A very British level of police brutality

I don't mean to be too offensive but... 

Bloody twatcycles. 

Baltimore City uses to do this but it seems people "need room to destroy"  and be general asshats.

"If you make me run, I'm bringing an ass-whoopin with me!"

Won’t go well when they run over someone. 

Local PD does it when the occasion calls for it: Don't shoot at cops

Thanks.  Now I have Fox News in my browser history.  A little warning next time?!

ClemSparks said:

Thanks.  Now I have Fox News in my browser history.  A little warning next time?!

 

Come to the Dark Side, Clem!  :)

As offensive as this may be, my feelings are that if you run from the police, they can use what ever means they feel is appropriate to make you stop, unless that puts the general public at risk.  If you don't want to get run over by a police car, don't flee. I have rarely heard of someone that pulls over and complies with the officers ending up getting hurt. It seems that lately criminals have more rights than law abiding people. 

In reply to imgon :

I’m pretty sure you would feel differently about that if you were a minority. 

Complying with officers does not always go well, and EVERY minority person I know knows someone who it has gone badly for. 

Im not suggesting running is a good idea, but complying with officers is not a guarantee that no one gets hurt. 

ClemSparks said:

Thanks.  Now I have Fox News in my browser history.  A little warning next time?!

 

If that's the worst thing in your browser, you need to try harder. It's the internets after all. 

In reply to SVreX :

But not complying is a definite guarantee that you will be hurt. 

I for one, applaud all instances of police brutality.

SVreX said:Im not suggesting running is a good idea, but complying with officers is not a guarantee that no one gets hurt. 

And failing to comply makes things better how, exactly?

SVreX said:

In reply to imgon :

I’m pretty sure you would feel differently about that if you were a minority. 

Complying with officers does not always go well, and EVERY minority person I know knows someone who it has gone badly for. 

Im not suggesting running is a good idea, but complying with officers is not a guarantee that no one gets hurt. 

Right!?

The rest of these comments I'll just pretend to ignore. Im out! 

1988RedT2 said:

SVreX said:Im not suggesting running is a good idea, but complying with officers is not a guarantee that no one gets hurt. 

 

And failing to comply makes things better how, exactly?

How about due process?

The article says “suspects”. You don’t think ramming suspects with an automobile is a bit extreme?

Hope you’re never a suspect. 

I'm with SVreX on this.

Yes, there is a problem with bike thieves and other scrotes that use scooters when they commit crimes. A lot of this has been growing for years while the Tory government cut back on policing - IIRC Theresa May (current prime minister, back then she was the home secretary) fired close to 20k police officers, when forces across the country were already short staffed. That's why the scrotes could get away with it, because there is hardly any police around in the first place. Heck, traffic enforcement is mainly for speeding via cameras because there is hardly any traffic police around (which admittedly predates Theresa May' reign, that's been going on since the 2000s).

The Tories and especially the right wing press has been yammering that they're not allowed to selectively grant human rights only to people they like and agree with, and do away with them for people they don't like (that'll be [lower] middle class, working class and especially people whose ancestry goes back to the colonies - in case you were wondering). This is the sort of E36 M3 that happens when they selectively apply said rights.

And it's not like it's all unicorn farts and roses with UK police forces - the Met (aka Metropolitan police in London) has a pretty well known, pretty long history of institutional racism and also very varied treatment of people based on class and skin colour (to put it mildly). There's always a bunch of officers who are only too happy to help a suspect fall down the stairs at the police station. The Met isn't the only police force with these issues, they're just one of the more high-profile ones as they're the largest in the country.

I have a whole bunch of friends and acquaintances who grew up in poor working class areas or on council estates (that's posh for projects, at least until Maggie privatised them) and they give the police a wide berth independent of their skin colour. Keep in mind that I'm talking about people who have solid middle class careers in IT, finance and the like, not a guy flogging VCRs that fell of the back of a lorry somewhere.

Time to take a deep breath from ranting...

It used to be police policy in the UK that they wouldn't chase suspects on motorcycles and scooters after a bunch of accidents that left both suspects and innocent bystanders injured (and the police got sued as a result). Yes, it's painful if someone you "know is guilty" gets away with crimes, but that's how the legal system works if you have a presumption of innocence.

Just to make this clear - I'm far from anti-police. But I also happen to come from a country that had a history of police overreach (and I'm not talking about the unpleasantness that ended in '45, because a lot of the same people in law enforcement continued their careers afterwards, too) and I tend to be a bit sensitive to that. I also happen(ed) to socialise occasionally with a few very stand up police officers when I lived in the UK, and they'd be the first ones to admit that there are issues with how policing is done these days.

I've had vehicles and parts stolen while I lived in the UK. So have a lot of my friends, especially recently. Heck, a friend of mine just had one of his lockups broken into and a bike stolen. Reporting something like that to the police in a lot of places in the UK gets you a crime number for your insurance and you become a statistic. That's pretty much it because the police is so understaffed that they don't tend to have the time to deal with "petty crime".

None of that is an excuse for bumping suspects on two wheels off the road.

In reply to BoxheadTim :

Thanks for the education. I don’t know a thing about U.K. police or history. 

In reply to SVreX :

You're welcome. Unfortunately with decades worth of cutbacks for law enforcement, the old school policeman wandering down the streets who knows everybody (like, what one would see in the movies) has been a thing of the past for a while now. Yes, there's been a lot of talk about re-introducing foot patrols and all that, until someone crunches the numbers. Either way, the police force is mostly understaffed and spread thin, and that has a big impact on crime rates, specifically property crime. The vast majority of officers is hard working, genuinely loves the work they do, hasn't seen a pay rise in a decade that's worth mentioning if they got one at all, and are somehow trying to keep the place safe and in one piece.

The one thing that is still true about most UK police officers is that they are unarmed - well, in the sense of not carrying a gun. The police department usually has a couple of officers qualified on firearms, or they have to call in support from one of the big police departments like the Met.

I think that video is a great example of very bad policing. It shows disregard for human life, a disproportionate use of force, and no attempt to de-escalate the situation. 

This is not how we want our police treating anyone. 

  -- Pete

Before the lock: What SVREX said. Also: What NWA said. I’m actively trying to decrease any potential contact with the armed tax-collectors of the world. If they’re your heroes, and attempted murder while “investigating” theft-of-scooter is hilarious to you, you’re part of the problem.

SVreX said:

In reply to imgon :

I’m pretty sure you would feel differently about that if you were a minority. 

Complying with officers does not always go well, and EVERY minority person I know knows someone who it has gone badly for. 

I'm not suggesting running is a good idea, but complying with officers is not a guarantee that no one gets hurt. 

You are right, I am not a minority and I imagine there are lots of instances where the cops have and do behave poorly. It sucks that people who have done nothing wrong get hassled or worse yet beat up just because of their skin tone/religion/sexual preference. That being said I believe that in most cases if someone is running they have already made the decision that they are "special" and don't need to follow the rules of civilized society. No one, cops included, has the right to run amuck and not be held accountable for their actions. We seem to be creating a group of criminals that knows if they push "X" far, the cops will back off and they can do whatever they like. I may be incredibly naive, but, I'm thinking the scooter/bike thieves may now think about the fact they might get run down by a police car and decide whatever they were going to do isn't worth it or maybe will stop when caught. Unfortunately we live in a world that too many people don't believe that we should treat each other with decency and respect. To me, the concept of not stopping for the police (lack of respect) puts the onus on the fleeing person to accept that consequences will escalate to something that may be harmful to them. In my youth I had numerous dealing with the police, I never once even thought about running. It was always, E36M3 I got caught again! I'm sorry if I come across as insensitive but I don't have much sympathy for people that aren't willing to accept that there are consequences to not following the rules, and to me, running from the cops is a big one. Having said this, I will step away from the keyboard and hope that I have not taken this too far.

In reply to imgon :

My point was not to turn this into an argument about race. 

My point was that there are lots of reasons people run or are afraid, and many of them have nothing to do with guilt. Even fleeing a crime scene is not evidence of guilt.

As far as I am concerned, those videos are nothing but evidence that can be used in a law suit against the police, showing attempted murder for alleged petty crime.

Looks like the PoPo is filming their own crimes, but I can see it being a rather strong deterrent against running from them. 

As a rider, I would really hate to be mistaken for someone who committed a crime while wearing similar riding gear to me.   

Or happen be in an area where there are other riders acting lawlessly, putting me in jeopardy of being rammed and possibly run over by over two tons of steel powered by several hundred horsepower just because I am on a motorcycle.  

Due process, indeed...


 

It is not good for a society when police feel empowered to assault people absence threat.

It is not good for a society when citizens feel empowered to resist or flee from the police.

These two behaviors reinforce each other.