Heh. All y'all complaining about $30 co pays: the last office visit for the Curmudgeonling = $130.00. ADVAIR (asthma inhaler) $202.00 EACH. Times 3 to stock her up for the school year. That's $736.00. Doesn't include the rescue inhalers which are, IIRC, something like $60 apiece.
I regularly see rx fills coming through my "feeds" that cost the member over $1,000 for a one time fill.
Just to put things in perspective.
I feel lucky. I have no copays, everything goes towards deductible, then a $1000 out of pocket. My HRA has enough in it right now to cover ded/oop for the next 3 years at this point. I know this policy is costing my employer, though.
I shouldn't complain about people kvetching, because really, I feel their pain. Obviously someone IS making a buttload of money, because they're getting us coming and going.
Speaking of which, I did get a "free" colonoscopy this year. Woo hoo!
Margie
Marjorie Suddard wrote: Speaking of which, I did get a "free" colonoscopy this year. Woo hoo!
There is nothing free about them bastards.... They take all your diginity you have left and it gets blown up on a 50" TV screen, I swear it was that big, for anyone in there to see. Then the prep.... My water bill musta went up with all the flushing.... 
Ranger50 wrote:Marjorie Suddard wrote: Speaking of which, I did get a "free" colonoscopy this year. Woo hoo!There is nothing free about them bastards.... They take all your diginity you have left and it gets blown up on a 50" TV screen, I swear it was that big, for anyone in there to see. Then the prep.... My water bill musta went up with all the flushing....
You had a colonoscopy at home? That sounds much preferable to how it's normally administered. 
In reply to 92CelicaHalfTrac:
I wish.
Don't confuse general healthcare with prescriptions. They are linked but the money inflation goes separate directions.
My company which was originally located in the northwest and moved to Chicago and has large aerospace ties paid $19,812 for my family of five. I paid $1,597. Most of my co-pay charges are $20 and prescriptions are $5 or $20. Chiropractic co-pays are $30.
I am a proponent of Catastrophic health insurance but that is quite possibly since I am in reasonably good health. I look at it similarly to car insurance. If you hit something they will cover the damages but there is not coverage for oil changes, tire replacement etc.
I've got a few issues that degrade my quality of life but I don't particularly feel like going to a primary care just to be referred to a specialist (dermatologist) to get a prescription for a treatment that only alleviates the symptoms when over the counter medication in my experience does essentially the same thing.
While at GRM I certainly appreciated the health care offerings although I don't believe I ever utilized them.
It really is a chicken-egg argument. The doctors charge more and the insurance companies want reduced rates. To get what the rates they need/want they want the doctors charge even more (partly due to the crazy cost of malpractice insurance which brings in the personal injury attorneys) and it spirals on and on. At the end of the day I see a minority of people wanting something for nothing and the rest of us are paying for it.
This may make me sound like a cold hearted but I really feel no great desire to be forced directly (Universal Healthcare) or indirectly (current healthcare environment) to provide for the general public. I may feel sorry for their circumstances but if I feel like helping I want to reach into my own pocket without someone else already in their.
Johnboyjjb wrote: Don't confuse general healthcare with prescriptions. They are linked but the money inflation goes separate directions. My company which was originally located in the northwest and moved to Chicago and has large aerospace ties paid $19,812 for my family of five. I paid $1,597. Most of my co-pay charges are $20 and prescriptions are $5 or $20. Chiropractic co-pays are $30.
Prescriptions are a huge reason why "other" healthcare is so expensive, though.
Because advertising.
92CelicaHalfTrac wrote: Prescriptions are a huge reason why "other" healthcare is so expensive, though. Because advertising.
Agreed, but not from advertising. It is a two fold problem, R&D and limited patent time frame to sell your wonder drug before everyone else does. They advertise to get people to ask for that drug to pay off all that R&D, which ain't cheap being multiple millions of dollars.
dj06482 wrote:HiTempguy wrote: I'm curious as to who will try and say it's because out healthcare is subpar compared to the US? It's a terrible argument. Pretty sure if you looked at healthcare stats worldwide, Canada would rank higher than the US.Many Canadians come down to the US for tests that they'd be waiting for under Canada's healthcare laws. Mammograms are a good example.
I wonder which number is higher, Canadians going south for healthcare, or Americans coming north for healthcare? In our province, it has a been a problem. People either get fake health cards, or fake citizenship to get the healthcare that they otherwise could not.
ADVAIR is the premier preventive daily asthma inhaler. Glaxo's patent expired in 2011 but the generics do not work as well, so Glaxo continues to fund their Lear fuel bill off of me. 
It's going to stay that way for the foreseeable future, unless there's a big breakthrough by one of the other companies.
Data from the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (origins of the organization are around 1948 to help administer the Marshall Plan) - the organization supports social democracy and free markets. Graphs show how much people pay for healthcare, how widespread is coverage and (in my mind) how effective healthcare is (judged by length of life) - draw your own conclusions about value.
HiTempguy wrote: This is what many people don't understand about "universal" healthcare. It is a limited resource. As such, if you have (issue A) that doesn't need to be rectified instantly, but another person has (issue B) that needs care right now, guess who is getting treated if the issues utilize the same resources? I personally have NEVER had a problem getting access to timely treatment of issues I've had (asthmatic, shoulder surgery due to abnormal bone growth, dental care, etc). Yes, my parents have paid for private MRI's before because they disliked how long of a wait it was at the local hospital. But the private MRI was worth it to them to get it in a quicker fashion, even though it was not "needed".
That's pretty much my experience with several "universal healthcare" systems as well (UK and Germany). You can either make use of the universal healthcare option that you pay taxes or a premium for[1], or you go to the "pay to play" system that gets you quicker access.
With the regular system, it might take a few weeks to get certain tests, but I've seen how quickly they can move if they suspect that there is something serious awry.
In the US in contrast, if you are willing to pay, you can usually someone very quickly and you can pick the best there is, but it'll cost you. Plus you normally don't get your insurance company interfere with the prescription the doctor gave you in other countries (happened to me here in the US). Or having to choose between paying for a necessary operation yourself if you want the best local doctor to do it, or going to the in-network doctor who doesn't have the same reputation because the insurance won't necessarily even contribute to the out-of-network doctor.
I'm in the fortunate situation that both my wife and I are pretty healthy and I make halfway decent money, so between the company sponsored HDHP and the amount of money I can afford to park in an HSA, we're in a good position to get the health care we both want and need, but I very much understand that these days, we're a bit of a minority.
[1] In Germany you pay a premium to an insurance company, but they're heavily regulated and there is a universal health insurance mandate, in the UK, you pay for it via the National Insurance contribution which is a tax taken out of your paycheck. In either place, your contributions are based on your income (with a cap).
Zomby Woof wrote: I wonder which number is higher, Canadians going south for healthcare, or Americans coming north for healthcare? In our province, it has a been a problem. People either get fake health cards, or fake citizenship to get the healthcare that they otherwise could not.
I haven't really heard of this, but you have to consider Calgary is a couple of hours away from the closest border, and it's Idaho/North Dakota. After traveling all over eastern Canada/US, I could definitely see it happening. Probably happens a ton in BC.
nocones wrote:dj06482 wrote: Many Canadians come down to the US for tests that they'd be waiting for under Canada's healthcare laws. Mammograms are a good example.What are the real statistics about this? I keep hearing CANADIANS like people living in America's Hat, in this thread and elsewhere defend the quality and low cost of Canadian healthcare. I've seen and heard lots of accounts from credible sources of the overall healthcare quality rating for Canada and other socialized medicine nations being higher than that offered in America. I've in these same threads seen lots of people from America saying what your saying about many canadians coming down to America for our superior health care. I'm by no means taking a contrary position to your statments I'd like to see some actual facts and studies to back this up.
My wife's worked as an X-Ray and Ultrasound tech for the past 15 years. During that time, she worked at a major hospital and women's imaging center in Stamford, CT (not a short hike from the border by any stretch of the imagination). She personally scanned women from Canada on a regular basis who were there to have tests done because they didn't want to wait the 3 months, 6 months, etc. in order to have the follow-up done through the Canadian healthcare system. When you have an abnormal mammogram, it does not make sense to wait 3-6 months to have an ultrasound scan as a follow-up. With other conditions, it may not make a difference. But with cancer, you are literally taking your life in your hands if you're putting off a recommended follow-up test. Health care in the US may not be superior, but you do have the option of paying for a test and getting it done sooner than you could get it done in Canada. To these women, it was worth the cost of the test and the cost of travel. I would agree with them 100%.
The statistics of people being scanned in Stamford CT from Canada are probably not amazing. Again, we're 5+ hours away from the border and the larger major airports (JFK, LGA, and Bradley) are all about an hour away. However, it was a regular occurrence for her to scan Canadians who didn't want to wait for tests at home. What would be more interesting would be to see what the numbers of Canadians getting scanned in locations in the US that were a short drive or a cheap plane ride from Canada.
92CelicaHalfTrac wrote:Johnboyjjb wrote: Don't confuse general healthcare with prescriptions. They are linked but the money inflation goes separate directions. My company which was originally located in the northwest and moved to Chicago and has large aerospace ties paid $19,812 for my family of five. I paid $1,597. Most of my co-pay charges are $20 and prescriptions are $5 or $20. Chiropractic co-pays are $30.Prescriptions are a huge reason why "other" healthcare is so expensive, though. Because advertising.
I was under the impression that the US and New Zealand were the only nations that allowed prescription drug manufacturers to market to consumers and not just medical professionals.
I have also heard stories of people crossing the southern border to get services that are locally grossly overpriced and relatively safe in the slightly less regulated medical fields of Mexico.
In reply to dj06482:
What those women probably didn't know, is that there are ways of getting tests done more quickly. If I wanted to go to a dermatologist locally, I would be looking at a wait, and it might be as much as 3 months or more. If I ask for a referral (your family doctor typically refers you to a specialist) to a dermatologist an hour away, I can get in within a week or less. Some places, mostly big cities, have more doctors. of course, if my doctor thought it was critical, I would likely be in there tout de suite.
Your example illustrates why we have the best of both worlds.
Access to radiation treatment for breast cancer has been an issue in Ontario, Ca.
And even cross-border cooperation/referrals. A comparison of treatments on either side of the ontario border show there are some variations of implementation, but outcomes are statistically the same.
So depending on region/population/diagnosis there are areas where the wait is considered too long. On the quality of treatment or care front - no real difference. So pay to play gets you in the door faster - but the treatments people get have the same results.
FWIW that was 2006 - things change. Back then occupancy rates were 60% in western NY and 95% in Ontario. Could be better or worse today.
oldtin wrote: Access to radiation treatment
Is an issue worldwide due to the necessary radiation sources not being available, because Canada supplies a lot of it and has obligations to the markets it has provided previously. This affects as more than it affects the people that contracts have been made with. The more you know...
I'm not real surprised to see the discussion turn towards Obamneycare or Canadia's system, although I didn't think about that when I posted this. I'll leave my personal feelings about that out of this.
Found out this morning that I was given the wrong packet. Production employees still get cigna. Managers get bcbs. The boss told me when I get promoted that is what my insurance would be. Good thing I've got some time to weigh the options.
The plan did go up. For the same coverage I had last year the new cost is $431 per month. I was given an option for a lower cost insurance that is $191 per month. However this option does not meet current laws and the company was given an exemption from the dept. of labor to still offer it.
The story he was given and then relayed to me was that last year the company paid +-$1mil in premiums. The Insurance co. paid out around $2.8mil. So yeah, that sucks.
You may now continue the thread in any direction you may like
Congrats on not getting such a huge pay cut!
Glad to hear that it's not as bad as what you originally thought. Gives you some time to explore other options and figure out what works best for you...
In reply to nicksta43:
In before the lock.
T.J. wrote: In reply to nicksta43: In before the lock.
Why are you in here posting when you should have been racing with us
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