If you haven't already, I'd recommend checking out the series of articles I wrote when planning/building/finishing my garage. I certainly learned a lot, and there's not much I'd do differently if I was going to start over.
Well, I'd build a bigger building, but as others have said that will always be the outcome no matter what you build.
Antihero (Forum Supporter) said:Figure 1.50$ a square foot for costs of finishing it, it's ridiculously worth it
Dang, want to come do my garage floor? I paid $5.80/sf for my house slabs, formed/finished/concrete/materials, and I would never use that company again. Next lowest bid was $6.50/sf.
Consider adding plumbing, at least for a toilet and basin. Having to leave the shop and head into the House just to take a piss is annoying, and not messing up a sink in the house with your dirty greasy mitts wont do your married life any harm either.
It'll never be big enough, you're always going to wish you did something different and you always accumulate more than you intend. But dont let any of that deter you, it'll be worth it.
Good luck and happy building, it really is an awesome feeling walking into that brand spanking new shop.
I can only assume he means after ground work, forming, and pouring the concrete. I’ve never known anyone that only paid for someone to finish, but thats my guess.
In floor heating.
More electrical outlets.
Plan your layout before hand (I've been using SketchUp)
Plan where your lift will go, add thicker/reinforced floor there if needed.
Lights and more lights. (add outlets to the ceiling if you don't put them in right away)
PMRacing said:Plan where your lift will go, add thicker/reinforced floor there if needed.
This, I added step downs in the ground work so I had extra slab thickness where the 2 poster will eventually go. One of those while you're in there type situations thats cheaper and easier to do when you build as opposed to down the track.
One thing I see (plenty) when comparing stick vs pole/post is that "framing stick costs the same!" Ok likely true as you end up with similar amounts of lumber to hold up the same walls, roof, etc. The big differentiator is what has to go in the ground and your frost depth. In more mild climates you can just pour a thickened edge slab and slap up your walls and you are set. When you get further north you have to start considering frost depth and a full footer 36-48" down gets crazy expensive quickly once you have to dig, pour, backfill and then put the slab in. There are some designs of floating insulated slabs but getting those past the building permit stage may need some engineering, very location dependent (common in Canada/Alaska but good luck in PA near here, but poles on concrete cookies is just fine).
If I were doing a dream shop, I would actually do four separate spaces for different task. These would be separated by a wall. Walls are good places to keep job appropriate tools and this way your tools can be specific to the work zone. You would not have to heat all four spaces since chances are you will only be working in one at a time for a period of time.
Clean mechanical space
Metal fab space
Bodywork space
Storage space.
Guessing at a 40 by 80 space for the above. 4 bays. Tall enough that I could have a hoist and a loft in the clean mechanical space.
Hmm, I'm going to take another look at my shop with that in mind. I already have a clean workshop in the attached garage (woodwork, electronics) and a dirty one in the shop (grinding, welding, cars). But walls in the shop, hmm.
I wouldn't have wanted to put them up right away when I moved in. I have moveable workbenches so I reconfigure as necessary. That's been useful in learning. And I did make a wall out of shelving, although that doesn't really prevent cross-contamination.
03Panther said:I can only assume he means after ground work, forming, and pouring the concrete. I’ve never known anyone that only paid for someone to finish, but thats my guess.
Exactly. That is only someone showing up and finishing it. It can be higher too, that's a very rough estimate.
In this situation you would have to set it up yourself, grade it yourself and pay for all materials. $5.80 isn't a bad figure there really
newrider3 said:Antihero (Forum Supporter) said:Figure 1.50$ a square foot for costs of finishing it, it's ridiculously worth it
Dang, want to come do my garage floor? I paid $5.80/sf for my house slabs, formed/finished/concrete/materials, and I would never use that company again. Next lowest bid was $6.50/sf.
That's only the finishing.
Almost always the cheapest bid is the most expensive as well. Either because they end up needing more money or because it sucks.
Concrete is a very different field, the product I do should last generations. Most the time it's a once-in-a-lifetime expense.......but only if it's done right
I know it's popular on car forums to say "It's never big enough", but it can, in fact, be big enough (or too big). Think seriously and realistically about what you are really, really going to do with the space. Be honest. Are you going to have ten cars? No, probably not. They're a PITA to maintain, cost a bunch to buy, insure, and maintain, and you're not going to use them all anyway. More space = more heat and cooling. Maybe only part of it needs to be tall enough for a lift. Maybe you don't need a lift, even though the entire internet says you do. Do you have kids? If you're planning to, plan also to spend not much time in your shop. I built my 30x40 before kids, and then had a half empty, seldom used garage for 10 years.
On the other hand, I learned that 10' of width per car isn't enough. I'll go with 12' next time. And yes, add lots of outlets, but you'll only need two per box if they're close enough together. I also ran cable for 220V, which I haven't used yet, but I'm glad it's there. And I set up the 110V outlets so that there is a different circuit every other outlet, 6' apart and 4' up. I had the contractor put in a rough-in for a bathroom...that I never finished, but it's there.
White paint makes the space much brighter. Think about where the windows should be, and if you want any. I ended up with an 8' wide door where I expected a 9' wide door. I didn't expect that because I didn't understand how much width had to be "not a door".
I recently read that stick-built is stronger than pole buildings, but I'll defer to the posters on here that actually know for sure. In any case, think about how much you value what you're going to put in this building, and select construction style accordingly.
Think about the distance between the house and the shop. How do you feel about walking out ot the shop in cold, rain, and snow. How will you feel about it when you're 60 (hint: not the way you feel about it now). On the other hand, don't make my mistake and leave insufficient space between the house, garage, and property line to hide a car or 3 behind the garage.
My next garage will be insulated up into the "You really don't need to do that." range, so I recommend that you plan the construction details to support lots of insulation, including the floor as noted earlier. It may be a bit smaller (yes, smaller!) too, like 36x30, and have a covered outdoor work space with a stainless table, power and water nearby.
Antihero (Forum Supporter) said:That's only the finishing.
I understand, but if I add $1.50/sf to my delivered cost for concrete, some wire mesh, and maybe a pump fee, it's still way less than what I get quoted around here. I would love to find a crew that will just finish, I can totally form and install rebar and chairs. Then at least I could take the time to do it the way I want instead of cringing while the crew pretends to pull the wire mesh up from the bottom during the pour.
I would also caution going big just to go big. Careful planning and allocation of space goes a long way. Do you really want to have thousands of square feet just dedicated to storing crap that you know you're never going to use or projects that you won't get around to?
I've been trying to learn sketchup so I can layout everything well. I'm not real proficient at it, but i'm getting better!
AntiHero, It sounds like it's worth it to pay someone to finish the concrete. I'll have to eventually get some quotes and see if it's worth doing the pre-pour stuff myself vs just paying someone to do everything.
The plan is to only finish the interior on half, that way i'm not paying to heat storage and all that.
You don't really need Sketchup, all you need is some graph paper and a pencil :) Sometimes quick and easy is the way.
NBraun said:I've been trying to learn sketchup so I can layout everything well. I'm not real proficient at it, but i'm getting better!
AntiHero, It sounds like it's worth it to pay someone to finish the concrete. I'll have to eventually get some quotes and see if it's worth doing the pre-pour stuff myself vs just paying someone to do everything.
The plan is to only finish the interior on half, that way i'm not paying to heat storage and all that.
Absolutely, if you are close to me I'd even help you out.
Just please dont go with the cheapest bid
In reply to newrider3 :
Booooooo on wire mesh but I totally get it.
1.50 would be an average. I bid jobs, not square footage but a lot of guys bid lazy.
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