Ethics of Real Estate Investment, NIMYism and the Housing Crisis

if the community deems a property as valuable it should purchase that property, make up a deed restriction, then resell with said restriction. Not just zone the property so it never get developed and nobody ever wants to develop it. Eventually, interesting, historic, or beautiful properties just rot away, and when they are finally deemed as unsalvageable, a developer will come in and install their glass box. 

It would be better to somehow make it economiclly viable for that property to maintain its value to the community and the modern owner. 

pheller said:

if the community deems a property as valuable it should purchase that property, make up a deed restriction, then resell with said restriction. Not just zone the property so it never get developed and nobody ever wants to develop it. Eventually, interesting, historic, or beautiful properties just rot away, and when they are finally deemed as unsalvageable, a developer will come in and install their glass box. 

It would be better to somehow make it economiclly viable for that property to maintain its value to the community and the modern owner. 

Who makes that decision, and with what money? If these blighted buildings bother you so much, you buy them and fix them up.

I'm saying that the community comes together to form some sort of non-profit that buys up valuable land or historically significant properties. 

I don't think zoning should be used as the method for which we protect neighborhood character. 

pheller said:

I'm saying that the community comes together to form some sort of non-profit that buys up valuable land or historically significant properties. 

I don't think zoning should be used as the method for which we protect neighborhood character. 

Sounds good as everything is for sale at some price.  Go ahead and start the non-profit.

or did you mean "someone else" should do it?

In reply to pheller :

Umm... that sounds like the basic process of a variance. 
 

They are very common. 

In reply to SV reX :

Yep. My ex- owns an old house in a historic area. When she wanted to do her addition/remodel, she had to get a variance.  She keeps her house looking good, so it while the process was slightly tedious, it went through without a problem. One neighbor (she had to send letters to all neighbors within a certain radius) even contacted her and complimented her on the general maintenance upgrades and improvements she had done.

Variances are still by approval. You could be denied a variance, even if your neighbor for whatever reason was not. 

Historic Districts work differently. 

Steve_Jones said:

pheller said:

I'm saying that the community comes together to form some sort of non-profit that buys up valuable land or historically significant properties. 

I don't think zoning should be used as the method for which we protect neighborhood character. 

Sounds good as everything is for sale at some price.  Go ahead and start the non-profit.

or did you mean "someone else" should do it?

Not my fight.

My comments were directed at Frenchy. 

Seems like you've a bone to pick with me? Quit being a dick. 

pheller said:

Variances are still by approval. You could be denied a variance, even if your neighbor for whatever reason was not. 

 

Historic Districts work differently. 

Zoning changes are by approval too. 

In reply to pheller :

Steve can be abrasive, and is certainly not a Liberal. But honestly... Is he wrong?

You propose many, many ideas, and a lot of them are very good. But you really do sound like you are generally looking for "THEM" to do something about whatever problem you are seeing. 

What's wrong with you stepping up to the plate and taking the reigns for some of these efforts?  Why couldn't you be the one to start a non-profit?

In reply to SV reX :

It's very easy to spend other people's money.

SV reX said:

In reply to pheller :

Steve can be abrasive, and is certainly not a Liberal. But honestly... Is he wrong?

You propose many, many ideas, and a lot of them are very good. But you really do sound like you are generally looking for "THEM" to do something about whatever problem you are seeing. 

What's wrong with you stepping up to the plate and taking the reigns for some of these efforts?  Why couldn't you be the one to start a non-profit?

Because I don't really care about the redevelopment of supposedly historic properities in my city. That's Frenchy's deal. 

My gripe is with the efficient use of property. I do not like the idea of land banking by private entities, nor scenarios in which people buy housing and don't use it (not for STR, LTR, primary or at all). An entity buying a property for its future development plans is one thing, it's entirely different to buy a piece of land (in a urban area with high demand for housing), never touch it, never have any interest in touching it, and simply are using it as a place to park money. 

I started this thread because I believe (or at least formerly believed); in urban areas especially, that there is some profit motive for real estate investors to act as a cartel - to inadvertently and artificially constrain supply to boost property values and increase rents for no other purpose than profit - exhorbitant profit.

I'm ok with people making profit. I want to make a profit, but I don't want to screw people out of their own financial future by hoarding something they need. I too would like to own some rental properties, but my goal would be rent them - not to sit on them and ride appreciation. 

The thread has dispelled some of my preconcieved notions, but I still think our system is working against the productivity and competitiveness of our economy. 

In reply to pheller :

I'm glad you are open minded enough to consider shifting your position a little.  I still think that if you want to see change, it's reasonable to consider that you'd be the one to step up and lead such efforts. 
 

"Our system" is made of people. And the only way to implement any change, is for people to step up and make a difference.

In reply to pheller :

I understand your cover story about efficiency in utilization.  I just think you're overstating it to get down to your real agenda.

What you're talking about is not really a serious problem in most places.  Nowhere that I have been between Boston and Florida has a lot of empty properties being hoarded.

From MY perspective:

I interpreted Phellers non-profit idea as a response to Frenchy's post about turning historical or potentially historical buildings into glass boxes. He was'nt just complaining about problems with no insight. He used his sme as a city planner to propose an idea. Yall are getting lost in your own sauce. 

And a slight beef I have: It is okay to identify a problem and come up with a solution to present but not be able to implement. Just because you identified an issue and proposed a solution does not mean you have to be the one to implement the solution. Not everyone has the expertise, authority and resources to do all 3 (root cause analysis, solutioning and implementation). Telling someone to do it yourself is not motivating or helping. Even if his solution wasn't the best or needed refining, that's when we come together as a community to help solve the problem. His observations, thoughts, and solution ideas were not disparaging at all, to me. If leaders and peers (y'all) were more receptive and less ready to shoot down or discourage the messenger, we wouldn't be in the situations that we are in now. 

I'm not a business owner, I do not own any commercial property, I'm not a planning sme, or construction expert or anything useful to y'all. I'm just a dude that grew up poor and just barely not poor not that likes to watch people with more money than me talk over and through themselves. So, I should probably just shut up and color. But, that's my 2 cents. 

So run for public office. Turn your ideas into legitimate proposals. Let the people in your community vote and decide if they are in support of ideas like this or not.

In reply to yupididit :

Ok, but I disagree that either a legit problem  or a proposed solution has been voiced. 
 

Im not sure there is a single person on this forum who lives in his community or could be supportive of the idea. If the goal was to present the idea to people who could make a difference, he should appear before his city council. Not a bunch of anonymous automotive hacks on the internet. 

Maybe you're right: 

Anybody know if there is data out there that measures the amount of developable land (say, those proprieties supplied with infrastructure) that is not developed? 

SV reX said:

In reply to yupididit :

Ok, but I disagree that either a legit problem  or a proposed solution has been voiced. 

I'm guessing you're a person who can determine if his stated problems or solutions are legitimate or not. I'm not that person, so I'll leave it to you. 

Here's some interesting data:

"Included in this category are units held for occasional use, temporarily occupied by persons with usual residence elsewhere, and vacant for other reasons."

Vacation or investment homes:

In reply to pheller :

I have not spent any real time west of the Mississippi in 20 years. I've never spent any real time on the West Coast.

Perhaps it's different out there.

In reply to yupididit :

Complaining about a local housing and economic condition (which is inherently a political position) on a forum of people who are not connected to the community nor knowledgeable in the subject is not dealing with a problem as a legitimate proposal or solution. It's just stating a hypothetical to people who can't effect change. 
 

I don't need any specialized training to see that. 

In reply to SV reX :

Okay, so we can't bring up issues and discuss solutions on this forum, instead said forum member should talk to a public official. Noted. In that case, why do we add to the discussion by stating our expert and/or personal opinions. Or deem the problems/solutions as illegitimate because we don't see that from our own perspective. Aren't we doing the same thing just on the other end?  Keep that same energy for every thread you participate in. 

I say we and our because that's what we do on forums

I originally started this thread because I wanted to gain insight in how others across the nation perceived their local housing markets. 

Seems like I've gotten a good mix of opinions, most of which differ from my view or my local market.