why do you need to fold the seats down to fit lumber? do they not put racks on the roofs of minivans any more? or couldn't you just slide the lumber in under the seats? or wedge it in however you can get it to fit?
why do you need to fold the seats down to fit lumber? do they not put racks on the roofs of minivans any more? or couldn't you just slide the lumber in under the seats? or wedge it in however you can get it to fit?
My in-laws have owned a series of mopar mini vans and I always seem to hurt my ankle/shin on the parking brake pedal getting in or out. Not sure if the newer ones are the same or not, but that would be a deal breaker for me.
The stow and go seats are cool though. They also cannot fill the gas tank all the way full or else the thing will die on them. They haven't been more than about 3/4/ full in years.
novaderrik wrote: why do you need to fold the seats down to fit lumber? do they not put racks on the roofs of minivans any more? or couldn't you just slide the lumber in under the seats? or wedge it in however you can get it to fit?
No roof rack, the seats dont fold and tumble forward, and the seat mechanisms prevent lumber from sliding under them.
Beer Baron wrote: This is relevant to my interests. I'm looking for something to replace the Astro for winter and light hauling duty.
Go look at the AWD T&C, everyone I know who gets one ends up not wanting anything else.
Minivans are the one thing they've always gotten right.
The seats were the big reason we didn't go with the Odyssey. Being the lightweight of available vans and with the variable cylinder system is guess the Odyssey gets the best mileage of available vans.
We ended up being split between an awesome deal on a new loaded Dodge or a used Sienna. The Toyota dealer came through first so that's what we ended up buying. We use the van as a truck quite a bit so the Dodge would have been perfect. The Sienna has less versatility but still worked because the cargo area is huge behind the 3 seat middle row. My wife averages 16mpg in purely hilly city driving. On road trips it does 27mpg at 70-75mph which I'm pretty happy with.
Resale on the Dodge sucks in comparison to the Japanese vans, good for used buyers like yourself who run the wheels off of them. If we bought the Dodge I was going to drive it until it fell apart like the Blues Mobile.
DrBoost wrote: the seats dont fold and tumble forward,
I blame my mom's taste in music for the reason why this has put Culture Club's "I'll Tumble For You" stuck in my head. I don't even remember the lyrics or how the music goes, just the chorus over and over again, which is somehow even more maddening. I'd like to be able to FACE my tormentor.
and you can get a Grand Caravan with stow and go for ~$20k. Don't think you can touch an Ody for $10k more.
ChryCo got it right from the start and continue to do so. Stow and go is incredible. My pickup gets 10-12 mpg so the GC gets used as a truck pretty often since it will pull down around 20 mpg pulling a X1/9 or 24 mpg with a tire machine, a 496 big block and two truck tires in it. Can't complain about that.
Knurled wrote:DrBoost wrote: the seats dont fold and tumble forward,I blame my mom's taste in music for the reason why this has put Culture Club's "I'll Tumble For You" stuck in my head. I don't even remember the lyrics or how the music goes, just the chorus over and over again, which is somehow even more maddening. I'd like to be able to FACE my tormentor.
Yeah, now it's stuck in my head ya jerk! 
I cannot deny the awesomeness that is stow n go.
I guess the Honda didn't bother me because once our kids were out of baby carriers, we typically left the middle row out. The 3rd row absolutely folds into the floor. So it was used as a truck quite frequently with no issues.
Teh E36 M3 wrote: and you can get a Grand Caravan with stow and go for ~$20k. Don't think you can touch an Ody for $10k more.
Or a used one for half that. Paid $10k for my '08 GC. It's pretty bare-bones in the options dept, but it hauls my bikes and crap around well and I've put 65K miles on it under two years. Stow-b-n-Go is the #1 reason I bought it. The 3.3 OHV V6 will get about 21 mpg in mixed driving and about 24 if I do more hwy.
Granted, I did buy it to use as a truck (it replaced my Cummins) and it has performed admirably in that service. Hell, I even loaded the scissor lift (~900 lbs) I bought off this forum into the back. I occasionally wish it was trimmed out nicer, but then when I have it loaded with crap or a dirty mtn bike, I don't mind so much and that wish for leather and heated seats passes.
Agnew wrote:Beer Baron wrote: This is relevant to my interests. I'm looking for something to replace the Astro for winter and light hauling duty.Go look at the AWD T&C, everyone I know who gets one ends up not wanting anything else. Minivans are the one thing they've always gotten right.
Which is my concern about a Dodge/Chrysler product. I had a Chrysler Cirrus that was a POS that loved to eat up engine mounts. Not the worst car that's ever been in my care, but only because it has a Cadillac Cimarron for competition.
I'll be looking solidly used for a van, since it will be my secondary vehicle.
If you are not a fan of vehicles that eat engine mounts, then the Odyssey is not for you. Or anything else with the 3.5l engine, really. Honda was weird with their mounting scheme. The mount on the right side of the car is mostly there for looks, you can remove it and the drivetrain doesn't sink at all. It's the mount at the radiator that seems to do most of the load, and it breaks with disturbing regularity. It's also vacuum modulated on some models.
should have bought the Sedona. NOT a fan of anything 3.5 honda related (ody, Pilot, MDX, Ridgeline etc). The owners seem to make moreexcuses for their repair costs than any other brand ImO.
Wouldn't the best solution to have been to go down south and buy the nicest late model AWD Astro you could find?
Shoulda gone bigger.
93gsxturbo wrote: Wouldn't the best solution to have been to go down south and buy the nicest late model AWD Astro you could find?
No. The issue with my Astro isn't rust. I bought it in California. It's only seen 2 winters.
The big issues are intake gasket and brake booster. Engine bay packaging is so tight and not well planned that it will be a PITA to do. I could, but I don't want to, especially with all the other little issues this car has that make me just not want to deal with it (e.g. the driver's door handle doesn't work properly anymore). I just do not like the engineering and do not want a van that is not only a bit more prone to needing maintenance, but is difficult and frustrating to work on. And it gets E36 M3 gas mileage, to boot.
I'm going to replace it with something where "remove driver and passenger seat" is not the first step to replacing the spark plugs.
Our '15 Grand Caravan has already hauled 6 people on a 2500 mile road trip, hauled a bunch of lumber, some furniture, and even served as an RV one weekend. Best mpg has been 25 (hand calculated) and the sliding doors in tight parking stalls - oh yeah. And plenty of thrust available at your right foot. Stow N Go may be the best idea Mopar had since the 426 Hemi. This van is the Swiss Army knife of vehicles.
Beer Baron wrote: I'm going to replace it with something where "remove driver and passenger seat" is not the first step to replacing the spark plugs.
Well, yeah, on an Astro you get them through the wheelwell...
Knurled wrote:Beer Baron wrote: I'm going to replace it with something where "remove driver and passenger seat" is not the first step to replacing the spark plugs.Well, yeah, on an Astro you get them through the wheelwell...
and if you do take the seats out, what do you sit on while working on the engine?
Just for reference--- My 2014 Dodge Grand Caravan gets about 19-20mpg in stop and go- around town driving, and about 23-24mpg at 80mph.
I've gotten has high as 30mpg over the course of a 170 mile trip--- but that was on A1A, which is mostly 45-55mph roads.
The thing that impresses me most about this van is I've put about 12K miles on it so far and it has exhibited NOT ONE flaw. I'm lucky enough to drive lots and lots of new cars (working here does have it's perks!) and there are almost always a few flaws to be found. (interior pieces that don't fit right, plastic "flashing" that is visible, squeaks or rattles that appear, etc)
I'm by no means a Chrysler fan-boi, but it seems they really have put the effort forth with their minivans. I've been totally happy--- it does everything I need it to do and more. Also, with 282hp, it's no slug, and the chassis handles pretty darn well. No, it's not a Miata, but I've spent thousands of miles driving Odysseys and the Dodge may be slightly less engaging to drive.....but not by much.
For an out the door price of under $23K brand new-- including full stow&go, sat. radio, rear A/C , upgraded interior trim and rear windows that roll down, it's an amazing value. Don't get me wrong, the Honda is a nice van, but it's so much higher priced that it wasn't even a consideration of mine. The Stow & Go seating was also a big selling point. It's like a magic trick each time I fold / unfold the seats. It's engineering done right.
There are currently two of these vans on staff here at GRM / CMS world headquarters. (Rick Goolsby has the other) We are both very happy with them.
IMHO, growing up with about 1/2 my friends parents having a ChryCo van, and my mom having a base model Oddity (not a single option on it), back then the only reason to go with a ChryCo was the price. Nowadays, I think it is price and the Stow-N-Go--and those are two really good reasons.
But I also would never touch a van with power doors--I feel like everyone who had them growing up, they were always broken, or you shouldn't slam it, or, or, or...
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