Dear GM....

Nick_Comstock wrote: GM is cheap to run and easily serviceable thank you very much.

Spoken like a Harley owner

P-body and F-body cars disagree with you.

Engine out the bottom, WTF?

Trans_Maro wrote:

Nick_Comstock wrote: GM is cheap to run and easily serviceable thank you very much.

Spoken like a Harley owner P-body and F-body cars disagree with you. Engine out the bottom, WTF?

Engine out the bottom is common, especially on Porsches including 911, 928, 944, boxster, etc.

edit: thinking back my MR2 and I think MKII Supra also dropped out of the bottom.

In reply to Trans_Maro:

I'm reserving this space for when I think of a snappy comeback.

DrBoost wrote:

Knurled wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: GM consistently manages to come up with great ideas, then royally berkeley them up in execution.

You're thinking of Chrysler.

You're kidding right? Look at the GM and Ford concept cars, especially from the 90s and 20**s. Chrysler consistently produced cars that were very close to the concept cars than anyone. Can you say Viper, Prowler (not my cup of tea, but it was close to the concept IIRC), Neon, LH cars, etc. Those were all good cars and sold well, Prowler excluded.

You're looking at shiny E36 M3. I'm talking about awesome engineering ideas that get beancountered to death.

Knurled wrote:

DrBoost wrote:

Knurled wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: GM consistently manages to come up with great ideas, then royally berkeley them up in execution.

You're thinking of Chrysler.

You're kidding right? Look at the GM and Ford concept cars, especially from the 90s and 20**s. Chrysler consistently produced cars that were very close to the concept cars than anyone. Can you say Viper, Prowler (not my cup of tea, but it was close to the concept IIRC), Neon, LH cars, etc. Those were all good cars and sold well, Prowler excluded.

You're looking at shiny E36 M3. I'm talking about awesome engineering ideas that get beancountered to death.

Chrysler has had two real technical developments that revolutionized the industry (HEMIs and the Airflow). The rest have been mainly styling. And this is from a guy who actually likes Mopars.

In reply to G_Body_Man:

Chrysler did not "invent" the hemi head, it was used by plenty of manufacturers before them.

I've got two Duesenbergs sitting here with hemispherical combustion chambers and I'm sure they're not the first either.

Trans_Maro wrote: In reply to G_Body_Man: Chrysler did not "invent" the hemi head, it was used by plenty of manufacturers before them. I've got two Duesenbergs sitting here with hemispherical combustion chambers and I'm sure they're not the first either.

They popularized the hemispherical combustion chamber, and paired them with the outrageously huge V8s that were popular in the 1960s. They turned the hemi head from a design that adds more power, to a household name. They didn't invent aerodynamic cars either, but for mass-production they created the first. Their technical innovations involved taking expensive, exotic technology and making it available to the everyman. They didn't really invent any new ideas on their own.

G_Body_Man wrote:

Trans_Maro wrote: In reply to G_Body_Man: Chrysler did not "invent" the hemi head, it was used by plenty of manufacturers before them. I've got two Duesenbergs sitting here with hemispherical combustion chambers and I'm sure they're not the first either.

They popularized the hemispherical combustion chamber, and paired them with the outrageously huge V8s that were popular in the 1960s. They turned the hemi head from a design that adds more power, to a household name. They didn't invent aerodynamic cars either, but for mass-production they created the first. Their technical innovations involved taking expensive, exotic technology and making it available to the everyman. They didn't really invent any new ideas on their own.

And NHRA and IHRA Pro Stock showed us that wedges were better. Also, that 426 was smaller than the 460, the 454, the 427, and Chryslers own 440.

TunaDad said: It's all E36 M3, kid, it's just a matter of what kind of E36 M3 you like to work on.

TunaDad said:

It's all E36 M3, kid, it's just a matter of what kind of E36 M3 you like to work on

Agreed. Every manufacturer has done dumb things.

G_Body_Man wrote:

Cotton wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote:

Knurled wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: GM consistently manages to come up with great ideas, then royally berkeley them up in execution.

You're thinking of Chrysler. GM comes up with mediocre ideas and executes them well. Look at, say, the small block Chevy. Several cubic feet of bad ideas wrought in steel and iron. And yet, it has been the generic performance engine for decades, because while it has all SORTS of design flaws and limitations, GM at least cranked out a bajillion of them and... well, maybe they did some sort of dark arts thing in the back rooms or something.

Plastisol, the Computer Controlled Carb, G-body frames, the entire Fiero, the C4 Corvette's digital dash, the CRT touchscreen, the Aztek. Yup, I'm thinking about GM.

All manufacturers have had berkeley ups and various technologies, ideas, options, designs, etc that just didn't work out. Maybe you should sell the g body and pick up a Camry.

Camries don't have character, or pillow-style red velour interiors.

For some reason I just bought an 87 Caprice Brougham LS with a pillow style blue velour interior and it is very comfy, so I see your point. lol

In reply to Cotton:

I need more info on this Caprice.

In reply to G_Body_Man:

A friend of mines grandparents bought it new and it was always driven sparingly and garaged. They passed away 2 years ago and it got kicked out of the garage and sat. It's an 87, white exterior, full length white vinyl top, and blue interior, 64k original miles, fuel injected 305 w/700r4, all power options (and everything works). I've been trying to buy it for the last 2 years, but they had been in no hurry to sell and when we discussed they wanted too much money. Well sitting out caused issues like the headliner started to sag, paint on one door started to crack, and the front bumper filler deteriorated, so they finally saw they were doing it no favors and sold it to me for a great price imo. I went there, aired up the tires, added 10 gallons of 93 octane, and a gallon of antifreeze, and drove it around 80 miles home. It drives great, the AC still works, and it's really growing on me. I bought it thinking I might replace the bumper fillers, headliner, clean it up, and sell it, but now I might just keep it. I plan to give it a very thorough cleaning this weekend, then will post some pics. It's a great cruiser and with the 8 way power seats I could configure just how I wanted.

In reply to Cotton:

Does it have the fuel door that stays in the down position without jamming in the gas cap? I just picked one of those up for my Cutlass. Top Tip: join The Brougham Society on facebook. They're a great resource for all things Brougham.

G_Body_Man wrote: In reply to Cotton: Does it have the fuel door that stays in the down position without jamming in the gas cap? I just picked one of those up for my Cutlass. Top Tip: join The Brougham Society on facebook. They're a great resource for all things Brougham.

Yes it does. I was happy to see the gas door because the other style was aggravating.

Cotton wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: In reply to Cotton: Does it have the fuel door that stays in the down position without jamming in the gas cap? I just picked one of those up for my Cutlass. Top Tip: join The Brougham Society on facebook. They're a great resource for all things Brougham.

Yes it does. I was happy to see the gas door because the other style was aggravating.

I know that feeling. Unfortunately, as I live in Canada, I'm in the middle of a refurb.

With the right tools that is a 40 minute job. Pay to invest in the tools to do the job right, pay the guy that invested in the tools to do the job right, or pay in wasted time and rants. One way or another you're gonna have to pay.

Seriously considering a Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham Sedan for purchase because ya know it has B R O plastered on the side. LT engine and I'm in

TRoglodyte wrote: Seriously considering a Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham Sedan for purchase because ya know it has B R O plastered on the side. LT engine and I'm in

Sounds like we need a grm brougham club.

In reply to patgizz:

Sounds like trying to do similar work to my 740iL. Had to buy several different types of balljoint tools to get it apart enough to "fix" it.

Junkyard_Dog wrote: With the right tools that is a 40 minute job. Pay to invest in the tools to do the job right, pay the guy that invested in the tools to do the job right, or pay in wasted time and rants. One way or another you're gonna have to pay.

last i checked, a pitman arm puller is the right tool to pull a pitman arm. it's the tool at gm who put the pitman arm over a welded in bracket is the one who should pay, with boot in arse.

patgizz wrote:

Junkyard_Dog wrote: With the right tools that is a 40 minute job. Pay to invest in the tools to do the job right, pay the guy that invested in the tools to do the job right, or pay in wasted time and rants. One way or another you're gonna have to pay.

last i checked, a pitman arm puller is the right tool to pull a pitman arm. it's the tool at gm who put the pitman arm over a welded in bracket is the one who should pay, with boot in arse.

There is a special puller for those trucks. $47ish on my Cornwell truck iirc. Special one for certain Fords too which also works. Ask a VW guy about special tools sometime, like three sizes of triple squares to do an oil change

Knurled wrote:

DrBoost wrote:

Knurled wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: GM consistently manages to come up with great ideas, then royally berkeley them up in execution.

You're thinking of Chrysler.

You're kidding right? Look at the GM and Ford concept cars, especially from the 90s and 20**s. Chrysler consistently produced cars that were very close to the concept cars than anyone. Can you say Viper, Prowler (not my cup of tea, but it was close to the concept IIRC), Neon, LH cars, etc. Those were all good cars and sold well, Prowler excluded.

You're looking at shiny E36 M3. I'm talking about awesome engineering ideas that get beancountered to death.

this was the concept car that Dodge came out when they decided that they were going to build a 4 door Charger, and they said it was going to look almost exactly like this... every car guy wanted one:

then they came out with this and everyone was all "wtf, Dodge? this isn't what you told us you were going to build.":

yup, they sure nailed that one...

GM generally comes pretty close to their styling with concept cars with about a 5 year lag time: for example, the Banshee concept of the late 80's looks a lot like a 93 Camaro, except for the mid engine layout..

So glad the 2wd trucks went to R&P in 99

Bobzilla wrote: So glad the 2wd trucks went to R&P in 99

you should not be as apparently racks on trucks are dumb.

i did get it all back together and greased up thursday before work(minus the skid plates they're laying in the driveway). my back went out getting up off the creeper, then i laid out on the driveway unable to move for a few minutes. forced myself up, took something hardcore, slathered with icy hot, hit the heated seat button, and drove 75 miles to pressure wash a huge deck. i made it long enough to do that, get a shower at my friend's next door to the deck, get back in the truck, and that was it. i tried to get out to eat but couldn't walk, so 75 miles home i went, hobbled into the house, and went to bed at 7 because i could not move.

yesterday it went 105 miles each way with trailer. 80mph with (somewhat of a) car on the trailer and the steering feels better than it ever has.