Camping / survival thread

I live at the base of the Blue Mountains here in eastern Oregon. You can bet the mountains would be crawling with people all of which would make it hell for any incoming force. Out here during hunting season EVERYONE has tags, heck this one friend of mine she is a dancer maybe 100 pounds soaking wet goes hunting every year.

My problem with the plastic compasses and also with the wood handled hatchet: too easy to break. Even if the tritium goes dim ont the mil version, I can still use it during the day and being made of metal there's much less chance of it getting smashed if I do something stupid and lose my footing. Yes I am a klutz.

If it came down to having to carry a weapon, I'd do a crossbow before a gun. The bolts can be recovered and reused or in a pinch new ones can be made from wood. Not to mention they are pretty quiet.

Having already lived in a derilict camper in the woods I would just go back to that. Maybe cover it with a 3-D camo tarp

Or if I was to live out of a Kayak or canoe presents a nice compormise. You can carry more than with back packing, and travel father and faster, with out some off the short comings of vehicles( gas supply, break downs...)

Jensenman wrote: My problem with the plastic compasses and also with the wood handled hatchet: too easy to break.

I'm pretty certain we have a concensus on this site about crumby tools, and the frustration that results from them.

Y'all are some cool folks; I figured this thread would get a pretty good response. Although I didn't intend for it to be a nuclear meltdown/hide in the wood kind of subject, it's kind of the same thing. Mostly I've been just thinking about moving towards simplicity, and de-cluttering my life in general. I guess it's always been a dream/fantasy of mine to "live off the land". Of late I've become very wary of gadgets and such. Maybe it's just me, but it seems we are becoming more and more dependent on stuff we really don't need. Granted, cell phones and GPS systems are way cool, but do we really need to carry an iPod into the woods? What use is a USB port when you are trying to trap a rabbit (or armaldillo)? It just seems to me that we have strayed from our "roots".

i would enjoy living off the grid... solar power, with a generator backup. and satelite dish.

Yeah, all the tech toys are cool but for true woods survival they are useful only if the infrastructure behind them stays in place. Take the GPS or a satellite phone; what if something were to take down the satellite net? Might as well use it for a fishing sinker. Cell phone? Get out of range of a tower and it's just dead weight.

IMHO we are way too dependent on electronic gadgetry (remarks the guy who fiddles with computers all the time). All it would take is a few strategically placed nukes to generate an EMP (electromagnetic pulse) which would just plain fry all those fun little toys. For that matter, a big enough solar flare could wreak havoc as well. Then what?

If I was going to go off the power grid, I think I'd go hydro. Of course this means picking the right piece of property, sizeable pond, dam construction etc but it wouldn't be dependent on sunlight or deliveries of fuel.

^ What he said.^

Heck to keep you on the road you can always build a still and make your own alchy fuel. Wouldn't be as efficient as gas but it would be something. Heck I'd just have ask my grandpa and he could educate me on the production process, his brother was a moon shiner from way back in the day.

Now THIS is a thread I can get into...

In highschool, me and a few fellow scouts did some real "survival" style camping a bunch of times. It got to the point where we'd compete to see who could do more with less.

While you most certainly could survive the 3 or so days we'd go out with nothing, that's no fun. Here's what I'd say is my "this E36 M3 stays with me in my car etc" list:
Ka-bar sized knife (Duh).
"Bat suit" rain poncho. Emergency blanket would work too (shelter, rain catcher). This plus a stick a little higher than your sitting height makes a decent tent.
Mil-Surplus tripwire (best thing for snares I've found).

The rest of this post is reserved for later tonight when I'll have time to talk about a "bug-out" bag.

Osterizer wrote: The rest of this post is reserved for later tonight when I'll have time to talk about a "bug-out" bag.

In my original post, I refered to a similar receptacle as a "crap bag", which is obviously not what I really call it (out of respect for the site and the language filters). I like the term " bug-out" bag even better. Thanks for that. I look forward to your epic post. Make it good.

I'd like to defend the gadgets: It'd be one hell of a doomsday scenario for GPS to go down, we're talking AT LEAST full Mad Max-style dystopia or (totally counterproductive in any situation) an attack on the satellites. Don't forget airliners and many other systems rely on GPS. There are loads of satellites flying around up there that will keep transmitting as long as they get sunlight. Even if a few collide or fall into the atmosphere there will be more than enough left. You only need 3~4 to get your position, when I'm using my GPS I often have more than 11 available.

Also the PDA I chose: The cell phone/internet applications are just a small, nonessential part of it. It works as a gigantic notepad, camera, navigation aid and entertainment device. I'd say that makes it worth taking. The cranking flashlight doubles as a charger for the electronics. I think it's a very good setup.

I notice many of you chose firearms, what would cavemen with their simple, trusty spears and bows think about taking a relatively delicate device with many moving parts and non-reusable projectiles that you'd need metalworking tools to fix? (mind you my bow is a compound bow I'd have no hope in hell of fixing, but my point is that it's the same situation.)

We always called it a "Go Bag".

On compasses - I've always preferred using the orienteering style compasses. Yes, they're plastic. The good ones do just fine. Silva, Brunton, etc. I still have the Silva I started in Boy Scouts with, and it works as well as ever. I don't know exactly how I could accidentally break it. Very easy to use and very versatile.

During my Army career, I learned to hate the issue-style lensatic compass. So that I could have a neat compass with accurate sighting that I wouldn't have to sign for or turn in, I got a Swiss Recta compass. (Love the compass, snicker at the name.) It slides into its box, has luminous sights and a mirror for getting pretty good azimuths. It survived 9 years of active duty including Desert Storm, and a bunch of scouting outings. Yes, it's in my Go Bag.

Leatherman, Multiplier, etc > Swiss Army knives.

You can do better than Kabar.

GameboyRMH wrote: I notice many of you chose firearms, what would cavemen with their simple, trusty spears and bows think about taking a relatively delicate device with many moving parts and non-reusable projectiles that you'd need metalworking tools to fix?

The American Indians - essentially stoneage tribes when the Europeans arrived - took to firearms as quickly as they could get their hands on them.
When and if cavemen run out of ammo or break a part they can't fix, they'd go make another bow - and look for a gun to trade for, beg, borrow, or steal.

Gameboy lives under an oppressive political system that denies the people the basic Human Right of Firearm Ownership. Thus, he thinks in terms of bows and arrows (also likely regulated or soon to be, as knives are in the UK now) instead of actual useful tools like a Winchester Model 70.

Last month, we went 7 days without electricity during the ice storm. I came up with a list of stuff that comes in real handy and stuff that I want to keep around for next time. I already live in the woods.

Have you guys seen The Hunted http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0269347/ ? Tommy Lee Jones does the survival thing, makes his own weapons, etc.

Dr. Hess wrote: Gameboy lives under an oppressive political system that denies the people the basic Human Right of Firearm Ownership. Thus, he thinks in terms of bows and arrows (also likely regulated or soon to be, as knives are in the UK now) instead of actual useful tools like a Winchester Model 70.

Wait, what? No.

GameboyRMH wrote: ... what would cavemen with their simple, trusty spears and bows think about taking a relatively delicate device with many moving parts and non-reusable projectiles that you'd need metalworking tools to fix?

They'd love it! Didn't you notice how rapidly the american indians switched? A firearm has much further range and greater power.

Ever tried to defend yourself with a bow and arrow?

I'll chose my Winchest 97, which is not delicate on nay relative scale.

I think you guys totally missed my point. I was comparing the argument against using GPS in favor of a regular compass to an argument for using primitive weapons over firearms - there are some avantages but overall the newer technology is more effective despite it's drawbacks.

And Hess, I'm finding the way you seem to take offense at the very existence of other countries...offensive.

Other countries don't bother me. I've been around the world 3 times, once entirely by ship, and I've seen the Third World extensively. How about you? If your little island doesn't want you to be armed (easier to tax that way, you know), I have no problem with that. What bothers me is other countries trying to tell us in the U.S. what to do, who to vote for, what kind of fuel system to use, what weapons we can have, how to murder our children, etc.

We need parking lots everywhere. More parking lots means more Autocrossing.

Didn't I see this in a movie?

I think you need a Chevrolet 4x4 to start........

Ooooh, you hate the world because you've seen it all, at least now I can understand where you're coming from.

And if you're sick of other countries telling the US stuff, you really don't want to be in one of those other countries where the US doesn't tell you anything - they just do stuff to you and maybe ask if you have a problem with it. Your first indication may be your marijuana fields suddenly being on fire, your ass suddenly being extradited for no good reason, or if you're lucky, just a Galaxy landing and a bunch of Hummers pouring out of it. If you're really unlucky it may be your neighborhood suddenly being a pile of rubble.

And you can own guns here, you just have to fill out some more paperwork.

this wont end well

I don't hate the world, GB, even the icky parts like the Horn of Africa, the Persian Gulf or Louisianna. Well, maybe Louisianna. And I'll freely admit to not being fond of the PG, future site of the Great Autocross Track and Lake United States. And if a C5 lands on your house or a AC130 drops a 105 in your yard, sorry 'bout that. You probably asked for it.

Hey Pete, Red Dawn. Best Movie Evar. Or, "Dirty Dancing with Kalashnikovs" as I call it. Problem with that Chebby is the radiator isn't bullet resistant.

OK, here's my list of Stuff To Have for when The Power Goes Out, somewhat realted to Camping/Survival.

Large 110V inverter 7-8KW generator with full house switch Romex with plug ends (long extension cord) Storage battery with trickle charger system Digital Micro TV (analog is so yesterday) Batteries for micro TV Camping oven/range Camp stove 6-10 propane cylinders (small kind) Many LED flashlights with batteries Washtub 1-2 weeks of seasoned firewood assorted lighters Kerosene/lamp oil lamp wicks 5 gal gasoline with Stabil, rotated every 6 months Wind-up alarm clock Paper plates

NYG95GA wrote:

Osterizer wrote: The rest of this post is reserved for later tonight when I'll have time to talk about a "bug-out" bag.

In my original post, I refered to a similar receptacle as a "crap bag", which is obviously not what I really call it (out of respect for the site and the language filters). I like the term " bug-out" bag even better. Thanks for that. I look forward to your epic post. Make it good.

Here's Osterizer's "oh E36 M3 it's the end of the world as we know it, grab what you can carry and let's get the hell out of here" bug-out bag (or at least tonight's, as it changes everytime I think about it):
One or two of those metal waterbottles (full).
4 pack of Bics: Lighters may be "cheating" for survival campers, but this bag isn't built for a hobby.
"Firebugs" basically paraffin soaked cloth with a wick. Fire good.
Good multitool. I'll take a Leatherman Charge or Core, thanks!
2 good flashlights. Surefire makes a model that'll do 100 hours on a set of batteries.
Israeli bandages, antibiotics, First Aid kit.
Poncho/ emergency blanket.
2 MREs.
Wool socks.
Topo maps+ compass (pretty damn hard to break a map).
GPS (would be VERY nice to have if it still works).
Flares, chemlights.
1 set of season appropriate clothing.
Woodsman's Pal.
Another fixed-blade (Tom Brown Tracker= yes please).
550 cord. Lots.
Hooks and fishing line.
Depending on knowledge a book on wild plants would be nice to have, too.

And every good fictional BOB needs an awesome gun. A .22 would work fine, but recently, I've been really, really hankering for a Kel-Tec SU-16C. AR-15 internals, folding stock, built-in bipod... 25" folded. Do want.

^^^That's a pretty darn comprehensive list. In addition, I'd try to bring some water-purification tablets, a pair of binoculars and as much long-lasting food as I could carry.

Really, though, in the event of a zombie outbreak or similar disaster situation, I'd aim to commandeer someone's diesel 4WD rather than trying to escape on foot.