Goodnight Baltimore!

racerdave600 wrote: Right now, we do not do that in this country. We pit everyone against the other and wonder why nothing works out. Right now, anyone other than you is always the "enemy" in terms of how they are portrayed. Under those circumstances, there is no winning for anyone. You have to find common traits and work from there, even if the common trait is simple as showing respect.

Simple.. it is easier to control us when we are busy infighting.

I am almost a quarter Seneca, but to look at me, you would think me white. Not many people at work, or even my friends know of my heritage, it gives me quite a differing point of view when make racially charged comments. Because I look white, the biggest offenders seem to think that I am white, so they do not hold their tongues like they would around what they could consider an "inferior race"

mndsm wrote: BE the police, and maybe not beat the E36 M3 out of everyone?

Assuming police force candidates are selected on their merits, they can’t.

Regardless of what the technical requirements are, in a practical sense, they’d need to make it through a series of filters (bachelor’s degree > clean criminal record > clean drug screen) before even getting to a sniff test.

I’m pretty confident that basically none of the rioters could check all three boxes…many probably couldn’t even check one.

I’m not judging anybody…I believe that if I were raised in the same environmental, I’d likely be blowing stuff up too. However, that doesn’t change the fact that for nearly all of them, their opportunity has passed.

The day politicians and celebrities join together and say “don’t have children you’re not prepared to raise” we will have turned the corner; until then, Rome will burn.

tonight.... it looks like the anti rioters have come out.

RX Reven' wrote:

mndsm wrote: BE the police, and maybe not beat the E36 M3 out of everyone?

Assuming police force candidates are selected on their merits, they can’t. Regardless of what the technical requirements are, in a practical sense, they’d need to make it through a series of filters (bachelor’s degree > clean criminal record > clean drug screen) before even getting to a sniff test. I’m pretty confident that basically none of the rioters could check all three boxes…many probably couldn’t even check one. I’m not judging anybody…I believe that if I were raised in the same environmental, I’d likely be blowing stuff up too. However, that doesn’t change the fact that for nearly all of them, their opportunity has passed. The day politicians and celebrities join together and say “don’t have children you’re not prepared to raise” we will have turned the corner; until then, Rome will burn.

That's more my point, you can get out if you choose to not act a fool. Environment may make it more difficult, but not impossible. Someone has to discontinue the cycle. And from what I've seen, other than the one mom that whupped her kids ass for rioting,no one seems to want to break the cycle. I grew up poor, both my bio parents are dead due to substance abuse. Never done a drug, I have two jobs. Not that hard if you pull your head out of your ass....

In reply to mndsm:

berkeleying a!

We live in the land of opportunity, not the land of entitlement. Im the second generation of either side of the family to be born here. Both sets of grandparents immigrated. We've always busted ass to get ahead. Didn't nobody hand us E36 M3.

Im the son of a dirt farmer turned traveling salesman. Worked my way through college after rehab. Got a wife, kid, house, and four cars. Only major debt is house and medical. No credit card. Don't even have one.

When we, as a society, decide to take personal responsibility for our lives and actions, this kind of stuff will not happen on this wide spread a scale. Its not about what you were born to, but what you do with it.

Close the city and tell the people that something's coming to call Death and darkness are rushing forward to take a bite from the wall, oh

You've nothing to say
They're breaking away
If you listen to fools...
The Mob Rules
The Mob Rules

Kill the spirit and you'll be blinded, the end is always the same
Play with fire, you burn your fingers and lose your hold of the flame, oh

It's over, it's done
The end is begun
If you listen to fools...
The Mob Rules

You've nothing to say
Oh, They're breaking away
If you listen to fools...

Break the circle and stop the movement, the wheel is thrown to the ground
Just remember it might start rolling and take you right back around

You're all fools!
The Mob Rules!

Sorry. It had to be done.

oops.. somebody used that nasty code word.. "entitlement"

While I cannot say anything about previous generations.. but I would not want to be just starting out right now. Your choices are a sky high priced education that is no guarantee of getting a job better than flipping burgers.. or flipping burgers.

This is truly a terrible time to be looking for a decent living. I know.. I did the two jobs.. heck, as a stagehand, one year I needed to bring 12 W2s in to do my taxes.. I busted my hump that year trying to keep a roof over my head.

"entitlements" have their place.. if they didn't exist at all, then 10 years ago when the economy died, it would have been "the grapes of wrath" all over again. My Great Grandmother lived that tale.. she and her fledgling family moved to the deserts of California to scratch out a living for a few years before heading back east. It was not easy then, and would be near impossible now.

For the people living in Baltimore and the like cities, hope is the first casualty when the powers that be do their best to keep you downtrodden and under control

In reply to mad_machine:

Psssst... Lord Baltimore was granted title to the joint, it's not a new thing ;)

In reply to RX Reven':

The problem with your statement about the qualifications for police is that most departments do NOT require anything more than a HS diploma (certainly not a BS degree), and a great many are willing to overlook a certain amount of a criminal record.

Cops often get into the job due to the low bar set (a result of the low wages for starting police). It would likely improve our force nationally if cops had to have some combination of age/experience/education before strapping on a gun and being told to go out and put their lives on the line for $15 an hour.

mad_machine wrote: While I cannot say anything about previous generations.. but I would not want to be just starting out right now. Your choices are a sky high priced education that is no guarantee of getting a job better than flipping burgers.. or flipping burgers. This is truly a terrible time to be looking for a decent living....

you see, i reject this dismissal of the job market.

yes, numbers in almost every field are down and were on a downward trend, but it wasnt an equal down in everything at once.

Trades are in MAJOR demand in all cities. Plumbers, electricians, pest control, etc i've heard more commercials asking for people and even offering to train them on the radio between major markets than i ever have in my life. Mike Rowe confirms it, skilled labor is in dire shortages, both entry and tradesman level.

and even before Obamacare, medical services from top to bottom were undersupplied for 2 decades. Passing Obamacare did nothing to address this, and dropped even MORE demand on the medical industry. Especially secondary care, like home nursing, sports/physical therapy, diagnostic, etc etc.

there are more choices than going in for the most expensive education option or minimum wage. Its just that the shape of the job market has changed, therefore, we must as well

you show me a welder or steam fitter in Baltimore without a job (and without a felony on their record) and I can have them making more then $20 an hour tomorrow.

i bet even the ones with felonies could find shop work instead of remote.

In reply to madmallard:

May be rare, but I very much agree that many fields are quite under served right now. I'm in one of them- where the job market is so good that you can swap major companies every couple of years for a big raise. I sometimes think we need to bring back pensions to entice people to stay.

But where I differ- the idea that we are in an entited society. Or that the people rioting are doing it because they think that they deserve something.

Some of it is, sure. And some are just bad people.

But, there's a whole education problem we have, too- many, many, MANY scholaships are out there for people without means, but the education system we have does not serve them enough that they even quailify to go to school. And that ends up doing a good job feeding a system of poor people. It may appear to be easy to stay at home, do nothing, and live off of that- but when I look at that, it's more surviving than living. To the point that crime is a real alternative.

I don't know how Detroit schools got so screwed up, but they have a pretty high dollar/student ratio, yet have a pretty bad system of delivering students that qualify to go to school.

And ALL of this feeds a part of society that does not see the need for school, and does not encourage their families to go to school.

How that gets fixed, I don't know, but if that thinking can be repaired, schools will fill up, and we will get skilled trades in two years and engineers in 4-5 years. That will fix a bunch.

(a job that I can see for 5 guys- each learn enough to work on homes- lumber, plumber, electrical, etc- buy a cheap home, rennovate, and sell for enough profit to get going. Get another house in same neighborhood- do a little, sell for a little higher- before you know it, the value of the whole neighborhood is up.)

mad_machine wrote: I would not want to be just starting out right now. Your choices are a sky high priced education that is no guarantee of getting a job better than flipping burgers.. or flipping burgers.

There never was and shouldn't be a guarantee for that. Understand the risks you are taking in the future. Simple solution right there that probably wasn't taught to people looking at higher education.

Here's my thoughts on things like this:

No one person (or group) can solve everybody's problems. A problem well stated is a problem half solved. Therefore, the person best-suited to solve a problem is almost always the person with the problem - because they will know the problem better than anyone else.

I do believe our society is making excuses for people at all levels, and some more than others, and oftentimes these statements are made to win public office. If you make more people feel like you will fix their problem for them, you will win the election. "The costs of healthcare are increasing every year." "Cost of living is SO HIGH right now." "Oil companies are increasing the temperature of the earth." "The police/government/schools treat me unfairly." etc. By making these excuses, I do believe that some people start to register that as entitlement - i.e. "I'm poor because the cost of living is so high, not because I make poor decisions financially." When you start to believe that someone else must fix your problems, you tend to stop trying to fix them yourself.

It is no coincidence in my mind that personal responsibility, initiative, and positive attitude are traits of almost all truly successful people. I've worked for companies that hire solely for those three attributes, and then train the rest. They are very successful companies. Maybe we can work on ways to promote those three traits in everybody?

Maybe we can work on ways to promote those three traits in everybody?

I like the way you think... an entire workforce of genetically engineered specimens ideal for the role they were designed for. A brave new world awaits!

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

Maybe we can work on ways to promote those three traits in everybody?

I like the way you think... an entire workforce of genetically engineered specimens ideal for the role they were designed for. A brave new world awaits!

Yeah, but we just have to remember to take all the divergent children, put them in a giant maze, and make them fight to the death every year.

In reply to rcutclif:

There is no rebirth! Carousel is a lie!

In reply to rcutclif:

“A really efficient totalitarian state would be one in which the all-powerful executive of political bosses and their army of managers control a population of slaves who do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude.” -- Mustapha Mond

Appleseed wrote: In reply to rcutclif: There is no rebirth! Carousel is a lie!

Soylent Green is people!!! Oh wait, wrong movie....

something that was brought up today on the news... Some areas of Baltimore never really recovered from the last bout of riots 50 years ago.. guess which areas are being rioted in?

How can you have hope for a future when all around you are the signs that nobody cares?

I am going to say as a society, we failed those people and all the others in similar situations. As on the greater countries in the world, we should not have people living like it's a third world country

In reply to mad_machine:

Detroit says, GFY!

mad_machine wrote: How can you have hope for a future when all around you are the signs that nobody cares? I am going to say as a society, we failed those people and all the others in similar situations. As on the greater countries in the world, we should not have people living like it's a third world country

Disagree.

If someone comes up to me and says "I need help. Please help me/show me/teach me how to be better"

You are damn rights I am on that. It could be as simple as using a computer to how to fix a car.

While I don't like it nearly as much as it shows a person who is prideful without having anything to be proud of, I will also OFFER my help so a person can better THEMSELVES. I don't offer to do the betterment for them.

You can not fix willful ignorance. And you also assume that a lot of these people don't want what they currently have. To want to improve in life is to accept responsibility for not only yourself but your actions. Unfortunately, if this is not TAUGHT to somebody at a young age, well, good luck with that.

I do not help people that do not want my help, because as the saying goes, "you can lead a horse to water...". This is not a poverty thing, its not a intelligence thing, its not a rich thing.

It's like addiction; some people try and make it seem like addiction just suddenly happened to the person, they had no control over it! Well they actually do, its called personal responsibility. And they have chosen to abdicate that responsibility.

HAND UP not HAND OUT.

mad_machine wrote: How can you have hope for a future when all around you are the signs that nobody cares? I am going to say as a society, we failed those people and all the others in similar situations. As on the greater countries in the world, we should not have people living like it's a third world country

How about those people take responsibility for their own environment? Yes, they are living like it is a third world country. Actually, I've been to a lot of third world countries, and they are living worse than most in those. But it is their choice. They choose not to pick up the trash. In Germany, the house wives would go out in the morning and scrub the streets in front of their houses. In Baltimore, the "people" trash up their own houses, which they don't pay for, streets, etc. and then riot at the first opportunity. Third or fourth generation welfare. Anyone think there is a problem there? We ship jobs to China that these people used to do and give them a few dollars to try to get by on.

Yes, it appears that dead man got killed by the cops. One more, a result of a typical cop beating that went too far. LAPD almost killed my brother a few times. San Berdoo may get him yet. But people (COUGH COUGH DEMOCRATS AND GEORGE SOROS backing them, plus the news media) are pushing for race wars, and that's what we are seeing. I thought this was going to happen in '13 but it has just been simmering. We'll see how the rest of the summer plays out.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-29/12-unanswered-questions-about-baltimore-riots-they-don%E2%80%99t-want-us-ask

There's some serious questions: Why did the Democrat black woman mayor tell them to let the looters run wild? "Oh, I didn't mean THAT." Why were the cops told to stand down?

And what the hell is with these "body cameras on all cops" thing? Where did that come from? Did some body camera company piece off Hillary and the rest of our government?

Anyway, MM, where we failed them is by giving them something for nothing. There's never enough.

As I have stated before.. two things in this country should be free (as in paid for by taxes and doled out evenly to everyone) education and healthcare.

If you are healthy and educated, you can do anything..

Places like Baltimore (and Detroit, Camden NJ) have a rather dismal education system. It's not their fault, it is just how the system is set up in this country that the taxes paid into education stay in your area. If they were distributed evenly, then everyone would get the same chance.

And for those that like to scream "entitlements" would you classify me as a taker? I grew up with a disabled father who could not work, so we lived off of a meager government cheque (when they were not withholding it to check to see if my Father's hips had regrown or not) and I went to school for free because the VA paid for my education.. so for over half my life, the government did it's best (or worst) to pay for my upbringing.

It is only been the past 20 years that I have been a productive member of society.. and certainly the past 10 that I made enough of a wage to do more than keep myself afloat.