Can anyone help me out with the whole Standing Rock standoff?

In reply to RealMiniParker:

Sure, but that is literally taking a part of your front yard. Think they would do the same for an oil line crossing upstream from you?

In reply to RealMiniParker:

I do remember an NPR article where the state and the Feds said they sent about 8 notifications and no one responded.

Hmm. Maybe they should have tweeted instead.

In reply to Fueled by Caffeine:

We've started tweeting out bus and subway delays. People are bitching that we pay someone to play in the Internet.

Mister Fister wrote:

NEALSMO wrote: Eminent domain used for private profit is where it crosses the line for me. Besides, that pipeline will be used to transfer the oil to a port to then export. Not helping our domestic oil shortage at all.

what domestic oil shortage? We're currently one of the top producers of oil on the planet and a net EXPORTER because we make more oil than we can consume. Are you just making stuff up at this point? Are you a spambot?

Then why do we import about 10 million barrels of oil per day?

Sorry, but the fact is we import twice as much oil as we export. Move along

Are you some kind of petroleum industry spambot?

Anyone know if they even have the permit to cross the river yet?
Last I heard the Army Corp of Engineers had not approved the permit to run the pipe in the disputed area anyway.

NEALSMO wrote:

Mister Fister wrote:

NEALSMO wrote: Eminent domain used for private profit is where it crosses the line for me. Besides, that pipeline will be used to transfer the oil to a port to then export. Not helping our domestic oil shortage at all.

what domestic oil shortage? We're currently one of the top producers of oil on the planet and a net EXPORTER because we make more oil than we can consume. Are you just making stuff up at this point? Are you a spambot?

Then why do we import about 10 million barrels of oil per day? Sorry, but the fact is we import twice as much oil as we export. Move along Are you some kind of petroleum industry spambot?

That is Ann interesting definition of "fact" I've seen in a while https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/pet_move_wkly_dc_NUS-Z00_mbblpd_w.htm That shows that we produce approximately 8.9M barrels per day. Yet we import 8.8M barrels Per day. Not even close to "twice". In fact it shows that we are currently exporting about. 1.2m barrels per week net. So sure would be nice to a source for your numbers.

Even More interesting is our #1 importer is Canada. In fact they import more oil than all the OPEC countries combined.

In reply to Toyman01:

The latest plan is 50 feet from the edge of the road.

Bobzilla wrote: Even More interesting is our #1 importer is Canada. In fact they import more oil than all the OPEC countries combined.

Eia.gov Has all sorts of interesting stats on energy for the US and around the world depending on the subject. Canada has been our biggest importer for a few years now. EIA.Gov FAQ

Found another article that graphed it for me:

In reply to Bobzilla:

eia link

We import 9.7 million barrels per day and export 4.7 million per day (2015)

RealMiniParker wrote: In reply to Toyman01: The latest plan is 50 feet from the edge of the road.

Ouch.

NEALSMO wrote: In reply to Bobzilla: eia link We import 9.7 million barrels per day and export 4.7 million per day (2015)

That's EXPORT, not produce. here shows we produce around 280M barrels per month, or ~9.3M barrels per day. So we're not importing twice as much as we're producing.

Think of it like a business.... we can buy it cheaper from Canada, sell it for more on the open market while producing enough to cover our needs which also makes money. It's like buying a car while building a car to use, then selling the car you bought for more than you paid for it while covering the costs of hte car you built.

For 2015 we imported approximatel 3.4B barrels of oil. We produced 3.4B barrels of our own oil. We exported 1.7B.

In reply to Bobzilla:

"In 2015, the United States exported about 4.7 MMb/d of petroleum to 147 countries. Most of the exports were petroleum products. The resulting net imports (imports minus exports) of petroleum were about 4.7 MMb/d."

I said we import twice as much as we export. You claimed I was wrong and wanted a source. I gave you the (valid) source that supports exactly what I said. Where is the disconnect Bobzilla?

Dr. Hess wrote: Here is a post that I found interesting:

big rock Nov 28, 2016 6:19 PM As noted before I live 25 miles from this "protest". I must say the above article is about as ill-informed, uninformed and moronic as any I've read about the issue. It's "factless". As an example, and I won't take anyones time for a hundred more, there was no "water cannon"; it was a fire truck called out-with small town volunteer firemen-to put out grass fires ignited by the "protesters"....who commenced to slash the tires on the fire truck. The fact is the protesters are on private property (not gov't. property).

A comment in this page: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-11-28/tyranny-standing-rock-governments-divide-and-conquer-strategy-working

This statement is an outright lie. There is video of them spraying protestors with a water hose and no "grass fires ignited by the protestors" in sight. So the irony of the "factless" claim is not lost on me. Is this the post-truth world we live in now?

Grassfires?

yep, lots of fire

Only recently has it been legal to export raw crude. Until then, all of our exports were distilled products.

In reply to NEALSMO:

Dude he cited zerohedge. Just ignore.

Three pages and I still have no idea who's telling the truth. I rank SJWs at the same level as corporate lawyers when it comes to telling the truth and there doesn't appear to be any journalists left who can report a story without cherry picking the facts to support their bias. If anyone knows of a news source that presents unbiased information I'd love to hear about it. I've given up on the main U.S. sources and even BBC news has become a disappointment. This is one time when I wish the Feds would step in, clear out the band wagon joiners/attention whores, and mediate between the parties that actually have a stake in this whole mess.

In reply to mapper:

I tend to agree, although the argument against Fed involvement is there is a perceived (or perhaps real) bias on their side as well.

My own personal hunch is there is some underlying disagreement between the pipeline company and the Native tribes behind all of this which hasn't been discussed.

Wall-e wrote:

novaderrik wrote: But i also think the protesters are misguided at best but at least they get to say that they "did something,..

This. My friend's daughter has stopped going to class because she is so distraught by how her life has been ruined by the election. She's in a white upper middle class family who has never wanted for anything. Her life isn't going to change drastically no matter who was elected. She has been going to rallies to get the election overturned because she doesn't seem to understand how government works, and now she needs dad to up the limit on her credit card so she can travel to protest pipelines. It's been suggested that she may do more good by getting a degree in something that might actually help her get a job where she can work to make the changes she wants. She feels that standing in the street with a poorly made sign that does little more than show how much money her parents wasted on art school is a better way to change the world because she's doing something.

ZOMFG - your firends daughter is my brother!?!?! You're friends with my dad? And my brother is a girl? Holy crap, my mom is gonna be pissed!

In reply to 4cylndrfury: Maybe they could meet and live happily ever after in someone's basement . She seemed to have second thoughts about going to fight the pipeline once someone showed her where it is and how cold it gets. If they still need help in the spring she may be available.

In reply to 92dxman:

For what, cracking skulls of the protesters? I'd go cast iron myself in a 12" diameter at a minimum.

Think you've got the wrong thread

Edit: Damn! He moved the post, now I look like the idiot

I realized the snafu myself. I redirected it to the correct post.

Ian F wrote: In reply to mapper: I tend to agree, although the argument against Fed involvement is there is a perceived (or perhaps real) bias on their side as well. My own personal hunch is there is some underlying disagreement between the pipeline company and the Native tribes behind all of this which hasn't been discussed.

The big thing that i've seen in a few places is that the tribe was totally cool with the pipeline until they found out that they weren't going to be getting paid in any way from it.. then they got mad and stopped talking to the pipeline company for the last couple of years..

Ian F wrote: Only recently has it been legal to export raw crude. Until then, all of our exports were distilled products.

This right here, that just changed a year or two ago IIRC.

We have a massive refining capability that can easily accommodate more than just our crude production, so when I see numbers like that it just means we are doing well enough to import it, refine it, and export the finished product to others for a profit. Unfortunately people seem to not want to look past the first glance at things these days....

novaderrik wrote: The big thing that i've seen in a few places is that the tribe was totally cool with the pipeline until they found out that they weren't going to be getting paid in any way from it.. then they got mad and stopped talking to the pipeline company for the last couple of years..

I suspected something like that. My guess is there are negotiations happening where the financial deal can be worked out while creating a public statement that water safety assurances have been made in order to save face.

WOW Really Paul? wrote: This right here, that just changed a year or two ago IIRC. We have a massive refining capability that can easily accommodate more than just our crude production, so when I see numbers like that it just means we are doing well enough to import it, refine it, and export the finished product to others for a profit. Unfortunately people seem to not want to look past the first glance at things these days....

I've read the drop in oil prices has been a double-edged sword for the US oil industry. While exploration and drilling projects have dropped dramatically, the lower crude prices mean higher profits for the refining side.

With the latest OPEC deal and oil jumping up to $50/bbl, we may start to see drilling projects restart.