In reply to ProDarwin :
As far as I know you can't get a mortgage on a trailer since you don't own the land.
In reply to ProDarwin :
As far as I know you can't get a mortgage on a trailer since you don't own the land.
In reply to Steve_Jones :
Sometimes you do. Sometimes you can. Its geographically dependent.
SV reX said:In reply to Steve_Jones :
Sometimes you do. Sometimes you can. Its geographically dependent.
I'm sure it is, even when you own the land from what I've seen, there's a mortgage on the land, separate loan on the trailer itself. Not that it really matters for this discussion though.
I'm glad you posted the example of your Son figuring it out as well, as I know plenty of people that bought starter homes recently even though it's not possible :)
Oh good point on the mortgage. When I uncheck 'manufactured', the lowest listing is $325k
I bought my first house in 1984- before I was married. I never lived in it. It was a multi-family in a bad part of town, and I didn't want to live there. I did live in my second one, but it was still a multi-family, and generated income.
It was 13 years before I was able to buy my first single family house in 1997, but I built it myself.
The first single family home I was able to buy outright (without having to build it) was in 2016. 32 years after I started trying to buy a house.
Making sacrifices to own a single family home is not new.
Steve_Jones said:In reply to Toyman! :
Save your typing. You have given a real world example of how it can, and has been done. The same people here have started the excuses on why it can't be, even though she did it.
They believe the excuses, she didn't. Good for her. You should be proud.
I don't think it can't be done but I do believe it's harder today than it used to be. I'm 34 and have bought 5 houses so far so clearly its doable. We just have to remember that many Americans can't even afford to have a E36 M3ty sub-$2000 project car right now while we encourage it amongst our tiny group.
I've learned something from reading the responses, genuinely - which is why I live this forum and feel comfortable posting. I'm less than 30 and we bought our house with 3% down, 4+years ago while drowning in student debt. We did it.
What's fun about looking at historically comparative numbers is that we have that data going back a long ways. And that it's not talking about you, or me, or your friend Joe - it's a comparison of the whole population of the US in one measure, to another. Whether or not it's a good measure (per Boost-Crazys post, sounds like it's probably lacking - not that we'd find a perfect measure), it's something interesting to look at.
Steve_Jones said:In reply to ProDarwin :
As far as I know you can't get a mortgage on a trailer since you don't own the land.
You can in SC, I don't know about other states. It does require doing the paperwork to de-title the mobile home and tie it to the deed for the land it is sitting on. That only works if you own the land.
Otherwise, mobile home financing is a lot like financing an RV or camper. It can be done but the interest rate is going to be several points higher than a traditional home mortgage. Looks like those rates are about 9% at the moment compared to 7% for a traditional mortgage.
In reply to Toyman! :
A friend of mine did that for his manufactured home late last year here in KY. I don't remember all the various details but the way I understood it, he had something that was akin to a construction loan when he bought the home and once it was delivered and installed there was a conversion process that turned it from a trailer (well, two trailers, I guess) into a house. The way he explained it, it sounded like once that conversion was completed, it was essentially forever after legally known as a house and would be treated as such.
In reply to wae :
Correct.
One of the houses my daughter was looking at was a mobile home on 2 acres. She put in an offer but the deal fell apart because the current owner didn't want to go to the trouble of de-titling the mobile home as specified in the offer. In that situation, she would have had to finance the property and the mobile home separately and it was going to add a fair amount to her monthly payment.
Affordability (price and interest rate) is the worst on record. But we're also coming out of a decade of the best affordability on record, with prices that tanked after the GFC and mortgage rates kept artificially low. It was a great time to buy, and many people (and entities) did.
Now, with rates returning to more historically normal numbers, the market is in shock, but prices are slowly coming down which should hopefully restore affordability to something less extreme:
In reply to wae :
I never knew this. We are looking to put a new manufactured home on 19 acres that we own in Louisiana for my MIL to move into. The land is owned 100% by us and manufactured homes looked to be a better option than building a house. It currently has a very old creepy house (1850s?) sitting on it but it isn't livable at all.
In reply to yupididit :
If you leave the manufactured one on wheels, it's considered a trailer and has a title like a vehicle. If you build a foundation and remove the wheels, it's considered a permanent structure and can be converted as such. This is in MD, PA, and NY at least but I'd think it's the same elsewhere.
As far as it currently being hard to buy a house, they're selling in a day in many places, so someone is buying them.
Steve_Jones said:As far as it currently being hard to buy a house, they're selling in a day in many places, so someone is buying them.
There's still enough demand for desirable homes that are well priced to be snatched up very quickly. But on a national level, overall sales volume this past spring was down 30% from 2021 and was comparable to 2008-2010. The market is obviously shrinking, with buyers having sticker shock and sellers with low mortgage rates staying put:
In reply to STM317 :
Sales volume is down because of low supply not because houses are sitting. Sales volume was way down for new vehicles over the last few years for the same reason.
STM317 said:Steve_Jones said:As far as it currently being hard to buy a house, they're selling in a day in many places, so someone is buying them.
There's still enough demand for desirable homes that are well priced to be snatched up very quickly. But on a national level, overall sales volume this past spring was down 30% from 2021 and was comparable to 2008-2010. The market is obviously shrinking, with buyers having sticker shock and sellers with low mortgage rates staying put:
The real shortage is in entry level homes. With property values what they are and the cost of construction what it is. Builders aren't building those. There is little if any profit left. Landlords are paying all cash for those in distressed areas. Closing as quickly as possible. Then going in and as cheaply as possibly making the place habitual. The resulting rent is always higher than a mortgage would be.
In reply to Steve_Jones :
You don't own the land with a condominium. There are plenty of ways to get a loan on a mobile home. It may not be a traditional 30 year mortgage but there are loans.
In reply to Steve_Jones :
Supply is a very large part no question. But 'Days on market' has climbed from the crazy lows of the last couple of years, and we seem to have passed the seasonal low and begun the fall slowdown:
Steve_Jones said:In reply to STM317 :
Sales volume is down because of low supply not because houses are sitting. Sales volume was way down for new vehicles over the last few years for the same reason.
Home supply is down for 4 reasons. Homeowners are staying in place due to low mortgage rates acquired in the past compared to current mortgage rates.
Foreigners are investing in American real estate as a way to get money out of places like China and the Middle East. Several properties in my neighborhood are sitting empty with a property management company keeping it up. Some are modest off the lake properties and some are Multi million dollar Lakeshore homes.
Third following the 2008 housing crisis a lot of contractors and their employees got out of the construction trade. As a result America is short almost a million homes.
Homeowners who lost their home due to foreclosure have that on their record and even if their income level is back to the point where homes are within their budget getting an affordable mortgage isn't possible.
ProDarwin said:Where I used to live, at my income level and the housing prices in the area, home ownership was just not achievable.
So I moved.
This discussion has given me a little different perspective on what we did. When we were looking to buy, in the late 80's, we were a single income family with two little kids, and the entry level homes where we lived were 10 times my income. Fortunately we hated that city, and ended up, accidentally, in the country where we paid 4 times my income. I'm doing the math against young people I know today, and prices don't seem that much different than they were then.
Shortly after we had a pretty good recession and prices dropped significantly.
67LS1 said:In reply to Steve_Jones :
You don't own the land with a condominium. There are plenty of ways to get a loan on a mobile home. It may not be a traditional 30 year mortgage but there are loans.
Which is why I said "get a mortgage" not "get a loan" I also pointed out that you can get a loan on one and a mortgage on the land. You can get a mortgage on a condo because it's a building, it's not going anywhere. A mobile home is considered a "vehicle" in most states. In MD you get a title from the MVA just like on a car.
Steve_Jones said:In reply to yupididit :
If you leave the manufactured one on wheels, it's considered a trailer and has a title like a vehicle. If you build a foundation and remove the wheels, it's considered a permanent structure and can be converted as such. This is in MD, PA, and NY at least but I'd think it's the same elsewhere.
As far as it currently being hard to buy a house, they're selling in a day in many places, so someone is buying them.
We plan to put it on a spot that already has a concrete slab, that particular spot also keeps it out of the way from being flooded from the Red River. I have not considered leaving it on wheels.
Investors are still buying a lot of homes. I'm sure we all get the mail and phone calls from investment companies offering to buy your house etc. And they will jump on a house with a cash offer within a few hours of being listed.
Peabody said:ProDarwin said:Where I used to live, at my income level and the housing prices in the area, home ownership was just not achievable.
So I moved.
This discussion has given me a little different perspective on what we did. When we were looking to buy, in the late 80's, we were a single income family with two little kids, and the entry level homes where we lived were 10 times my income. Fortunately we hated that city, and ended up, accidentally, in the country where we paid 4 times my income. I'm doing the math against young people I know today, and prices don't seem that much different than they were then.
Shortly after we had a pretty good recession and prices dropped significantly.
I did exactly that post Vietnam War recession.
Inflation drove up house prices. And mortgage rates. That killed values. While mortgage rates remained high So property values briefly dropped. But VA loans were forced to comply with state limits. Although traditionally high (5&1/2%?) as the recession continued they dropped back down and I refinanced.
There for about a year and a half was a brief opening where I had to jump in.
It's going to happen now too. Rates have peaked and are coming down. Prices are only up 5% around the lake where higher is more normal.
I'm sure regular homes are only up a couple percent. ( lower than inflation).
yupididit said:Steve_Jones said:In reply to Toyman! :
Save your typing. You have given a real world example of how it can, and has been done. The same people here have started the excuses on why it can't be, even though she did it.
They believe the excuses, she didn't. Good for her. You should be proud.
I don't think it can't be done but I do believe it's harder today than it used to be. I'm 34 and have bought 5 houses so far so clearly its doable. We just have to remember that many Americans can't even afford to have a E36 M3ty sub-$2000 project car right now while we encourage it amongst our tiny group.
When is "used to be'? There are 2 examples in the last few pages of people doing it in the last 2 years. My Daughter bought hers 16 months ago. People buy starter houses everyday all across the country. I'm sure we can find people bitching in 1995 how it "used to be" easy to buy a house. 20 years from now people will be telling my kids how "it was easy when you did it"
Steve_Jones said:yupididit said:Steve_Jones said:In reply to Toyman! :
Save your typing. You have given a real world example of how it can, and has been done. The same people here have started the excuses on why it can't be, even though she did it.
They believe the excuses, she didn't. Good for her. You should be proud.
I don't think it can't be done but I do believe it's harder today than it used to be. I'm 34 and have bought 5 houses so far so clearly its doable. We just have to remember that many Americans can't even afford to have a E36 M3ty sub-$2000 project car right now while we encourage it amongst our tiny group.
When is "used to be'? There are 2 examples in the last few pages of people doing it in the last 2 years. My Daughter bought hers 16 months ago. People buy starter houses everyday all across the country. I'm sure we can find people bitching in 1995 how it "used to be" easy to buy a house. 20 years from now people will be telling my kids how "it was easy when you did it"
Yes people buy houses everyday and forever will. That and yall examples does not mean its not harder now. I gave an example on how it was recently harder to purchase a house for me than it was for me than my purchases in 2017 and 2018. We're all giving personal examples about it but none of it makes either of us correct.
I'm not going to go back and forth about it though, I'm not that guy. I think we have different perspectives and will not agree beyond what we currently believe and already agree on.
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