Hardwood Flooring: Purchase and Install

So SWMBO and I bought a house and we're going to be installing hardwood flooring on the first floor and master bedroom. We're still looking around at floor brands/colors/styles etc...but I'm curious if anyone on here has suggestions or experience with this.

We are going to be doing the installation ourselves, and know that we need to buy some tools for that...any suggestions?

There's a Home Depot and Lowes up the road from us which is convenient, and some other reputable flooring stores that sell for wholesale prices. We're in the Cleveland, OH area and are open to references for floor suppliers of anyone has any!

Thanks!

Laminate. Not hardwood. Much less maintenance and cost, same look.

Make sure that the floor is completely flat.

Read the online instructions.

Only tools I needed for the actual install were a tape measure, square, rubber hammer, and a miter saw with a 60 tooth blade.

Finishing the installation required an air powered brad gun and quarter round.

I've had really good luck with 5/16" hardwood. I bought a Binford narrow crown pneumatic floor stapler on ebay and have installed a lot of it. Light as laminate, looks and feels like real hardwood (because it is), prefinished at the factory with many more layers of polyurethane than finish-in-place so it's crazy hard.

The thin floor is easy to trim around and doesn't require messing with door heights.

edit: I've done laminate as well, I don't care for the look, sound or feel of it.

As someone with chemical sensitivities (but works in a biochem lab anyways...), I'd be somewhat leery of laminate. I did, however, help a friend install his Costco stuff!

What's the state of your subfloor? If you had carpet, get a floor scraper. It's a big heavy spade on a broom handle and it shears right through those damn staples. It's worth the $20.

Get the right saw for your job. Nothing is worse than splitting that last end piece.

Remember to measure your air vents and test fit them before securing the floor. Yeah... we didn't.

Have fun!

procker wrote: We're in the Cleveland, OH area and are open to references for floor suppliers of anyone has any!

I have sent a message to Patgizz on your behalf. He is in the wood floor biz, in CLE.
Also an installer if you choose to go that route.

Laminate looks like hardwood floor if you don't know what you're looking at, but after looking at a few of them it becomes obvious that it's not.

Personally I wouldn't DIY it, the actual laying isn't all that hard, but sanding, sealing, and varnishing -- ugh.

This board always has helpful advice and suggestions! Thanks a ton!

To specify and answer some things:

• We've decided to go with prefinished hardwood flooring that is 3/4".
• Looked at laminate and engineered hardwood but it's not scratching our itch.
• Tile in one room, carpeted in the rest with a plywood subfloor.
• Will be purchasing a pneumatic floor nailer for install, not renting d/t length of install.
• Other tools needed I will have available form family/friend/purchase.

*Does anyone have reviews or recommendations for where to purchase or brands to use/avoid?

*Any tips/advice for the DIY/self-install process?

*Reccomendations for insulation/underpads?

Thanks JohnRW1621 for reaching out to Patgizz on my behalf! I think my brother Carkid1989 knows him to...

I've never seen insulation or an under-pad under real hardwood. It's nailed directly to the sub-floor. Laminate needs that because it floats and the soft barrier reduces noise. I have seen construction paper put down before the floor. Getting the floor as smooth and even as possible is important, but if it's an old house, that may not be realistic. It'll still work. Smooth is more important (no rogue staples or nails).

My ex's father and brother installed hardwood in her house. Her father is retired, so he did the install over multiple days including finishing. Plan on at least a week. I'm not sure what the "norm" for installing the last pieces near the wall is, but he used narrow head, square drive finishing screws with plugs glued on before finishing. It was a bit of a pain when I had to remove some of them later (long story).

If you're planning to do a lot of conjoining areas, it may be worth paying someone to do the sanding and finishing all at once. It's very easy to F-up the sanding process with a drum sander. Sort of like hanging drywall and paying someone to do the taping and spackle. Putting down the floor isn't too hard, but finishing takes some skill/practice. The areas my ex' paid to have finished looks much better than those her father finished, and he was not exactly a beginner (although not a pro).

OP keeps saying pre-finished therefore there is no sanding.

I've put in 5 rooms worth of wood floors in 3 different houses. I used the air stapler from Home Depot tool rental the first time then used the HF version for the next 3. The last one I did was a click-lock bamboo floor and it was the fastest and easiest to install. I put red rosin paper down under thd floors but I don't think it is really needed. Make sure to fix any squeaks in the subfloor before the new stuff goes down.

Besides a miter saw, I found one of those oscillating saws is perfect for cutting any trim at the bottom of doors.

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/off-topic-discussion/teach-me-hardwood-floors/97851/page1/

If you go real wood, try to find something with the Forestry Stewardship Council label. And please avoid Lumber Liquidators for their anti-environment practices.

http://www.sierraclub.org/lay-of-the-land/2015/04/lumber-liquidators-may-face-criminal-charges-over-illegal-wood-products

The advantage of the 3/4" flooring is that it can be sanded and refinished several times. But with prefinished flooring that shouldn't be very necessary. I did a 400 sq ft room at my mother's house 10 years ago and she has big dogs. After a decade of abuse it still looks fantastic.

Like I said before the 5/16" flooring is the same wood, just thinner. Otherwise it feels and looks the same as the 3/4". Easier to install and uses less natural resources. It's not engineered wood (i.e. Plywood with a veneer glued on top) it's regular hardwood, more efficient.

Did 1100 sf in our house a while back. 3/4" hickory - prefinished, used a bostitch floor nailer - old one with a short handle. That's brutal on the back. For underlayment the cheap route is 15# roofing felt or heavy construction paper or rosin paper. Went through lumber liquidators before hearing about some of their practices (there's lots of warnings about their engineered products sourced in China and having formaldahyde). Since it was solid hardwood - I didn't sweat it much. For under door jambs I got a little flex saw at HF. Nice tight fit under door jambs - a little thinner blade than the oscillating saws - and also more work and if you go that route - there will be blood. Those little saws are neat, but the blade is so thin, the back side will also cut you. Hopefully your walls are pretty square. Ours flowed through multiple rooms, closets and into a stairway. The toughest part was working through the starting point (stair nose piece). home depot also sells the splines so you can reverse tongue direction as needed. Svrex has also done a few hardwood floor installs IIRC. I'm very happy with the floor and the install - would do it again, but I'd probably go more hardcore and start unfinished to have a smooth floor without the grooves of the prefinished stuff.

Dusterbd13 wrote: Laminate. Not hardwood. Much less maintenance and cost, same look. Make sure that the floor is completely flat. Read the online instructions. Only tools I needed for the actual install were a tape measure, square, rubber hammer, and a miter saw with a 60 tooth blade. Finishing the installation required an air powered brad gun and quarter round.

not the same look, feel, and laminate berkeleying blows.

look online, the "we bought 6 bazillion crates of this stuff" prices at home depot and lowes are sometimes better than i can get wholesale. see what bruce/armstrong stuff they have a crapload of, and look around at the same product at different stores. the lowes in strongsville had the floor i wanted for 2.09 a square foot but the lowes in wadsworth had it for 1.58.

the harbor freight nailer will do you well, but use cleats and not staples.

get one of the multifunction power tools with a wood blade to undercut your jambs. heck you can have my old HF one since i got a ridgid one last year. honestly i don't think i have any hardwood jobs coming up for quite some time so you are welcome to borrow my nailer with the caveat that if i say i need it back, then i need it back. kevin has my # if you need it.

Don't forget to leave a gap all the way around the room. Then you'll need to cut and install quarter-round around the room to cover it. Depending on what was there before, you may also have to cut some off the bottom of the doors.

In reply to patgizz: Thanks so much!

What brands at Home Depot and Lowes do you recommend? Pneumatic v manual floor nailer? Ryobi has a multi tool...any input on that? We're looking at around 1300sqft total between three rooms and a foyer. Any concerns for fatigue with manual nailers over the pneumatic ones?

We like the prefinished hardwood floors for their durability and wear resistance...we do have 2 cats and the floor will cover the whole first floor including the kitchen.

We want it to be as quiet as possible downstairs...will 15# felt paper do the job or is there better/newer products out there?

I've read and watched videos where they say 3/4" is THE amount to leave around the walls as a spacer for expansion. This is all "on grade", no moisture problems reported. House wad built in 1994. 3/4" should be OK?

I haven't read the replies, well not all of them. I bought Brazilian Cherry from Lumber Liquidators. It's an exotic wood, but it wasn't much more expensive than oak, and is harder. It's stunningly beautiful though. LL seems to have a good product, the wood was all straight, no warpage or issues. I rented the tools from Home Depot and did it myself, all 1,200 square feet of it.
Laminate looks, and sounds, fake from any view closer than the Hubbell telescope and can't be refinished.

Slight detour from topic for the laminate folks. And hey with 6 dogs no way in hell I'm having real hardwood or carpet in my house. But laminate kinda sucks too. Look at vinyl plank. Looks as good or better in most cases than laminate, more durable, slightly softer under foot, installs the same way (click lock) or easier if you get the glue edge and unlike laminate its impervious to liquids.

3/4 all the way around is a big gap. I did more like 1/4-3/8 (pulled baseboard so it's on top of the floor and trimmed drywall so no quarter round. Folks say season the wood. Let it sit in the house for a couple of weeks before installing

check out cork and bamboo options as well, I'm a big fan of cork. If going hardwood Mohawk makes a great tongue and groove plank system that makes install super easy.

procker wrote: In reply to patgizz: Thanks so much! What brands at Home Depot and Lowes do you recommend? Pneumatic v manual floor nailer? Ryobi has a multi tool...any input on that? We're looking at around 1300sqft total between three rooms and a foyer. Any concerns for fatigue with manual nailers over the pneumatic ones? We like the prefinished hardwood floors for their durability and wear resistance...we do have 2 cats and the floor will cover the whole first floor including the kitchen. We want it to be as quiet as possible downstairs...will 15# felt paper do the job or is there better/newer products out there? I've read and watched videos where they say 3/4" is THE amount to leave around the walls as a spacer for expansion. This is all "on grade", no moisture problems reported. House wad built in 1994. 3/4" should be OK?

3/4 gap is huge. If you can pull off baseboards and not do shoe itll look better in the end. Either nailer is going to make for a sore back and arm. Roofing felt will be fine. I'd suggest anything from Shaw Bruce or Armstrong, they are USA made(same company now i believe) and the chinese stuff I've found to scratch so easily that people end up covering most of it with rugs. Did an armstrong prefinished oak frool for my mom about 12 years ago and it still looks new. Same with any other Bruce flooring I've ever laid. The HF multi tool should be same quarity as ryobi but $13 instead of whatever. I have a 10" Milwaukee miter saw with stand that ill make you a sweet deal on if you need it, you're welcome to come out and i could show you the floors in my house and give you some tips in person, and bring your brother so he can drool on my car.

Definitely pull the baseboard. I saw an install where that wasn't done and my god it looked terrible, but the house owner swore "that's how it's done..." Right. Whatever you say, bud... I say your installer was lazy.

Ian F wrote: Definitely pull the baseboard. I saw an install where that wasn't done and my god it looked terrible, but the house owner swore "that's how it's done..." Right. Whatever you say, bud... I say your installer was lazy.

depends on many things, like if we're stopping mid wall and the baseboard already has carpet kicked to it and can't be lifted. that's really the only time i do shoe, unless the people have painted/caulked on baseboard and don't want to do any paint touch ups afterward.

In reply to patgizz:

I'll give you that, but in this case it was in a basement rec room and the entire floor was done. Having to repaint or even replace the baseboard is no excuse. Do it right or don't bother. There was a minimum 1/4" gap around the entire perimeter. He didn't even cut under the closet door frames. It looked like ass.