Koreas

mike53 wrote: (There is some in the SK army that thinks its their destiny to reunite (invade) the north.

That is a VERY small minority, if worth noting. Its nothing like say, the relative size of even the Québécois.

MCarp22 wrote:

thank you for the new backround

Thank you stealthtercel!

Having spent quite a few years there and even brought home a souvineer - my wife of 29 years. Something will happen eventually, hopefully later than sooner and only small just testing our seriousness and then back down. And yes we will be involved. Simply because we still have troops there and you wouldn't believe the western money invested in South Korea, a large portion American. We will have to protect our businesses and their interests/investments. The north may think this is an opportune time with us heavily into the other side of the world but our troops there are hardened and experienced.

Lesley: have fun and try to visit east gate market in Seoul for some good deals in trinkets. Any taxi driver can take you there.

EricM wrote:

oldsaw wrote:

alfadriver wrote: I don't think there will be much time to NOT get involved. Both have weapons that will destroy each other pretty quickly.

One suspects there are also more than a few US subs off the the NoKo's coastline. With dozens of cruise missiles, torpedos and ordinance programmed to inflict the most amount of damage to military assets as possible, any conflict could be very short-lived - with tremendous casualties on both sides.

Actually that is exactly what we said when we invaded Iraq.... in 1993 How short lived was that? What? yes it is still going on today.....

Not certain as to your point. US troops were in Korea forty years before Iraq forayed into Kuwait.

China is pulling the strings in Asia but it has as at least as much to lose (investment-wise) as the US if things escalate to a "shooting" level. If/when China decides it can sustain the economic losses better than the US (or the rest of the world), their last concern is the welfare of people living south of the Yalu River.

oldsaw wrote: China is pulling the strings in Asia but it has as at least as much to lose (investment-wise) as the US if things escalate to a "shooting" level. If/when China decides it can sustain the economic losses better than the US (or the rest of the world), their last concern is the welfare of people living south of the Yalu River.

Col. Tom, like the young`uns say..."Word up."

I hate to admit it (because there's human suffering in NK), but I'm actually more comfortable (stragegically, I mean) with the current situation in N.Korea, simply because things seem to be so bad that as long as the Chinese keep sending them food, NoKo will lie on the floor and wave their backside in the air like a Muslim at prayer.

For once, I'm glad my dad didn't live this long. He would have been seriously pissed off that his service over there (50-53) just postponed a real solution to the problem. I think he would have enjoyed seeing China get less "communist", but would be impatient about how long it's taking China to "reel in" NK.

OTOH, I wish my ol' man had lived long enough to see the memorial in DC..

http://www.nps.gov/kowa/index.htm

EricM wrote: Actually that is exactly what we said when we invaded Iraq.... in 1993 How short lived was that? What? yes it is still going on today.....

Umm, I didn't notice this at first but you have your dates wrong. The first trip into Iraq was 1991 and we did leave. In 1991. I was on that trip. The current trip did start about 2003 and we are downsizing there now. 10 years not 20.

In reply to friedgreencorrado: Sgt. Dad did get to see photos of that, taken by his grandaughter. Both were moved to tears.

I had a political science class on World Politics at TAMU about 1992. The professor was from S.K. It should have been titled "World Politics as it Affects The Korean Peninsula." Someone would ask a question like "What about South Africa?" The reply was "That doesn't affect Korea, why would we care about that?" Anyway, the professor, Dr. Kim (whatever) PhD would occasionally to go China for some Korean summit. He would see North Korean people there for the summit, and at the meals, they would only eat a small bowl of rice. They were very thin. He asked them why they didn't eat more, as it was basically a Chinese Buffet, all you can eat, pig out. They said that if they ate too much, when they got home to North Korea, their stomachs would be too big and the hunger pains would be unbearable. Remember that these were North Korean diplomats, at the top of the food chain in N.K.

Walt would know what to do....

BTW - if you haven't seen the movie, it is a pretty good watch..

Tell the North Koreans to get off his lawn?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TuRbk-00Sw

Smokie: Are you f#$ng crazy? Go back in the house. Walt Kowalski: Yeah? I blow a hole in your face and then I go in the house... and I sleep like a baby. You can count on that. We used to stack f*#s like you five feet high in Korea... use ya for sandbags.

Of course, at his heart, he's a Grassroots kind of guy:

Walt Kowalski: Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone.

I was thinking about this yesterday... Let's assume the Norks have a handful of Scud-ly missiles fueled and ready for launch. One of them launches and detonates a small nuke over Seoul or an American base. If you're the Obaminator, it seems to me like you've only got one choice and that's to turn the whole northern part of the peninsula to glass (regardless of fallout, both radioactive and political). You've got to assume that one of the other missiles has a nuke on it and that it's going to be used on some other important target, don't you? Can you possibly take the chance of the Norks NOT having a second bomb and just sit on your hands waiting for Hillary to convene the UN so she can scold Kim?

I'm packing my riot gear.

RossD wrote: Anyone watch the National Geographic's Explorer about North Korea? That show is pretty crazy!

Yeah, I have. Is that the one where the North Korean citizens were told blue jeans and Coca Cola were North Korean inventions?

stroker wrote: I was thinking about this yesterday... Let's assume the Norks have a handful of Scud-ly missiles fueled and ready for launch. One of them launches and detonates a small nuke over Seoul or an American base. If you're the Obaminator, it seems to me like you've only got one choice and that's to turn the whole northern part of the peninsula to glass (regardless of fallout, both radioactive and political). You've got to assume that one of the other missiles has a nuke on it and that it's going to be used on some other important target, don't you? Can you possibly take the chance of the Norks NOT having a second bomb and just sit on your hands waiting for Hillary to convene the UN so she can scold Kim?

No, not really. Especially considering the range of some of NK's missiles. You think there's a lot of US money in Seoul? Let's consider Tokyo.

4eyes wrote: In reply to friedgreencorrado: Sgt. Dad did get to see photos of that, taken by his grandaughter. Both were moved to tears.

Got to admit, my eyes weren't exactly dry, either.

In reply to madmallard:

Nothing of value to add, just wanted to say that anyone using an avatar from Suikoden rocks!

In reply to friedgreencorrado:

Sgt Joe ftw.

madmallard wrote: In reply to friedgreencorrado: Sgt Joe ftw.

Yup. I think I need to actually restart S3. I hate to admit it, but I never finished it. I didn't get to play S1, but I did get the best endings on S2 and S4 and 5. (I grew up on the NC Outer Banks, and must be one of the only four people who actually enjoyed S4.. )

I actually started 3 after I saw a used copy in Gamestop for about $3 (and long after I'd played 2, 4 & 5). I didn't read any walkthroughs or anything beforehand, just started playing. I picked Hugo first, and ended up somehow having Thomas building the Stronghold during that story arc. I guess I gave up after realizing I couldn't find out how to get Chris to join the SoD. Most of the walkthroughs I've looked at afterwards tell me to actually start with Chris...

But none of my Suikofailures means that Sgt. Joe rocks any less...

Didn't mean to kill the thread, folks..back on topic.

BBC correspondant Sue Lloyd-Roberts (no relation) after her latest trip to NK:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/8711355.stm

Rare view of NK's internal propaganda (art show in Austria) upsets people not intelligent enough to understand an intelligent person's curiosity about it..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/10134478.stm

Hey guys... totally exhausted but made it back in one piece. The company's main objective seemed to be to show us how affluent and capable S. Korea is of being a global power economically. It's very clean and very wealthy. They are incredibly gracious and polite. The very last day a small group of us went to the DMZ (demilitarized zone). It was an experience I won't ever forget -- we saw the Freedom Bridge, entered the UN Building that straddles the border (accompanied by armed guards), saw the small monument placed on the site of the 1976 axe murders.
It was a bit overwhelming... on a positive note... the 4 km. wide border is uninhabited and has become an animal sanctuary of interest to biologists the world over.

Lesley wrote: Hey guys... totally exhausted but made it back in one piece. The company's main objective seemed to be to show us how affluent and capable S. Korea is of being a global power economically. It's very clean and very wealthy. They are incredibly gracious and polite. The very last day a small group of us went to the DMZ (demilitarized zone). It was an experience I won't ever forget -- we saw the Freedom Bridge, entered the UN Building that straddles the border (accompanied by armed guards), saw the small monument placed on the site of the 1976 axe murders. It was a bit overwhelming... on a positive note... the 4 km. wide border is uninhabited and has become an animal sanctuary of interest to biologists the world over.

Glad to hear it, Lesley! My skeptical nature leads me to wonder, though..

Considering the frequent "ups and downs" of the relationship between the two Koreas, do you think there's some sort of disguised appeal for "protection" when they mention their economic power? (Do I sound like one of those "consipiracy theorist" idiots when I ask that? ) Just curious what you think about it, since you've actually been there, and I haven't.

Personally, I was under the impression that SK was already one of the bigger players on the economic scene. Where would the import/export buisness be without Hyundai Shipbuilding (IIRC, they invented the container shipping system)? And I don't have any data to back it up, but I've kinda noticed a lot of the "mid-priced" products I see are actually made in SK, rather than China. Most of the Wal-Mart electronics I've bought that that live longer than a year and a half are actually Korean.

ROFL! I still recall being pretty stoked that I could finally afford to buy a Futaba ("premium" Japanese) brand R/C system for my R/C cars a few years back, and being surprised that the thing had been made in Korea, rather than Japan.

Yah, sorry, I meant that Hankook wants to be a big player. Seoul is unbelievably wealthy, I felt like a frumpy backwoods peasant. We were guests of Hankook, who took great pains to illustrate how forward-thinking they were, and how modern. They've established several specialty shops for tire-changing, balancing, brakes... that sort of thing. Very high-end and non "yucky" with wi-fi, espresso, fancy restrooms etc... built on lots worth upwards of $8 million. Land's very expensive. Apartment towers everywhere and very, very few houses in Seoul. The people are extremely well-dressed, there's no litter anywhere and evidently there's a very low crime rate (we went out walking late at night and felt safe). Looks like a movie set, didn't see one single slob, or any fat people whatsoever.

I think the some of the prices on Hankooks (especiallly on race tires!) are proof enough they're trying to catch "our" eye..so we'll recommend their street tires to all our "civillian" friends, of course.. As the kids say, "..same ol', same ol'..". Reminds me of Yokohama's expansion into the enthusiast market in the 1990s.

Be our spy, Leslie..find a way to go do Kuhmo's tour as well...(where's the "evil grin" icon?)

I was also gonna ask if you got to Nandaemun temple (you can see it in the GT4 videogame), but then I recalled that some crazy guy burned it down a few years ago.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7238210.stm