Educate me on Mountain Bike clip in pedals

First, I'm a little confused, by people saying clipless pedals. Do these still attach to the pedal somehow? Also when looking for shoes, do they all work with the different pedal styles, or do I get SPF shoes for SPF pedals and eggbeater shoes for eggbeater pedals? Or do I just get different cleats to attach to the pedals I want? Sorry for my complete lack of knowledge on the subject. I appreciate the help so far.

Clipless is the "proper" term for clip-in pedals. Not sure why exactly that is .

The pedals will come with specific cleats, and these will attach to any shoe. So long as it's a 'MTB' shoe, that is, which are generally chunkier looking, and have the cleat recessed into the sole (so as you can walk on them, & bash them around a little bit etc.). A 'road' shoe takes a much larger, different style of cleat, which sits fully exposed on the bottom of the shoe.

Luke wrote: Clipless is the "proper" term for clip-in pedals. Not sure why exactly that is .

because prior to that people "clipped in" using toe straps also called toe clips... so removing the "toe clips" meant going "clipless"

Luke wrote: Clipless is the "proper" term for clip-in pedals. Not sure why exactly that is .

...because they don't use toe clips. Toe clips and straps were de rigeur up to the mid 80's. When the "click-in" pedals came out, they were thus dubbed "clipless".

mw wrote: I've been doing a bit of mountain biking lately. I think I would benefit from having a more secure grip on the pedals. I'm not hardcore, I just go a few times a week to have fun and get some excercise. Any advice would be appreciated.

^^^ This is what I read. I got this question a lot in my bike shop.

Having seen far too many people hurt themselves by using clipless pedals when they don't need them and shouldn't have them, my recommendation would be to buy a set of good pedals with toe clips. Start ih the basics. Learn how to pedal in circles without thinking about it first before even considering clipless style pedals. A set of toe clips (there are 2 types, with or without straps) will allow you learn how to pedal properly before you could begin to really take advantage of the clipless systems.

http://www.bikesplit.com/bsa4.htm While there are slightly different techniques which allow you to use the toe clips or clipless pedals to gain the most advantage this gives you the basic concept.

rad capz is on to something, which I attempted to allude to in my comedic earlier post: YOU WILL FALL WITH THESE. every single person does. I consider myself a pretty accomplished rider, and I fell a dozen or more times (off-road albeit, but still...). For someone getting started, these are the training wheels for clipless pedals:

Same action (heel kick to the outside to release), and holds pretty dang tight. Plus, you can wear whatever shoes you want until youre ready to take the plunge. Theyre called powergrips, and are about $50 or so.

SVreX wrote: Why not start with old fashioned toe clips?

Because believe it or not, clipless pedals are a hell of a lot easier to use and more effective than toe-clips. I had real toe-clips on my first road bike 20 years ago... and I don't miss the annoying cleat attached to the shoe... or having to release the straps when coming to a stop.

They also aren't easy to find anymore... since the only pros that still use them regularly are track racers (and even some of them have gone to clipless).

Powergrips... wow... I haven't seen those in years... I think a lot of these posters are making too big a deal out of this... buy some shoes and pedals and be done. It's not a big deal.

I have a hard time believing that a regular rider could recco toe straps as safer than clipless.....I just can't believe that's the case. No offense meant, and I have never ridden real toe straps, so that is just my opinion.

Here's another opinion: Yes, you're going to fall down a few times as you get used to them. Probably at a dead stop, probably in front of someone who has done the exact same thing. But guess what? It's MOUNTAIN BIKING - if you don't learn how to fall down once in a while, you'd better take up shuffleboard. It's not that big a deal, at least the falls from the pedals anyway. You'll be fine.

Being in the business I witnessed accidents and heard the horror stories weekly. Lost balance and fell off short cliff unable to clip out quick, hit tree head on trying to unclip, damaged knees from improper setup, broken hip falling over on pavement in parking lot at trail head, got pinched into a curb by traffic on the road crashing onto sidewalk, Slipped on cleats walking downhill with road bike shoes falling backward getting knocked out, etc. etc. etc. I watched a friend tying to learn clipless get hit by a car because she couldn't clip out and tipped into traffic. Luckily for her when the car mirror snagged her arm by the elbow it didn't break her arm. She just recieved some bad bruises got tossed in a big mud puddle. I could go on and on. My point was that for a recreational rider who appears to have limited experience there's no NEED for spending the money on a clipless setup and the potential risks probably outweigh the benefits AT THIS TIME for the OP based on the information given. "I'm not hardcore, I just go a few times a week to have fun and get some excercise."

Additionally: There are very short toe clips that require no strap so they keep your foot from sliding forward on the pedal (most newbies complaints) while allowing easy foot removal in any other direction.

4cylinderfury is right about the powerstraps place in the learning curve. They seem to wear out right about the time a person is ready to move to clipless.

While clipless pedals certainly have their place they are not the best option for everyone under all circumstances. I offered advice as requested in the OP based on the information given and my 40+ years of racing/riding road, mountain, BMX and owning a large shop for 25 years. Personally I have flats, toe clips, and clipless. Everything has it's place.

Falling is just something you learn how to do. You'll make good use of the small trees near the trails when you come to a stop. Take it out on simple trails first until you build the muscle memory to kick out before you put your foot down and you'll be fine.

The learning curve is steep, but you'll figure it out. Take the plunge.

I wouldn't call it steep. Took me about 30 minutes to adapt, if that. Obviously there will be some variance between individuals. Before I went clipless, I was the sort of person who rode with my toe straps fairly tight so they weren't that easy to eject from anyhow. But since not ejecting was kinda the point, that suited me fine. Of course, I've also never knocked myself out when trying to walk like a duck in my old-school road bike cleats. Someone who rides a few times a week should be adapted within a week.

The Mallet setup on my wife's bike is ideal for a scared intermediate as far as I'm concerned. Big funky platforms for when she's too scared to clip in, and the easy-to-use Eggbeaters for when she wants to hook up. It's helped her a lot and she spends more time clipped in than she used to. I haven't seen her topple over yet! The old SPDs off her bike are sitting in a drawer in my garage, they were definitely not right for her.

A contrarian view

His main point seems to be that you don't generate any additional power through the use of clipless pedals. He also seems to think that the "control" you get with clipless pedals is easily replicable with good technique on flat pedals.

View from Rivendell Bicycle Works

If you're loving your clipless pedals, there's no point in reading it, and certainly there's no point in changing what works for you. In that case, this article is not meant for you.

I decided about 20 years ago never to ride without some sort of foot retention. At the time, my only contact with my speeding mountain bike was my hands on the handlebars. I was simultaneously eagerly anticipating and dreading the reunification of the seat and my seating areas.

Every time a see a set of flats with big spikes, my shins ache.

Clips would have saved me from my biggest wipeout. I hit a bump, my foot came off the pedal and got caught in the front wheel and I went over the handle bars. Trashed my wheel.

In the late 70s I trained and raced in leather Detto Pietro article n.7 shoes with the cleats nailed to the leather soles. The introduction of spring-aluminum toe clips as opposed to steel was a big deal, and the Alfredo Binda Extra straps we used then fetch a fortune on eBay today for the hipster-douche fixed gear retro fashionistas. Reaching down to loosen a strap to put a foot down at long stoplights by necessity became second nature. A road racing crash at speed was pretty awful as you were as they say "strapped in", and would remain so until you or someone else loosened the toe straps to free your impossibly road-rashed self from the tangle of other bloody, sweaty people and abraded boutique Italian custom frames and Campagnolo Nuovo Record parts.

Cinelli introduced a clipless pedal in the 70s but it was not to facilitate easy entry so much as a better mechanical connection to the bike. I recall serious track riders using them. The first clipless system to penetrate the pro peloton was made by Look. I resisted for a few years, but when they introduced cleats that allowed rotational float I bought in.

I've ridden on the road on some form of Look compatible cleat-pedal system for 25 years give or take, and have never had any negative effect. Simply rotating one's heel outward results in a very positive release of the cleat by the pedal. At age 51 with a gazillion miles under my adult-sized ass I still have serviceable knees - likely in large part to keeping an eye on position and good cleat placement.

I didn't go clipless on mountain bikes 'til the 90's when Shimano introduced the SPD cleat/pedal system. I have M525s on my MTB, and swear I'll actually start doing MTB rides more often this year. It's than from my front door I'm in about the nicest place to road ride in the DC metro area in 2 minutes but an MTB ride is 1-1/2 hours round trip driving. In that time I can knock off 25 miles in The Park....

A word on shoes. Like with so many things you get what you pay for, and as I say "Nice things are nice"

I wear Sidi Genius on the road and Sidi Dominators off road, not cause I'm showy but because they'll last as long as you want to keep them, they're very comfortable, and they look fine on an adult who doesn't shave his legs.

Scott wrote: A contrarian view His main point seems to be that you don't generate any additional power through the use of clipless pedals. He also seems to think that the "control" you get with clipless pedals is easily replicable with good technique on flat pedals.

I disagree with a number of points regarding technical skills. I raced BMX and DH on flats for years... and I'll still ride DH and DJ on flats. I can switch between them with no acclimation time.

However, to say 'train on flats and race on clipless' removes any credibility the article may have had...

You're right... I won't read the Rivendell article... as I'm sure it's just more retro-grouch drivel...

OK experts--

So I'm sitting here in my just-purchased Specialized Sport MTB shoes and my bike has a set of Shimano EPDM424 SPD pedals. The bike is mounted to my mag trainer and I'm teaching myself how to get in and out of them.

Here's my confusion--I can't get one side of the right pedal to release easier. I've been screwing around with the little 2.5mm allen bolt that adjusts the retention tension and one side is nice and easy to get out of, the other side doesn't loosen up no matter what I do--even if the screw is completely backed out.

The pedals and shoes are brand new, as are the cleats.

I'm going to try this crap out on a 50 mile road loop tomorrow.

BTW--I always ran my toe straps loose. They'd (along with the clips) keep my foot from slipping off of the pedal, but I could get out of them in a nanosecond.

I don't foresee using these (SPD's) on my MTB at any time in my life.

neon4891 wrote: Clips would have saved me from my biggest wipeout. I hit a bump, my foot came off the pedal and got caught in the front wheel and I went over the handle bars. Trashed my wheel.

I tried that trick on my 10-speed when I was in grade school. It's the cycling equivalent of catching the nose on a kneeboard. I think it took about 5 minutes to work my shoe out of the wheel.

gamby wrote: OK experts--

Who installed everything? It could be a few different things. The first thing I'd check would be the cleat position in the shoe. If it's not aligned correctly for how your foot is positioned on the pedal (rather than inline with the shoe), it might not release easily.

I had the cleats fitted to the shoes at the bike shop where I bought the shoes. I had the pedals sitting in my garage for 5+ years and I put them on (as a bike tech for 7 years, I can handle that--I just never deal w/ clipless in a big box store).

With some googling, I saw that once you back the screw out too far, it's impossible to get it back right--so basically, I screwed up my pedals. Toeclips were much simpler.

In reply to motomoron:

+1 on sidi shoes. will last a LONG time.

Ian and Radcapz know what theyre talking about - For DH/BMX freestyle/DJ - you want platforms...any time you land, youll want that big ole platform under your feet. You also need to be able to separate yourself in an instant to avoid going down with the ship in the event of an unplanned stop. For x-country or road use though, THEY DO INCREASE THE POWER YOU ARE ABLE TO DELIVER. Its a simple matter of physics. With a traditional platform, youre able to only input power to the drivetrain through about 165° of pedal rotation per side. basically from just after the pedal is at its highest, to just before its at its lowest. Its commonly called pedaling in a square - you are making stabs at the pedals, not really rotating them. When clipped in, the only time youre not really capable of inputing torque is right at the top 10-15° of pedal rotation as your legs arent really able to make much power there just due to physical anatomy. Now, you have to train your body to add torque through the rest of the crank rotation, we all learn to stab at the pedals at a young age. Its a skill you must master. but look at any accomplished cyclist climb a hill when clipped in - theyre leg movement is smooth, no stabs. Clipless pedals help increase torque, smooth out your power delivery, reduce fatigue, and increase bike control...once youve mastered the skills necessary.

Well, I did 35 miles on the road today in the new spd setup. Very fast learning curve and yeah, seems to be a more efficient pedaling experience. That said, I still had achey soles by the end of the ride- even with my stiff new shoes. I think I'll look into some gel inserts.

I'll re-state, though- I can't picture doing technical singletrack climbs on a MTB with them. I need to get a foot off the pedal in a flash. I'll stick with toeclips on the trails.

Once you get used to them, you'll be able to get out as fast or faster than with toe clips. And you'll have an easier time getting back in if you have to restart in the middle of a technical section.