mtn (Forum Supporter) said:
I'm refinacing a 30 year mortgage at 2.35% right now.
WOW, I haven't seen rates that low on a 30 year
mtn (Forum Supporter) said:
I'm refinacing a 30 year mortgage at 2.35% right now.
WOW, I haven't seen rates that low on a 30 year
I am a serious hard core Fat FIRE guy and looking at my life from the outside you would think I have all my E36 M3 together but yeah even I am still winging it. Even in my late 30's I have zero actual clue what I am really doing. I just kept my expenses low, made money on the side when I wanted to spend it on something stupid. Helps that I have no kids, no responsibilities and really nothing to lose. I would be a wreck trying to do that with those restrictions.
I will lead with this though for the young here. The most powerful force in the universe is not love or faith or happiness. Its compound interest, well that and not getting divorced.
Put enough away early when it does not really effect you and feed that over your life and you will see a gain even with standard investments.
Honesty moment: I don't really know either so I have gone a little scorched-earth on my approach to finances. Cheap house, cheap used car, no kids, and I would rather buy a used appliance and fix it than buy anything new (and still have to fix it).
In my case, refi wasn't really a savings even with my 4%. After a broker helped me with the math, I would have to do about 2.85% to break even since I owe so little and my monthly payment with escrow is under $350. Until I paid the closing costs, he said it would be better to just throw a little more money at it every month. I'm still waiting to hear back from a couple banks that I hit up this week to see if they have different calculators. Long story short; if a bank is telling me that they DON'T want my business, it's likely not much benefit for me. YMMV.
I have just chosen to live as simply as I can. I always have a surplus at the end of the month which has led to a modest savings. What will I do with those savings? No clue.
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:Honesty moment: I don't really know either so I have gone a little scorched-earth on my approach to finances. Cheap house, cheap used car, no kids, and I would rather buy a used appliance and fix it than buy anything new (and still have to fix it).
In my case, refi wasn't really a savings even with my 4%. After a broker helped me with the math, I would have to do about 2.85% to break even since I owe so little and my monthly payment with escrow is under $350. Until I paid the closing costs, he said it would be better to just throw a little more money at it every month. I'm still waiting to hear back from a couple banks that I hit up this week to see if they have different calculators. Long story short; if a bank is telling me that they DON'T want my business, it's likely not much benefit for me. YMMV.
I have just chosen to live as simply as I can. I always have a surplus at the end of the month which has led to a modest savings. What will I do with those savings? No clue.
Didn't you have something ridiculously (in a good way) crazy like a 10 year mortgage on $80k, from 3 years ago?
In that case... Yeah, I would be pretty shocked to find a situaiton where closing costs are low enough to make it worth it.
In reply to mtn (Forum Supporter) :
The house was $87k, but my ex had written me a check to buy out my half of our old house so I had about $40k to use as a down payment, hence the low monthly. I've been here three years and I only owe about $30k. It's a 30yr fixed which I did because I work for a non-profit arts organization. Job security is good from a "the boss likes me" standpoint, but (as COVID has shown us) the future is never known. I could have done a 15 year and afforded it, but I just pay it as if it were a 15 year and I have the option of reducing how much I pay if E36 M3 hits the fan... which it has
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:In reply to mtn (Forum Supporter) :
The house was $87k, but my ex had written me a check to buy out my half of our old house so I had about $40k to use as a down payment, hence the low monthly. I've been here three years and I only owe about $30k. It's a 30yr fixed which I did because I work for a non-profit arts organization. Job security is good from a "the boss likes me" standpoint, but (as COVID has shown us) the future is never known. I could have done a 15 year and afforded it, but I just pay it as if it were a 15 year and I have the option of reducing how much I pay if E36 M3 hits the fan... which it has
Yeah, with $30k left, it would be *really* hard to make a refinance work, basically ever.
Jealous of that, btw. Well done!
NOPE!
I think it's funny that there are awkward health issues we don't tell our kids about. I will let you guess them.
When they get old let them be surprised like we were.
I a fit of responsibility when I ordered a model from Japan I ordered a second since I was already paying the shipping.
Mazdax605; I have about 30 more laps than you.
Don't touch the retirement funds. Period. End of discussion. Do the math on mortgages, but as stated above you may be paying a lot of principal currently and it would be best to finish out as is. Get rid of credit card debt. Figure out how to live on what you make.
My grandmother impressed om me to save 10% of everything coming in. Started doing that in my late 20s. It was a struggle but sure payed off later.
Your oldest son should be your focus today. How to really help is difficult. He is in a jam. Unemployment is high. Schooling is on-line at best. He's is probably more freaked out about his future than you, even if he isn't talking. Discover his interests and see if any can be explored even if they are not profitable today. Being idle is the biggest danger. He has to find something to do even if its volunteering and still living at home. helping him is more important than any remodeling.
Wait... We are supposed to be doing something?
Know? No.
I've had a vague concept since my early 20's. Have gotten lucky that it has mostly panned out regarding financial stuff. I have no debt and am buying a second house with some land on Monday for $. I will sell my current home because I don't want to deal with being a landlord. I plan to retire in 10 years and expect to be able to pay myself (net) more than I make now because I won't be putting money into a 401k and might be able to collect something on Social Conspiracy...meanwhile I'm happy eating rice and beans. 
mtn (Forum Supporter) said:Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:In reply to mtn (Forum Supporter) :
The house was $87k, but my ex had written me a check to buy out my half of our old house so I had about $40k to use as a down payment, hence the low monthly. I've been here three years and I only owe about $30k. It's a 30yr fixed which I did because I work for a non-profit arts organization. Job security is good from a "the boss likes me" standpoint, but (as COVID has shown us) the future is never known. I could have done a 15 year and afforded it, but I just pay it as if it were a 15 year and I have the option of reducing how much I pay if E36 M3 hits the fan... which it has
Yeah, with $30k left, it would be *really* hard to make a refinance work, basically ever.
Jealous of that, btw. Well done!
Haaaa... thanks. I'm still feeling all "owned" by the bank. This is my first loan ever.
In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :
Financial "experts" seem to say paying off a mortgage early isn't the best use of one's money, but doing so provides a sense of security that is hard to put a monetary value on.
Regardless, being financially secure doesn't necessarily make someone happy. For berk's sake I'm proof of that...
I'm 40, my son starts high school later this summer, my daughter starts pre school. I have no idea what I'm doing. 2 years deep on a 30 year loan on a brand new house, I can afford to pay 99% of bills on my own without my wife's income. I'm 19 years from my pension, though I'm not sure if I'll actually quit working. I'm divorced, but no child support. I have no idea WTF I'm doing. More money in savings then we've ever had. Should be debt free outside the mortgage by the end of next year, which will free up a ton more cash. I have no idea what I'm doing. Just keeping my shoes tied on tight and ready for whatever life dishes out next.
Strangely, there is a lot less pressure when your retirement plan is death. There is a certain freedom in nilism.
Appleseed said:Strangely, there is a lot less pressure when your retirement plan is death. There is a certain freedom in nilism.
When I look at what I contribute to our HSA, 401k, and ESPP, and think about if it was in the monthly budget... I start to see how people are affording all of the E36 M3 from the new cell phones to regularly leasing cars to ridiculous houses.
Unfortunately, none of those things really bring me true joy, and work for me is generally tolerable at best in any job I'm able to make a living at... So for me, saving so that I don't have to work until I die puts my mind at ease.
In reply to mtn (Forum Supporter) :
Agreed. At least since our first few years as independent adults, we've never been destitute or without some emergency fund. But we've never ever been extravagant, either, on anything. We buy what we want, but we've trained ourselves to only want pretty reasonable things.
Honestly, we're at a point now where there are some things we absolutely can and should be spending money on - the house needs cosmetic work that would also make it nicer to live in - but it's actually hard to break the habit of not spending the money.
wearymicrobe said:I am a serious hard core Fat FIRE guy and looking at my life from the outside you would think I have all my E36 M3 together but yeah even I am still winging it. Even in my late 30's I have zero actual clue what I am really doing. I just kept my expenses low, made money on the side when I wanted to spend it on something stupid. Helps that I have no kids, no responsibilities and really nothing to lose. I would be a wreck trying to do that with those restrictions.
I will lead with this though for the young here. The most powerful force in the universe is not love or faith or happiness. Its compound interest, well that and not getting divorced.
Put enough away early when it does not really effect you and feed that over your life and you will see a gain even with standard investments.
Nailed it
Proof that I don't really know what I'm doing:
Moved into this house three years ago. I figured I would finally pay my local income taxes. Super simple on the township website. Import data from your federal, and it spits out a number I'm supposed to pay. Just the other day I got a letter saying I underpaid by $887. I'm thinking.... it's your website, man. How could you screw it up?
Now I have to call and get it sorted out.
Datsun310Guy said:In reply to chandler :
My dad liked EE US savings bonds for some reason so he bought a bunch in the late 80's, early 90's when his business was good. Probably threw $50,000 into them over 7-8 years.
We cash them in 30 years later to the tune of $250,000. Maybe not the best Investment but compound interest can be good.
I have a bunch of these from my grandfather. They're not worth a ton and I have a few that have reached their total accrued interest and should be cashed. I think I'll wait until a non-COVID-wrecked year when I have some income to offset the taxes.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:Of course- playing the big ridiculous simulation game "Life"
I try to do just enough of the main quest to keep my credits high enough to do as many of the fun side quests as possible. The main quest is berkeleying boring, who wrote this game? Bad level design too, and some of the NPCs seem way overpowered while others barely have any thought put into them. Graphics are impressive and it's really immersive though.
Bwahaha all-time great post! 
Yeah I don't know WTF I'm doing, and this world is so damn random that anyone who's convinced themselves that they do know WTF they're doing is just fooling themselves with their own survivorship bias - and your level of finance knowledge is just a minor factor!
Some people will do well with hard work and the perfectly prudent investment portfolio, another guy will do the exact same thing before the market eats E36 M3 at an inconvenient time for some dumb reason and he ends up poor, a 3rd guy will do the same job as the 1st and 2nd guy but never make enough to invest because he lives at the wrong address, and a 4th guy will trade a slightly used sex toy for some Bitcoin at the right moment and be 10x richer than the first guy, and he will consider himself the wisest investor of them all, a financial oracle who absolutely knows WTF he's doing and will give a 30-minute talk at a conference for more than the 3rd guy makes in a year.
For the most part nobody has ever known WTF they're doing, but many have improvised well enough for their time. However, different time periods have been more or less forgiving to mistakes, and we've been in a less-forgiving period for the last 30 years or so.
Even when we think we know what we're doing and have a plan of some sort things may not work out. I've given up for this lifetime. Almost everything I worked for, saved, tried to keep, protect, insure, etc. gets taken away by someone or some company. Oh ya, and Wells Fargo sucks, don't do business with them.
Whelp, a bit of a mistake and the wife and I end up owing more than a challenge budget on taxes... (we figured out the problem, solution in the works)
We all try to embody the duck. Smooth when viewed over the water, paddling furiously underneath.
z31maniac said:Mazdax605 said:I've read a good rule of thumb is that you should have 3x your annual salary in your 401k by the time you're 40.I ask this because while I'm an adult (45 laps) male, I often feel like I have no idea what I'm doing with most things, but especially finance.
I was just rereading this thread and ran across this line.
I'm certain that is a good rule of thumb.
I'm also certain that it is neither realistic nor required.
DW and I didn't seriously start saving for retirement (beyond the minimums required to meet our employer matching) until we were 40, and even then we weren't doing it hand over fist. Since our late 20s we had been raising 2 kids, buying a house and the occasional car, both working full time and paying for daycare, braces, karate lessons, etc. All the things that make up a family life. Between our mid-40s and early 50s, we put both kids through college at the local state university, with just enough student debt on their parts to make them feel ownership of their educations.
As our salaries edged up, we put most of those increases into additional retirement savings. Starting in our mid 40s, we both set our retirement deductions to 10% of gross, and we increased that 1% per year over the next 10 years, invested for maximum growth. Right now we're both putting away about 20% of gross for the final sprint.
Like I mentioned before in this thread, we've worked all our adult lives to keep our expenses reasonable. Now, with both kids out of college and the house paid off, we could afford to live on one of our salaries if necessary. With our moderately frugal lifestyle - and we're not pikers by any stretch of the imagination - we managed to put away enough in the last 15 years that we can retire before 60 and live as we have been til 90 without really touching the principal.
I don't mean to be humblebragging, but I also want to show anyone who doesn't have a quarter million in the bank by the time they're 40 that you can overcome a late start with concerted effort and discipline. We have also been fortunate that we haven't suffered any catastrophic issues with health or employment, which of course can derail the best laid plans.
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