I've been a car salesman for two weeks now...

First off, I can now tell if someone's going to buy a car within the first ten seconds of talking to them. If the first question is any variation of "What's you're bottom line price", "What sort of incentives are available on x", or "I could buy this car cash today", you will not buy a car. People who are actually buying a car will have researched the incentives and will know what a good price is. People who actually pay cash never bring it up till the end of the sale. And no, the offer of "cash" doesn't get you a better deal, we had always intended to sell the vehicle for "money".

Second, most people are frustratingly bad at negotiating but think they're awesome. You can't buy a $35,000 car with $0 down for $300/month no matter how set on that price you are. When I ask what sort of payment you're looking for it's not cause I'm trying to rip you off, I just want to sell you a vehicle you can afford. It never fails, the person who won't give me any info but wants to look at a $53k tahoe is horrified when I come back with a $1k+ monthly payment. If you would have told me what you wanted to spend up front instead of trying to be sneaky, we wouldn't have wasted all this time.

Third, most car shoppers make the process MUCH harder than it needs to be. They lie about the payoff on their trade, they lie about their income on the credit app, they lie about pretty much everything. Giving false information doesn't change the "deal" at all, it just means we'll find out right at the end that we can't get you financed. Also, those of you that think you're getting a better deal by not telling me you have a trade till the deal is finalized are sorely mistaken. Now that I know you're buying the car I'm going to hold all I can on your trade value, usually to the point that I'll blow the deal over it just cause it pisses me off so much (especially if we stayed open late working with you and the used car manager who would have appraised your car went home because you didn't have a trade). Also, if it ends up that you're way upside down in that trade you didn't have earlier it does weird stuff to the loan and makes it much harder to sell to a bank, especially if we were shopping it to a bank that doesn't do that sort of thing.

Fourth, the new chevy line is much better than it used to be, but still sucks from an enthusiast prospective. The new camaro drives like a tank, and everything else might as well be made of jello.

Switch to used sales, more profit for you

Now that I know you're buying the car I'm going to hold all I can on your trade value, usually to the point that I'll blow the deal over it just cause it pisses me off so much

I'm not a sales expert like you, but I'm pretty sure this is not a strategy for success.

I bet you taught them a lesson though, and was probably worth all the money you lost on the sale.

I thought I about trying out car sales, but it wouldn't work out if I was only interested in the the car part, not the sales part.

I was at Your Bar-B-Que for 11 years--all at the same Ford store. Was even #3 FMCC lease rep in Chicago Zone. Miss the cars, not the 'business'.

Zomby woof wrote:

Now that I know you're buying the car I'm going to hold all I can on your trade value, usually to the point that I'll blow the deal over it just cause it pisses me off so much

I'm not a sales expert like you, but I'm pretty sure this is not a strategy for success. I bet you taught them a lesson though, and was probably worth all the money you lost on the sale.

if I'm not mistaken that's usually called cutting off you nose to spite your face.... in other words .... not much of a career enhancer

Yep, it cost me a hundred bucks to wipe that smug "oh by the way I'm trading my car in" look off his face. I was already to my minimum and he had been jerking me around for hours, I didn't really care about making it work at that point. However, I would have made about $4k on that trade deal if he had gone for it.

I went through the new car buying process recently. Of course, I first visited the dealership to get a feel for the vehicles, and I asked dumb questions like "what incentives are on x?" because I've found that there's usually lots of information that's not easily found online. But since the salesman didn't give up on me in disgust, I came back later and asked for him. From the sounds of things, I'm not sure I would have done that if it had been skruffy and his two-week attitude.

I didn't lie about anything, but the dealership did offer me a ridiculously low amount on my Toyota for a trade-in. I sold the truck privately for $4500 more than they offered. I also caught the salesman in a lie about their "cost" on Line-X, I booked myself in for $35 less than "dealer cost". So in this case, it was the salesman who was telling the little white lies, not the customer. I was up front about the fact that I had a potential trade, but it wasn't critical to the deal and they'd have to make it worthwhile.

Luckily, there wasn't really any negotiation to be done - I hate that idiocy. We had a kick-ass fixed price from Janel's work.

It was kind of fun shopping, though. Every time we came to the dealership, we showed up in a different car. The salesman kept on trying to impresse me with stories about a new Camaro with a Hennessey supercharger they'd taken in trade, and it wasn't until I showed up in a 480 hp LS3 Miata that he figured out why I wasn't that excited...

Skruffy,
Have you read the Edmunds Article?
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/42962/article.html

your words echo those of my brother (a successful car salesman). He's a car lover so he knows what he's selling, and he likes to tell us all the stupid things customers (or tire kickers) like to say, stuff like "I'm glad this 2005 mustang finally went back to rear wheel drive." It's mostly hilarious and he is a nice guy, so i think the kindness and knowlege get him most of his customers. My favorite story of his is when a long time customer was comming in to trade in his car, he called ahead and everything and my brother had a car that this customer liked all ready for a test drive and all of that stuff, ready to make a deal that day, and the customer got hit by a city bus on the way in. It was a low speed accident and the customer was uninjured, but the car was obviously toast. So thinking quickly to make a joke to lighten the mood, my brother said "I got something i can sell you without a trade in" and proceeded to show him the dealerships golf cart (thoroughly destroyed, i might add) as a joke, but the guy thought he was honest! He later even called back about the golf cart! My brother did end up selling him something eventually, but it was a real car, and a safe one (in case of bus attack).

Keith wrote: I went through the new car buying process recently. Of course, I first visited the dealership to get a feel for the vehicles, and I asked dumb questions like "what incentives are on x?" because I've found that there's usually lots of information that's not easily found online.

I did the same thing.

I got a pretty good supplier discount, but wanted to see the deal without the discount, to see if I could do any better. I couldn't, but the salesman saved me $1000 with an incentive that I didn't know about.

Being in the sales game meself, over the years I have run across people who I gladly made ~zero~ off of because I got tired of listening to their crap, which usually comes from one of those books you can buy on how to drive the best bargain home. So I can identify with skruffy.

Sometimes the money just ain't worth it. I had this clown (a private sale on some Spitfire stuff I had for sale) who ran me around in circles, trying to beat me down to ridiculous levels, taking way too long to make a decision, running inside to borrow my phone every 5 minutes, all kinds of stuff. I finally told him to get out of my face. He started sputtering and blathering, telling me I was losing money etc and I told him straight up I did not give a rat's ass, I was tired of his crap, it was time for him to leave. I told him not to ever bother calling me because I'd scrap the stuff for nothing before I sold it to him. Damn, but that was soul satisfying.

Sold the bits n' pieces to someone else a week later, too.

Keith wrote: Luckily, there wasn't really any negotiation to be done - I hate that idiocy. We had a kick-ass fixed price from Janel's work.

I'm with Keith on this one. I negotiate via email now. No sitting in the dealership for hours for me.

The last two cars I've purchased (Mazdaspeed3, Forester) were all email negotiations. I'd start by contacting all dealerships selling the car in a 75 mile radius. The ones who got back to me with a price are the ones I then communicate with.

I'm much happier with this than with talking to a salesman for hours on end. No offense to salesmen, I just like knowing the price, paying it, and leaving. I don't care to spend hours with someone I won't ever talk to again. Also, those deals felt incredibly inefficient and full of sales pressure. The pressure soured the whole experience for me. With my new method I'm at the dealership for an hour and then I have my new car. Everyone has time to think about the deal and consider before hand.

I like my new process.

Jensenman wrote: I finally told him to get out of my face. He started sputtering and blathering, telling me I was losing money etc and I told him straight up I did not give a rat's ass, I was tired of his crap, it was time for him to leave. I told him not to ever bother calling me because I'd scrap the stuff for nothing before I sold it to him. Damn, but that was soul satisfying.

I should've done this years ago on a used car sale I had. I'll leave the story out of it but I'd wished I'd walked away from that really early. In the future I'll trust my instincts more about sales. This is good advice. When to know it's just not worth proceeding.

Now that I've had a beer and settled down, I realized my first post is a bit negative. I had a slew of crappy customers today and it put me in a bad mood. I actually like selling cars quite a bit. It allows me to talk about cars all day, without "trapping" people in horrible technical conversations.

I'd rather sell cars over the internet as well. I love a deal where everything is done over the phone, and all I have to do is final paperwork and delivery. The hours of negotiation parts sucks at the other end of the table too.

I've thought for a long time that new car sales should be an exclusively over the internet affair. Go to manufacturer.com, build your car, work out financing or whatever, and the car gets delivered to your house in a few weeks. At that time your used car trade get's appraised and you either decide to take the crappy trade price or try your luck on craigslist. Done. New car dealers become used car dealers, warranty service and delivery centers.

Also, the new Corvette Grand Sport looks awesome in inferno orange, and is a pretty sweet car to drive. I can't wait to drive one that's properly broken in, All the ones we have only have delivery miles, and I don't want to really run them hard. One of the other dealers under the same ownership has a ZR1 in stock. While I'll never get to drive it, it's cool that I got to see one in person at least.

Easy answer to the whole car biz is don't be a dick and be honest. If something doesn't feel right, you are more then welcome to walk away.

Out of the 6 vehicles I have bought from various dealers, I have been in and out in at the most 2hrs. That included a previous day visit and test drive. I already knew what I wanted, could afford, and wanted to pay. Sure, I want as close to invoice pricing as possible, but dealers have to keep the lights on too. Most people forget that and think they are getting screwed if they get told "No.".

This very subject came up here recently. Car purchasing link

Brian

Man, that's odd. We were in the market for a minivan last spring to replace the late lamented Subaru we lost in the crash in February. I hit several alternative dealers with "what's your best price?" first thing and bought the best alternative. Had a couple call back later with better offers over their "best price" but it was too late, we'd already bought a car.

skruffy wrote: The new camaro drives like a tank, and everything else might as well be made of jello.

Driving a tank though a lot full of Jello sounds like fun.

I bought a new, high-end import for Mrs. BDT a couple years ago. The salesman was a 20+ year veteran with multiple Salesman of the Year honors.

He was a very amicable guy but he lied, and lied and then lied some more. When I finally had enough and confronted him with one of these lies, he just smiled and lied again.

He actually got belligerent and insulted when I counter-offered his "absolute best, lowest I can go, we're only making $300 on this" price. I ultimately bought the car for about a grand below that number. Then he turned me over to the F&I guy who, guess what, lied his fanny off.

Throughout the process I held my temper and my nose - only dealer in town and I'm loyal to the brand.

I make a good living in sales, but if I had to do his job I'd starve, or more likely be fired in 10 days.

To the OP - forgive me but I'm suspicious of anyone who has it all figured out after two weeks on the job - any job. Good luck with your career.

This thread reinforces my stance to never buy a new car.

I wasn't trying to claim I have it all figured out, but when I see something ten times a day it's hard not to spot the trend.

I have walked out of dealerships when the BS starts getting too high, and almost went across a guys desk once to get my keys back, but mostly I have done my research and been honest and up-front and have left with a positive experience.

The only thing I can't stand is the "let me speak to my manager" crap. Really? You have to walk back to some hidden office ten times? Why not just get the guy out here so we can talk face-to-face and get this over with? I realize it is the way many dealerships are set up, but I won't do it. If you have a say in my financial situation, get out here and talk to me.

I do give salespeople a lot of credit for keeping a straight face when they see my credit report. :)

pinchvalve wrote: The only thing I can't stand is the "let me speak to my manager" crap.

Ahhh-greeed!

We just bought a car for the missus. After looking around she was either going with a Subie Outback or a Jetta Sportwagen. The Subie salesguy was your stereotypical salesguy, complete with phrases like, "What will it take to get you into this car right now?" --and-- "I want you to meet my manager".

On "what will it take..." -- he didn't like my honest answer that it'd take a $14k price on a $29k car -- and this was AFTER I had told him earlier that we were just in the area and wanted to look at the car up close, see what incentives were available, etc. We hadn't even driven the car. He then asked what it would really take and then I said $12k...........I then asked him if he wanted to continue this game.

Next -- why do I have to meet your manager? Aren't you the face of the dealership for me -- aren't you the guy in charge, the one with the power??

OTOH, the experience at the VW dealership was a complete opposite of the trip to Subieland. I was on the lot and in the showroom for an hour plus, and get this, no one pestered me!!! We looked around, grabbed some brochures, and left. Came back the following day and were looking unperturbed for about 20 mins when hipster VW sales guy comes along and asks us if we have any questions. The sales process was totally low pressure and they did bend over backwards to find us the car we wanted. The first one the did a dealer trade for was scratched up the entire passenger side. Sales guy wouldn't sell it to me unless I really wanted it -- and they actually found one that was coming in to port the following week that we eventually ended up buying.

For the record, I have access to GM discount buying -- the last GM we bought was 10 years ago. The 2011 VWs are nice -- I see a GTI or a Golf TDI in my immediate future....because the car is nice but because I like the dealership.

That's how it should work............

ddavidv wrote: This thread reinforces my stance to never buy a new car.

+1, with a side of "No dealers for used cars either."

I have sworn off new cars for other reasons like cost, depreciation and lack of anything that interests me being available. Never having to deal with the dealership itself is just a cherry on top.

All my car search filters are private sale only. Dealerships might need to eat too but not on my dime.

In reply to skruffy:

I don't like when a salesman asks me what payment I can afford, because I'm not buying a monthly payment, I'm buying a vehicle and I do that based on the price, not the payment. Oh, and you forgot one important key to sales - The customer is always right.