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John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/27/10 2:01 p.m.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/Former-NBAer-criticizes-Haitian-relief-efforts-012710?GT1=39002

Updated Jan 27, 2010 1:35 PM ET Paul Shirley has probably become public enemy No. 1 in Haiti and elsewhere. The former NBA player posted a long column online in response to the earthquake disaster in Haiti in which he criticized Haitian citizens and said he won't donate to relief efforts. "I haven’t donated to the Haitian relief effort for the same reason that I don't give money to homeless men on the street," he wrote. "Based on past experiences, I don't think the guy with the sign that reads 'Need You're Help' is going to do anything constructive with the dollar I might give him. If I use history as my guide, I don't think the people of Haiti will do much with my money either." And he didn't stop there, even writing a letter to the people of Haiti. "Dear Haitians," he wrote, "First of all, kudos on developing the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere. Your commitment to human rights, infrastructure, and birth control should be applauded. "As we prepare to assist you in this difficult time, a polite request: If it’s possible, could you not re-build your island home in the image of its predecessor? Could you not resort to the creation of flimsy shanty- and shack-towns? And could some of you maybe use a condom once in a while?" He also asked what's being done to prevent this tragedy from happening again, using New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina as an example. "We did the same after Hurricane Katrina," he said. "We were quick to vilify humans who were too slow to respond to the needs of victims, forgetting that the victims had built and maintained a major city below sea level in a known target zone for hurricanes. Our response: Make the same mistake again. Rebuild a doomed city, putting aside logic as we did." Shirley has been dropped as a freelance writer for ESPN for his comments on Haiti.

Paul Shirley is my favorite writer now, I am seriously considering starting a Paul Shirley for World Leader Facebook Page.

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess SuperDork
1/27/10 2:56 p.m.

I'll Friend ya, or whatever it is they do on Facebook. I guess I'll have to register on FB then.

slefain
slefain Dork
1/27/10 3:22 p.m.

He hath a point.

And of course his comments are taken out of context. Here's his post:

I do not know if what I’m about to write makes me a monster. I do know that it makes me a part of a miniscule minority, if Internet trends and news stories of the past weeks are any guide.

“It”, is this:

I haven’t donated a cent to the Haitian relief effort. And I probably will not.

I haven’t donated to the Haitian relief effort for the same reason that I don’t give money to homeless men on the street. Based on past experiences, I don’t think the guy with the sign that reads “Need You’re Help” is going to do anything constructive with the dollar I might give him. If I use history as my guide, I don’t think the people of Haiti will do much with my money either.

In this belief I am, evidently, alone. It seems that everyone has jumped on the “Save Haiti” bandwagon. To question the impulse to donate, then, will probably be viewed as analogous with rooting for Charles Manson, John Wayne Gacy, or the Spice Girls.

My wariness has much to do with the fact that the sympathy deployed to Haiti has been done so unconditionally. Very few have said, written, or even intimated the slightest admonishment of Haiti, the country, for putting itself into a position where so many would be killed by an earthquake.

I can’t help but wonder why questions have not been raised in the face of this outpouring of support. Questions like this one:

Shouldn’t much of the responsibility for the disaster lie with the victims of that disaster?

Before the reader reaches for his or her blood pressure medication, he should allow me to explain. I don’t mean in any way that the Haitians deserved their collective fate. And I understand that it is difficult to plan for the aftermath of an earthquake. However, it is not outside the realm of imagination to think that the citizens of a country might be able to: A) avoid putting themselves into a situation that might result in such catastrophic loss of life. And B) provide for their own aid, in the event of such a catastrophe.

Imagine that I’m a caveman. Imagine that I’ve chosen to build my house out of balsa wood, and that I’m building it next to a roaring river because I’ve decided it will make harvesting fish that much easier. Then, imagine that my hut is destroyed by a flood.

Imagining what would happen next is easier than imagining me carrying a caveman’s club. If I were lucky enough to survive the roaring waters that took my hut, my tribesmen would say, “Building next to the river was pretty dumb, wasn’t it?.” Or, if I weren’t so lucky, they’d say, “At least we don’t have to worry about that moron anymore.”

Sure, you think, but those are cavemen. We’re more civilized now – we help each other, even when we make mistakes.

True enough. But what about when people repeat their mistakes? And what about when they do things that obviously act against their own self-interests?

In the case of mistakes and warnings as applied to Haiti, I don’t mean to indict those who ignored actual warnings against earthquakes, of which there were many before the recent one. Although it would have been prudent to pay heed to those, I suppose.

Instead, I’m referring to the circumstances in which people lived. While the earthquake was, obviously, unavoidable, the way in which many of the people of Haiti lived was not. Regrettably, some Haitians would have died regardless of the conditions in that country. But the fact that so many people lived in such abject poverty exacerbated the extent of the crisis.

How could humans do this to themselves? And what’s being done to stop it from happening again?

After the tsunami of 2004, the citizens of the world wailed and donated and volunteered for cleanup, rarely asking the important – and, I think, obvious – question: What were all those people doing there in the first place? Just as important: If they move back to a place near the ocean that had just been destroyed by a giant wave, shouldn’t our instinct be to say, “Go ahead if you want, but you’re on your own now.”?

We did the same after Hurricane Katrina. We were quick to vilify humans who were too slow to respond to the needs of victims, forgetting that the victims had built and maintained a major city below sea level in a known target zone for hurricanes. Our response: Make the same mistake again. Rebuild a doomed city, putting aside logic as we did.

And now, faced with a similar situation, it seems likely that we will do the same.

Shouldn’t there be some discourse on how the millions of dollars that are being poured into Haiti will be spent? And at least a slight reprimand for the conditions prior to the earthquake? Some kind of inquisition? Something like this?:

Dear Haitians –

First of all, kudos on developing the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere. Your commitment to human rights, infrastructure, and birth control should be applauded.

As we prepare to assist you in this difficult time, a polite request: If it’s possible, could you not re-build your island home in the image of its predecessor? Could you not resort to the creation of flimsy shanty- and shack-towns? And could some of you maybe use a condom once in a while?

Sincerely,

The Rest of the World

It shouldn’t be outlandish to hope that we might stop short of the reactionary word that is so often flung about after natural (and unnatural) disasters. That word: Rebuild. Thus, the tired, knee-jerk cycle of aid/assist/rebuild would be replaced by a new one: Aid/assist/let’s-stop-and-think-before-we-screw-this-up-again.

If forced to do so through logic-colored glasses, no one would look at Haiti and think, “You know what? It was a great idea to put 10 million people on half of an island. The place is routinely battered by hurricanes (in 2008, $900 million was lost/spent on recovery from them), it holds the aforementioned title of poorest nation in the Western hemisphere, and it happens to sit on a tectonic fault line.”

If it were apparent that Haiti would likely rebuild in an earthquake-resistant way, and if a cure could be found for hurricane abuse of island nations, then maybe one could imagine putting a sustained effort into rebuilding the place. But that would only be feasible if the country had shown any ability to manage its affairs in the past, which it has not done.

I can tell, based on my own reaction to that last sentence, that it might strike a nerve. The reader might be tempted to think, “We can’t blame the people of Haiti for their problems. Surely it’s someone else’s fault.” A similar sentiment can be found in this quote, from article on the geology behind the quake:

“Unfortunately, [Haiti]’s government was not in a position to really do much to prepare for the inevitable large earthquake, leaving tens of thousands to suffer the consequences.”

The sentiment expressed is one of outrage at the government. But, ultimately, the people in a country have control over their government. One could argue that in totalitarian regimes, they do not have much control, but in the end, it is their government. And therefore, their responsibility. If the government is not doing enough for the people, it is the people’s responsibility to change the government. Not the other way around.

Additionally, some responsibility for the individual lies with that individual.

A Haitian woman, days after the earthquake:

“We need so much. Food, clothes, we need everything. I don’t know whose responsibility it is, but they need to give us something soon,” said Sophia Eltime, a mother of two who has been living under a bed sheet with seven members of her extended family. (From an AP report.)

Obviously, a set of circumstances such as the one in which Ms. Eltime was living is a heart-wrenching one. And for that, anyone would be sympathetic. Until she says, “I don’t know whose responsibility it is.” I don’t know whose responsibility it is, either. What I do know is that it is not the responsibility of the outside world to provide help. It’s nice if we do, but it is not a requirement, especially when people choose to influence their own existences negatively, whether by having too many children when they can’t afford them or by failing to recognize that living in a concrete bunker might not be the best way to protect one’s family, whether an earthquake happens or not.

Ms. Eltime’s reaction helps define what is the crux of my problem with the reaction to this and to other humanitarian crises. I recoil at the notion that I’m SUPPOSED to do something. I would like to help, but only if I feel that my assistance is deserved and justified. If I perceive that I am being told to feel a certain way, and if I can point to a pattern of mistakes made in similar situations, I lose interest.

When I was young, the great humanitarian crisis facing our world – as portrayed by the media, anyway – was the starving masses in Africa. The solution found, of course, was to send bag after bag of food to those people, forgetting the long-understood maxim that giving more food to poor people allows them to create more poor people. (Admittedly, it’s a harsh truth.) At the time, my classmates and I, young and naïve as we were, thought we had come up with a better solution. “They should just go somewhere else,” we said. Our teacher grimaced, saying, “It’s not that simple.”

It still isn’t. And I’m not as naïve as I once was – I don’t think the people of Haiti have the option of moving. But I do think that our assistance should be restricted, like it should be in cases of starvation. It simply does not work to give, unconditionally. What might work is to teach. In the case of famine-stricken segments of Africa, teaching meant making people understand that a population of people needs a certain amount of food, and that the creation of that food has to be self-sustaining for the system to work. In the case of earthquake-stricken Haiti, teaching might mean limited help, but help that is accompanied by criticism of the circumstances that made that help necessary.

In the case of the Haitian earthquake, it’s heartening to see people caring about the fates of their fellow men. What is alarming, I think, is the sometimes illogical frenzy toward casting those affected by the earthquake as helpless, innocent souls who were placed on the island of Hispaniola by an invisible force. In the case of some, this analogy might well be accurate; children cannot very well control their destinies. And as far as sympathy goes, much of it should go to those children.

But children are brought into the world by their parents. Those parents have a responsibility – to themselves and to their kids – to provide. They have a responsibility to look around – before an earthquake happens – and say, “I need to improve this situation, because if a catastrophe were to happen, we’d be in bad shape.”

The people of whom I write are adults. Functional, human adults with functional, human adult brains. It is not too much to ask that they behave as such. That they stand up and say, “Yes, we screwed this up the first time. We are forever indebted to you. Now show us how we can do it right. So that, next time, we won’t need your help.”

Spinout007
Spinout007 GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
1/27/10 4:37 p.m.

AWESOME!

4cylndrfury
4cylndrfury Dork
1/28/10 6:36 a.m.

FTMFW

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 6:39 a.m.

Changed your mind, eh fury?

4cylndrfury
4cylndrfury Dork
1/28/10 10:47 a.m.

indeed

I was formerly a sheep

aircooled
aircooled SuperDork
1/28/10 10:49 a.m.

In general, all pretty true. I am not sure I would lay a lot of blame for the Haitian government on the populace though. Certainly the leaders come from the populace, but I think it is pretty clear they have not acted in the common interest historically and the populace had little they could do except revolt. There was also a "brain drain" of sorts in the past where most of the educated populace left the island during one of the bad times, so that doesn't help either.

I very important point is made though: Hopefully all the aid that is going to Haiti will be used to build that country into something useful. It was a very prosperous country a long while back (farming, coffee, sugar I believe) and probably could return to something decent.

I have heard the "aid" situation there is a bit suspect, the leaders of the aid organizations living in large estates etc. It seems like there has been to much "giving them fish" rather then "teaching them to fish", but I really don't know.

Jay
Jay Dork
1/28/10 11:42 a.m.

Wow! That was moronic. And it that kind of thinking really makes me angry. I'm pretty much the farthest thing from a bleeding-heart welfare lovin' socialist as you could get, but blaming ten million impoverished people for their country getting destroyed in a natural disaster is beyond asinine. If you were Haitian - even if you knew anything about fault lines and earthquake risks which you probably wouldn't because most people in the 3rd world can't afford sixteen years of rigorous education like we can - where would you go? For most people, every other country on earth has slammed its doors shut thanks to governments, visa requirements, work permits, and various anti-immigration bureaucracy. I'll bet most Haitians don't have a passport and couldn't afford the visa fees for anywhere "better" even if you gave them a free flight. What are they supposed to do?

I have to pick on this bit:

Some moron sports player who really shouldn't open his dumb mouth wrote: After the tsunami of 2004, the citizens of the world wailed and donated and volunteered for cleanup, rarely asking the important – and, I think, obvious – question: What were all those people doing there in the first place? Just as important: If they move back to a place near the ocean that had just been destroyed by a giant wave, shouldn’t our instinct be to say, “Go ahead if you want, but you’re on your own now.”?

I can't say as much about Haiti but I've travelled extensively throughout the areas of Indonesia that were destroyed in that tsunami. "What were all those people doing there in the first place?", he asks... Well, maybe they'd been there for centuries, i.e. since long before anyone figured out earthquakes weren't just God being a dick, and maybe they made their traditional livelyhoods from the sea. Banda Aceh, which was completely destroyed by that tsunami, had two million people! What are you going to do? Send government thugs in to round up everyone, forcibly move them away from the sea and then let them live on welfare because they can't fish or farm rice anymore? Hell the whole of Indonesia is a "hazard zone." It's 230 million people on a bunch of tiny islands in the middle of a freaking subduction arc. Should we move them all by force or what? This attitude is beyond stupid and I can't believe anyone with half a brain would advocate them. We're talking millions of people, not a little fishing village underneath a mudslide here.

THAT SAID... Back to Haiti... Do I think giving "aid" money to whats left of the Haitian government is going to magically bring the country out of poverty? Hell no. Do I also think that means individuals shouldn't help on their own? Just as much hell no. Sadly a lot of the "aid" campaigns are just as corrupt and greedy as the governments, which is why I don't usually donate to those types of things (if they're spending money advertising everywhere or bothering me on the telephone, there not spending money in Haiti!) but there are legitimate ways for everyone to help if you feel you need to. Just do your homework.

Next month I'll be in Indonesia again installing more tsunami warning system equipment. This time I'm going to be in Padang, which was a really nice, wealthy, modern town that got obliterated by another earthquake late last year, and the Mentawai islands, some of which are so poor nobody can read (and actually fared rather better in the same earthquake - even though they're right across the strait.) I'm going there because it's my job, but it's my job because I wanted to do it. As I'm part Indonesian myself maybe you could call it karma or whatever. I don't believe in karma. I will happily donate some money to Haiti as long as I can be sure it will go to Haiti and not feed some fat bureaucrat behind a desk. I'm looking into that now.

Geez. I think that was the longest angry rant I've ever posted on here, and it definitely was the most I've ever said about my political opinions, but it really had to be said. Thanks for reading.

Jay
Jay Dork
1/28/10 12:00 p.m.

I should probably clarify that I'm not calling any of you morons (even if you agreed with the sentiment!) We all have our opinions. It's just those who trumpet them as loudly as possible (such as in this case Mr. Paul Shirley here) even though they're based on no information whatsoever, who do the most damage.

I also have no intention of getting into a mudslinging fight with anyone here. I just had to get that off my chest.

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 12:02 p.m.

I both agree and disagree with the sentiment. I really do see both sides of this fence.

1: The rush for aid is needed. The difference between 100 people in Carmel losing their houses to a fire and 150,000 dead bodies in rubble in Port Au Prince is drastically different. Every ounce of help is needed when the toll is that great.

2: I support the Red Cross/Red Crescent. They are a legitimate agency that is at the forefront of most emergencies.

3: I agree with the skepticism of the writer in just throwing money at this situation. I agree New Orleans should not have been rebuilt. I agree that Port Au Prince should not be rebuilt in the same manner. Move the city and take advantage of the information that is now available, don't just rebuild it because it was fine where it was for thousands of years.

4: Why fire the guy for an opinion that is less politically correct (and tactless) than what modern society prefers?

4cylndrfury
4cylndrfury Dork
1/28/10 12:18 p.m.

I felt just the same way Jay, until I thought logically about the article above., then I got to thinking...once upon a time, Americans were repressed by their govt and forced to live in squalor.

then 1776 happened.

Theres no reason the same type of revolutionary change cant happen elsewhere. No one blames Haiti for being devastated by an earthquake, It happened in california a few times too...loss of life, possesions, infrastructure. But California had a plan and the right people and apparatus in place to deal with an earthquake. We blame Haitians for not having a plan for the aftermath. Granted, they probably cant afford the kind of fire and medical, and security, and aid response we have, but something is better than nothing...which, apparently, [nothing] sounded good enough for Haitians since they apparently lay responsibility for emergency response on other nations.

Also, (and this is just plain responsibility, not just disaster response) if you cant afford substantial shelter..i.e a house/apartment/trailer/non-hut, dont have 11 children. Its not rocket science.

QUIT GETTING FREAKY IF YOU CANT PAY THE RENT.

Jay
Jay Dork
1/28/10 12:54 p.m.

Okay, I should clarify my position here a bit (after a bowl of soup my last post seemed a bit, er, inflammatory.) I don't think throwing money at Haiti in general will fix it. That's why if I donate, I want to know I'm paying for someone to do something useful with it. *

HOWEVER - and here's what bugs me about the statement from Shirley - you can't compare helping a huge group of people rebuild to giving money to a bum. The actions of individuals don't scale up to whole countries, and vice versa. (Isn't this the same argument we've all had with our insurance companies when they try to raise the rates because someone else has an accident?) I agree that cutting him off and saying "no" may be a great way to get an alcoholic brother to shape up and take responsibility for himself, but you just can't do that to a society of millions. Haitians aren't poor because they were lazy or stupid, they are poor because there are no opportunities for them to do any better. That's why I think "we" - i.e. the rest of the world - and I'm definitely not talking about governments or the UN or anything like that here because I believe governments are useless and irrelevant - do have some obligation to chip in and help out. I'm not saying everyone everywhere should roll up their sleeves and go down there and start building houses - there are limits to what I'd consider practical aid - but don't just assume like Shirley has that they're in this situation because they're stupid and therefore it's your duty not to lift a finger.

Unlike in "the first world" where it's the other way around, the most impoverished people on Earth are some of the hardest working people on Earth. It pays not to forget that.

(* Here's an example - this past Christmas, after I insisted a million times that I didn't want "stuff" as presents - my sister made a donation on my behalf to an organization that buys herds of livestock for the rural poor in Africa and then sends workers to them to teach them sustainable farming. How is this not a good idea? She bought "me" a goat because that's my favourite animal to invoke while cursing.)

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 1:01 p.m.

As in "You filthy son of a goat!"?

Jensenman
Jensenman SuperDork
1/28/10 2:20 p.m.

I will say that it would not surprise me to see a lot of the monetary aid wind up in a very few pockets down there. That would give me pause when it comes time to just write a check.

A little history:

Papa Doc and Baby Doc raped Haiti. The tax money which should have gone to infrastructure improvement and education went for idiotic crap like $3 million marriages. On January 16, Baby Doc (living in exile in Paris, boo hoo hoo) set up an aid fund with $8 million of his mother's money, so maybe he now feels like he should give a little back. About damn time.

Anyway, the point is that the Haitians are still struggling with the repercussions of the two Docs, much as China is still tring to shake off the effects of Mao. Doesn't happen overnight.

Tha Haitian government since the Docs isn't a lot of help. Looks to me like 'meet the new boss, same as the old boss'.

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 2:45 p.m.
Jensenman wrote: Looks to me like 'meet the new boss, same as the old boss'.

How did this turn to American politics?

Oh nevermind I reread it... It just looks and sounds the same.

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess SuperDork
1/28/10 3:00 p.m.

I found this editorial http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=122583 interesting:

Jane Chastain said: The truth about Haiti -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted: January 21, 2010 1:00 am Eastern © 2010 The devastating 7.0 earthquake that struck Haiti on Jan. 12 has produced nonstop coverage of this tiny impoverished nation. However, many of the pundits who have been presented to the public as experts on the poorest country in our hemisphere have shown their ignorance. Since 1990, Haiti has received more than $6 billion dollars in aid, $3 billion from the U.S. alone. Add to that another $1.5 billion it has borrowed from international sources (the debt has now been forgiven). Some said that is tantamount to pouring money down a rat hole. How is it that this poor country that is within spitting distance of our shores is still unable to help itself? Is Haiti a lost cause? Hardly. Unfortunately, our efforts to help this country have done more harm than good and we need to learn from our most recent mistakes if we sincerely want to give the people a hand up and finally become the good neighbor Haiti deserves. I have been writing and reporting on Haiti for 18 years (having posted columns going back to 1992 on my blog). Also, I am on the Advisory Board of Childcare Worldwide, a Christian organization that ministers to the poorest of the poor. My husband and I have sponsored and educated two girls in Haiti who survived the earthquake and were scheduled to graduate this spring. The Duvliers, Francois "Papa Doc" and Jean-Claude "Baby Doc," ruled Haiti with iron fists from 1957 to 1986. During that time many Haitians fled to the U.S. to escape persecution. In 1986, a revolution began, and the Reagan administration persuaded "Baby Doc" to leave. The way was paved for a free election. In 1990, Jean Betrand Aristide, a former priest who was expelled from the Salesian order for preaching the righteousness of class violence, was overwhelmingly elected president. The results were predictable: Aristide forcibly removed the mayors in rural areas, unilaterally named five judges to the Supreme Court and began a seven-month reign of terror as brutal as any Haiti had ever seen. As a result, he was forcibly removed by the army and fled to the United States. President George H. W. Bush was the first to prop up Aristide. His foreign policy consisted of supporting existing governments, no matter how bad or corrupt they were. At his urging, the Organization of American States began enforcing a blockade against Haiti. This wiped out the country's light industry and destroyed the small but growing middle class. Bush then signed an executive order that gave Aristide access to Haiti's treasury. Aristide used Haiti's money to hire a former Clinton campaign aid, Michael Barnes, as his lawyer. He also hired McKinney & McDowell – a top public-relations firm that handled such clients as the NAACP, the African National Congress and the National Organization of Women – to launch a campaign in Washington to promote his return to the island. In 1994, President Clinton sent American troops to invade Haiti and forced Aristide back on his people. This was a terrible and costly mistake. Aristide continued to misbehave and stole the country blind. When his term was over he formally stepped aside but continued to rule the country, de facto, with an army of paid thugs from a sprawling pink palace he built for himself and his militia. In May of 2000, after Aristide's Lavalas Party stole the Senate elections and forced Leon Manus, the jurist who ruled it a fraud, to flee for his life, the OAS and the United States simply gave up on Haiti. Aristide was formally elected president again in a process that was so corrupt that barely 5 percent of the people even bothered to vote. The turmoil continued until Aristide was finally removed to the Central African Republic with the aid of the administration of George W. Bush. During the Aristide years, Haiti went from one of the poorest countries in this hemisphere to one of the poorest countries in the world. After Aristide's departure, the news media slowly pulled up stakes and the world lost interest in the plight of this desperate country, made worse by a series of devastating hurricanes and tropical storms. Before any fledgling democracy can take hold, order must be restored. This was a tall order for the new coalition government in a country that had been ruled by violence and drug lords. When this government took over there were 2,500 police for a country with 8 and a half million people. Before the earthquake struck, the drug lords were on the run and the number of police had risen to 9,500, with plans to ramp up to 14,000 by 2011. Just how many members of that government survived the earthquake is anyone's guess. The principle "You break it, you fix it" should apply here. It is ironic that former presidents Clinton and Bush have come together to call attention to Haiti's plight. Perhaps now the country finally will get the kind of focused attention that it needs to get back on its feet.
MitchellC
MitchellC Dork
1/28/10 3:10 p.m.
4cylndrfury wrote: then 1776 happened. Theres no reason the same type of revolutionary change cant happen elsewhere. No one blames Haiti for being devastated by an earthquake, It happened in california a few times too...loss of life, possesions, infrastructure. But California had a plan and the right people and apparatus in place to deal with an earthquake. We blame Haitians for not having a plan for the aftermath. Granted, they probably cant afford the kind of fire and medical, and security, and aid response we have, but something is better than nothing...which, apparently, [nothing] sounded good enough for Haitians since they apparently lay responsibility for emergency response on other nations..

I would argue that our country's success owes a lot more to our resources than our work ethic. We have cash all over the place in the form of timber, fertile land, minerals, and two oceans. Yes, a stable government is necessary to organize it all, but what if there is nothing to organize?

To many the scale of the loss doesn't seem to be sinking in. Reportedly about 150,000 Haitians were killed by the earthquake, which is about 1.7% of the country's population. As a comparison, the United States lost 0.35% of its population to all of World War II.

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 3:16 p.m.

But the US lost .35% of it's population, PRIMARILY MEN 18-35 YEARS OLD, and that greatly affected our manufacturing workforce. The lack of able bodied men caused a shift towards women working, which allowed for two income families later and then a financial growth.

People went to work.

MitchellC
MitchellC Dork
1/28/10 3:29 p.m.

But what if there were no factories, no land to farm, no ore to mine, and no capital to fund the efforts in the first place?

cwh
cwh SuperDork
1/28/10 3:32 p.m.

OK, I do not know all the details. Typical American. I do know that the history of Haiti is a country that has been exploited by governments (France) despotic rulers (The Duvaliers) and nature. I am hoping that this disaster can bring about a change in Haiti. The people need to be more involved in governing their country. Are they ready to do that? I really don't know. The citizens there have been victimized by so many, for so long, that it will be difficult. POSSIBLY with some direction and a decent Haitian help, they can do it. All I am sure of at this point is that I cannot turn my back on the situation. And, no, I do not give money to the bum on the corner.

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 3:33 p.m.

In response to MitchellC:

Then there is very little chance the country survives and the land is swallowed up by a larger country with better financial, farming, manufacturing or fighting acumen.

aircooled
aircooled SuperDork
1/28/10 3:47 p.m.
MitchellC wrote: I would argue that our country's success owes a lot more to our resources than our work ethic....

Haiti is relatively rich in natural resources they have a lot (at least it used to) of very good farm land. They could very likely create a pretty good economy based on Coffee, Sugar, Tobacco etc. Not like having diamonds, gold or uranium, but certainly enough to make the country stand on its own.

That country has been a huge CF long before the "Docs" also. It has been basically crap since the turn of the century! (the 20th that is).

John Brown
John Brown GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/28/10 4:00 p.m.

The Dominican Republic grows left fielders like crazy, why can't Haiti?

DoctorBlade
DoctorBlade Reader
1/28/10 4:01 p.m.

Mr. Shirley, Summarized:

"They're idiots. Let 'em rot."

Er, no thanks. Maybe it's about time we really did something nice for the island, like not foist maniacal dictators off on it.

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