was more than willing to take advantage of anyone who actually had gold(for a vastly reduced value), but I'd imagine for most people in most places, simple bartering would probably become the common method....well, bartering, theft & violence, anyway. 
Way back when, pepper was worth its weight in gold all across Europe. Does that mean pepper was expensive or gold was cheap? Of course, now pepper costs nearly nothing. If there's no food, you can't buy it with gold. This makes gold worthless in such a case. So what good would hoarding gold be?
The point: the value of ANYTHING in a barter or monetary exchange economy of any type is all in the head of the buyer and/or seller. In the case of a total economic collapse, theft would become rampant and human life even cheaper than it is now.
Nice thought, huh? Along with: no place on Earth is more than three missed meals away from a revolution.
Jensenman wrote: Way back when, pepper was worth its weight in gold all across Europe.
I thought that was salt.
... as in salty sea dog. Arrgh!
Actually, both were. Pepper was one of the spices which were brought from China by overland caravans and this made it terribly expensive. Columbus listed it as one of the things he hoped to find on his westward trip.
Since our goverment seems dead set on putting all of us in debt to "save" irresponsible lenders and borrowers(bush just announced a new plan). I kinda wish people would run on the bank.
If the banks were to fail before the goverment can save them then so much the better. I really really don't want to use my tax dollars to save their sorry butts...
I'm 30. This same thing is going to happen at least 5 more times before I ever withdraw a dime. Yawn.
I didn't blame bush for the problem, I blame him for the solution to the problem
I don't pretend to be an expert on the economy, My intent was to express my dissatisfaction with spending my tax dollars on saving people who :
a) should have known better
b) have a hell of a lot more money than me
I honestly don't have that much to loose.
Ignorant Anarchist thought of the day:
If we all take our money out of the bank and put it under a mattress. Wouldn't we shrink the money supply enough to encourage price deflation? Wouldn't we earn more money with the dollar deflating at say 1% under our mattress than we would with it in the savings account? and a 5% inflation rate?
my $14.xx is staying where it is, then it will get some friends from direct deposit. After that it gets pulled out and sent to State Farm.
I bank with BofA. They have enough money to buy up all the morons who are folding. I'm not worried about the state of my financial institution.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=a4q2..MUPsoA&refer=us
^^^ Some interesting statements ^^^
Salanis wrote: I bank with BofA. They have enough money to buy up all the morons who are folding. I'm not worried about the state of my financial institution.
Looks to me like they are spending all their money buying morons in hopes that they too can receive a gubment bailout.
if the banks fail to the point where our bank accounts are wiped out, paper money wont be worth anything anyhow, not that its worth much now...FDIC my arse, with a deficit of almost 14 digits (trillion?) wheres the $$ going to come from to give me back my $134.23? should I have gold? silver? bah, i think ill invest in cases of jack daniels, cartons of cigarettes, and two thousand rounds for my SKS , cause when crap hits the fan, nothing beats the bargaining power of booze and butts, and an assault riffle to make sure the deal goes right... 
Capt Slow wrote: If we all take our money out of the bank and put it under a mattress. Wouldn't we shrink the money supply enough to encourage price deflation?
Hi Captain Slow,
It would be physically impossible for more than a small fraction of people to take their money out of the bank because it simply doesn’t exist.
Once we went off the gold standard, something known as marginal lending was allowed to propagate to the point we’re at today where there’s little more than people’s confidence in the US dollar to serve as backing. Take a look at a bill and you’ll see the inscription “This note is legal tender for all debts public & private”…what the treasury is really saying is “this is a nearly worthless piece of paper but you have no choice but to accept it in exchange for goods & services”.
Marginal lending simply means that banks are empowered to create money out of thin air in the form of loans with nothing more than a person’s promise to pay it back. Most people think loans are secured by cash deposits in the form of T-Bills, Bonds, etc. but if you just think about it for a moment, you’ll realize how absurdly impossible that is…how many people do you know that have bonds worth more than a house, a couple of cars, and perhaps a business…now how many people do you know that have home loans, car loans, and business loans. Get the point…there’s a whole lot more loans floating around than there is cash to back them. Our system of marginal lending must fail at some point because when you take out a loan, you don’t just pay it back, you pay it back with interest. Where does the money for the interest come from…it’s not like the house or car or business somehow becomes more valuable because you paid interest. The only way to “create” the money to pay the interest is to constantly & exponentially increase the number of new loans being issued and this is not a sustainable process as our resources (land, material, energy, etc) are more or less finite.
No one wants to talk about it but a total melt down is almost inevitable at some point. The only way out is to engineer a soft landing by gradually eliminating marginal lending allowances and by returning to a standard of value whether it be gold or labor hours or whatever. I’m not a huge Ron Paul fan but the guy was absolutely right when he talked about this and as we all know, all he got for his efforts was to be laughed at and written off as a tin foil hat nut job…again, no one wants to talk about it.
RX Reven' wrote:Capt Slow wrote: If we all take our money out of the bank and put it under a mattress. Wouldn't we shrink the money supply enough to encourage price deflation?Hi Captain Slow, It would be physically impossible for more than a small fraction of people to take their money out of the bank because it simply doesn’t exist. Once we went off the gold standard, something known as marginal lending was allowed to propagate to the point we’re at today where there’s little more than people’s confidence in the US dollar to serve as backing. Take a look at a bill and you’ll see the inscription “This note is legal tender for all debts public & private”…what the treasury is really saying is “this is a nearly worthless piece of paper but you have no choice but to accept it in exchange for goods & services”. Marginal lending simply means that banks are empowered to create money out of thin air in the form of loans with nothing more than a person’s promise to pay it back. Most people think loans are secured by cash deposits in the form of T-Bills, Bonds, etc. but if you just think about it for a moment, you’ll realize how absurdly impossible that is…how many people do you know that have bonds worth more than a house, a couple of cars, and perhaps a business…now how many people do you know that have home loans, car loans, and business loans. Get the point…there’s a whole lot more loans floating around than there is cash to back them. Our system of marginal lending must fail at some point because when you take out a loan, you don’t just pay it back, you pay it back with interest. Where does the money for the interest come from…it’s not like the house or car or business somehow becomes more valuable because you paid interest. The only way to “create” the money to pay the interest is to constantly & exponentially increase the number of new loans being issued and this is not a sustainable process as our resources (land, material, energy, etc) are more or less finite. No one wants to talk about it but a total melt down is almost inevitable at some point. The only way out is to engineer a soft landing by gradually eliminating marginal lending allowances and by returning to a standard of value whether it be gold or labor hours or whatever. I’m not a huge Ron Paul fan but the guy was absolutely right when he talked about this and as we all know, all he got for his efforts was to be laughed at and written off as a tin foil hat nut job…again, no one wants to talk about it.
some one knows about the awesome FAIL! that is the federal reserve......and the funny thing is, part of the things that made us revolt from britan were fear of a central bank, then after the 1907 crash when everyone got scared and withdrew their money we established the central bank after morgan fairchild bought up all those banks that failed. the reasoning behind it was that our economy would be less likely to crash then a bunch of small banks, well after that came the depression. the federal reserve isn't even a federal insitution! its privately owned! thats just silly. and as for the gold standard? kennedy tried to enact a silver standard, but he was shot after he passed the executive order. no president since has ratified that order, the only one to acknowladge it was reagan, and he just passed an order that stopped it. our economic system is kinda silly, our money is not worth any thing, its just a debt. our government pays to have money circulated, aprox. $1.60 for every doller issued. that money to pay that debt comes from us, paid for by money issued from them. man i hate banks!
I'm bumming. I can retire in 10 months at 56 and was going to. I have a 401(k) that just lost $52,000 and I just got a phone call from Merril-Lynch advising me to pull everything out, they will forward the form in the mail.
I've trimmed back the car projects, I'm drinking cheaper beer and except for a train trip to NYC I can't remember the last vacation I took. My pissy little retirement is hard pressed to recover from a $56k loss. I know it's a hiccup, but I may have to commute for a few more years.
Sux.
irony alert.. Irony Alert
"We do not support government bailouts of private institutions. Government interference in the markets exacerbates problems in the marketplace and causes the free market to take longer to correct itself."
-- The 2008 Republican Party Platform, adopted earlier this month.
bail outs are crap... period..
Irony alert has passed
http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Economy.htm
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