I wasn't being sarcastic.
I think it's pretty telling that the owner lets the new guy act like the Shop Manager while he "hangs out with the old guys", but I will admit I am reading between the lines. There is certainly room for different interpretations and opInions.
So, we have different opinions. I'm OK with that.
Suprf1y said:SVreX said:Please note:
I have discounted no one's perspective.
Based on your comments on the last page I respectfully disagree.
Nonetheless, inasmuch as D5 is right , your statements about child rearing, business ownership and the follow up bring little to the discussion
Again, I did not disagree. I just offered a different viewpoint.
I didn't say you did.
I didn't discount other opinions, because I actually agree with them. Why would I discount opinions I agreed with?
I just don't think in this case the changes are gonna happen,and I offered the opposing perspective (which I don't actually agree with).
Sorry if it offends you.
My opinion: Business should make the changes necessary to get things right.
My observation: Few businesses like this do.
My second observation: THIS owner has all the characteristics of businesses I have witnessed which never make the necessary changes, particularly the emotional ones. Employees are pals, owner is afraid to make the necessary changes, lets the business run him instead of running the business.
OP is asking what the owner can do to keep new guy. Answer: he can't. If I was counseling new guy, I'd say time to look for a job.
But since this thread is advice for the owner not new guy, my suggestion is that he probably doesn't have anything he can do, because he is too emotionally vested in the business as it is. Offering new guy a bonus is just grasping at straws.
AND, I hope I am wrong. I really like being wrong on stuff like this.
Now you have my opinion. Pretty much in line with the rest of the thread.
SVreX said:I wasn't being sarcastic.
Keeping that in mind, I would greatly appreciate your explaining how these commonly used style of sarcastic statements relate to your sincerely held opinions, so that I can better understand the context with which you stated them.
SVreX said:
People who have never owned a business always have great advice for how to run a business.
It's like listening to people without kids telling people how to parent.
Or listening to people comment on race car drivers that have never been paid, professional race car drivers.
Or people who have never played the NFL commenting on what to do.
I don't have to be a helicopter pilot to know if I see one in a tree, the pilot screwed up.
In reply to Driven5 :
Those are the comments I was also referring to.
SVreX said:
Please note:
I have discounted no one's perspective
Really?
Zombie and SvRex, you both need to go eat a snickers and drop it. This is the dumbest argument I've seen.
In reply to SVreX :
My second observation: THIS owner has all the characteristics of businesses I have witnessed which never make the necessary changes, particularly the emotional ones. Employees are pals, owner is afraid to make the necessary changes, lets the business run him instead of running the business.
OP is asking what the owner can do to keep new guy. Answer: he can't. If I was counseling new guy, I'd say time to look for a job.
But since this thread is advice for the owner not new guy, my suggestion is that he probably doesn't have anything he can do, because he is too emotionally vested in the business as it is. Offering new guy a bonus is just grasping at straws.
I admit to being a bit coy about my position in this, but think of it as if I were doing a business case study or come in for business consultation.
Some more details. New guy was hired after a 7 year stint of not having full time work. Declared during the hire. Took this job because eating and mortgage were priorities. Actually likes the job.
The owner(s) ( actually two brothers and a wife run the operation) had no idea what they were getting when new guy was hired. Showing up everyday on time would have been good enough. The position had been staffed by a succession of friends of friends kids who needed a job and stayed long enough to get bored or buy a bag of weed. Heavy lifting and semi-accurate measuring involved. Like I said, just over minimum wage and only because owner believe you have to survive on a wage. Not everyone's dream job but a job.
Like so many mom and pop/family operations, the business just scrapes by with variable cashflow. Machine operators make more than anyone else in the place ( including owners) due to overtime. Nobody wants to talk about a huge pay increase and promotion to make new guy the shop manager; I mean, who are they going to get to do his job!
My thoughts are that if new guy can survive a year he will become responsible for running the shop much more efficiently than it is now. The tipping point will be if and when there are staffing changes that are attributable to him. The owner needs to enable this somehow if he wants this guy to become shop manager. After that it will come down to whether cash flow improves due to new workflows. Then it is a new game.
Pete
In reply to NOHOME :
How many machinists/operators/employees, and how much consistent overtime?
mtn said:Zombie and SvRex, you both need to go eat a snickers and drop it. This is the dumbest argument I've seen.
Like most internet arguments.
In reply to mtn :
Sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees
Oh, boy, a pissing contest!
Suprf1y said:In reply to mtn :
Sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees
My response to this is to relay the fortune in my fortune cookie that I just ate:
"May the warm winds of heaven blow softly upon your sprint"
Ironically, that typo may actually be appropriate for you.
Appleseed said:Oh, boy, a pissing contest!
I’m reading this while using a urinal.
Wanna play swords?
In reply to Driven5 :
Though I was being genuine, I understand how those statements could be interpreted as sarcastic.
I apologize.
Booo. I was hoping for more condescension regarding "If you haven't X you can't possibly know anything about X" conversation.
I'm not a contractor, but I know if you do crummy work. ;)
Just my random thought: Do you have good info on new guy’s past? It does not quite add up to me. Every time I had employees that sort of fit his description they either stole from me outright or showed up randomly at my father’s funeral years after borrowing money and then skipping town, only to give an extremely moving and impassioned speech when the microphone was passed around.
Or something like that. Sorry, that got away from me. :) Jcamper
mtn said:Suprf1y said:In reply to mtn :
Sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees
My response to this is to relay the fortune in my fortune cookie that I just ate:
"May the warm winds of heaven blow softly upon your sprint"
Ironically, that typo may actually be appropriate for you.
Come on people, we are better than this; everyone knows the words “in bed” should be added to the end of all fortunes out of cookies.
As the owner and the Boss at a small company All I can say is do your job. Sometimes being the Boss sucks.
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