Yet another bathroom renovation

I recently started renovating our guest bathroom. Last year we bought a house originally built in 1971. The original owners lived there until it was flipped by investor and we bought from them. Most of the updating work was done pretty well, but it's still an old house. The guest bathroom was always a bit lacking. They kept the original single-piece fiberglass tub/shower combo and just threw up a glass door to spiffy it up. Not a big deal and perfectly functional, especially for a seldom-used guest bath, though ingress is awkward.

It all started a few months ago when I noticed a stain on the basement ceiling. This coincided with my wife starting to take baths again. Our master bath is a walk-in shower, so she was using this one. The stain also coincided with the basement wood paneling starting to warp next to the stain. Hmm. 

Though the drywall was wet, and I could see where it flowed over to the wall, I couldn't pinpoint the source. No active leaks and all the plumbing was dry. So I fill the tub with an inch of water, and still no leaks. Then I used my hands to shove water down the overflow, and bingo!

It was the overflow gasket! Wife had been overflowing the tub with more hot water to keep the temp up. I'm guessing the tub had not been overflowed in years, since the house flipper probably never took a bath.

According to my wife it's my fault, because ever since I turned the water heater down due to the scalding hot kitchen sink, she resorted to overflowing the tub with fresh hot water. Mistake noted...and heater turned back up.

I figured with a massive hole already in the basement ceiling, providing easy access to the drain plumbing, now is a good time to go ahead and upgrade the bathtub. The old fiberglass tub was also making some creaky crackling noises, and you could feel it flexing under your feet. It's about time. 

I cut the tub into bite-size pieces for the garbage cans. The smell reminds me of cutting up my Lotus Europa, so there's your GRM tie-in.

The other side of this wall is our master walk-in shower, which was done by the flipper. Seeing tile installed over green sheetrock is pretty disappointing. I'm betting they didn't use any sort of waterproofing either, besides thinset. No signs of water damage yet, but that job is only a year old. At least they used a membrane layer on the floor. Hopefully we get at least a few years out of it. 

No mortar was used under this tub, which probably explains the flexing. Surprised it hadn't cracked yet!

And this explains the loose shower head. It was never nailed down, probably since 1971 when the house was built!

The overall plan is:

• Replace tub with something deeper and nicer
• Update valve and trim with black ones to match the rest of the house, including one of those nifty handhelds on a sliding rail
• Cement board the walls
• Add a niche
• Roll-on waterproof membrane over the cement board
• Tile the walls all the way up, probably something white and plain so as not to clash with the floor tile
• Go back to shower curtain because the sliding doors are annoying on an alcove tub
• Keep original speckled yellow floor tile because we're cool like that
• Wallpaper with a funky fun pattern TBD

We hired a contractor to redo a very similar bathroom last fall. First time I didn't do it myself. Paying the man got it started and finished in eight days.  

We used a cast iron kohler tub and jumbo (like 60" x 30") wall tile over durock + red gard roll on waterproofing. I very much recommend cast iron for a new tub even though most of the available options are some flavor of plastic. An extra deep cast iron one will cost some bucks - so I went with standard depth and it's fine.

Agree on shower curtain vs glass doors. Curved curtain rod FTW. Make sure you provide blocking behind the tile up around the curtain rod ends. 

And personal preference: consider towel hooks instead of bars. 
 

One last thing I have always wondered about is the joint between a tub and wall tile. The tub has a lip that turns up behind the durock. Then we run tile down to the tub and caulk the bottom. No place for water to go IF it manages to get behind the tile. 

Nice work!  It will look good when you're done.  Good job catching it before it got any worse!

If you don't want a curtain (and I agree, curved curtain rods FTW), consider a hinged glass enclosure instead of the rolling one.  We put a double glass door on our tub upstairs.

Our tub was a drop-in style and didn't come with a niche wall flange.  I sweated that joint, believe me.  We ended up sealing it with Gorilla sealant, putting reinforcing mesh from the tub edge up the wall, and rolling RedGard over the whole shebang.  Then we covered the entire tub rim with quartz, and brought the wall tile down on top of that.

I feel pretty good about the tile to tub interface. Been looking at lots of diagrams and cross sections. The tub I bought even has guidance, and  is similar to what yall are saying.

Tonight I got the old drain cut out. Kinda scary taking a sawzall to a big black pipe in your ceiling. Capped off for now, ready to be joined with a new PVC drain and trap setup.

Side note - as an engineer and overall dork (redundant) I find the history and the materials science incredibly interesting, before the invention and widespread use of PVC. The picture above is a great example. Brass sections for the overflow and stopper mechanism, soldered to copper pipes, several more brass or copper fittings, then finally inserted in a cast iron P-trap, which I assume uses joints packed with oakum or some other fiber, maybe rubber by the 70's, possibly poured over with lead. The rest of the house DWV is also cast iron, until it goes through the foundation into the ground, where it (used to be) clay pipe sections that press together with rubber joints. PVC effectively replaces this entire menagerie of materials. One magic material, that can still last pretty long, and is easier and cheaper to produce and install. And in the history of humanity, we have only had access to this material for less than 50 years, despite plumbing systems dating back to Roman times. I just find that pretty cool. 

Following along, can't wait to see the results!

In reply to maschinenbau :

The smell reminds me of cutting up my Lotus Europa, so there's your GRM tie-in.

I'm sitting at work right now, but I swear I can smell this.

I'm watching all these renovation threads with great interest, since I've just started looking at houses to get out of my rental.

Parts stack has arrived! This weekend was all plumbing though.

The whole house is copper that has lasted 50+ years, so that's good enough for me. Plus it's really fun and satisfying!

Building in subassemblies on the bench is easier and safer compared to building in-situ. Best to minimize indoor blowtorch use around wood. And the new stack doubles as an awesome steampunk trident.

This is the part I've been dreading - the point of no return. Must complete the job, correctly, or else I have to explain why we can't shower tonight.

Two quick joints later and no leaks! I also added more wood structure behind the stack.

The drop ear is actually screwed in this time, so no more loose shower head!

For the drain and overflow, I had to slightly angle the pipes from vertical to clear a joist. Glad I measured first.

50+ years of hair and gunk. Iron pipe wall is still pretty solid though. The water damage forced me to open this hole in the ceiling below, which made the tub upgrade make sense.

Pretty much ready for walls and tile now. I am planning on cement board with RedGuard roll-on waterproofing. What kind of roller is everyone using for this stuff? 

Despite this being an oversized 32" wide tub, there is still almost a 2" gap to the floor tile. I was thinking about a 4" wide threshold piece over top of it, or grind to fit a 2" piece flush with the floor. I think I prefer the latter if I can find a material that matches the door threshold. Also, the floor tile is sitting on like 2" thick of concrete. Should I fill this valley betwen the floor and tub with more concrete, then tile over that? If so, mortar mix or would thin-set be okay? Or just fill with wood, waterproof membrane over that, then thinset?

In reply to maschinenbau :

Or furr out the rear tub wall that 2". Have to move you new plumbing though.

In reply to VolvoHeretic :

I thought about that before screwing the tub down, but then the overflow and drain wouldn't be lined up with the spout, valve, and shower head and that would drive me crazy. I had already soldered the stack by that time, and didn't want to redo that either. So here I am.

I am finding some 2" wide marble tile that might match the door threshold. Just don't know what to put under it. 

You can also get 2" marble thresholds.  I have a handful of short samples on my desk I use for paperweights.

Honestly don't know how thick you can make thinset.  You could buy the smallest bag of flash patch they make to fill it up to the top of the adjacent concrete.

Self leveler would probably work. You could rip down the threshold piece for beside the tub to be thinner. The piece would be too long for any standard wet saw, but you could carefully feed it through like a table saw, or take a long time with a grinder and a diamond blade. Any imperfections in the cut would easily be covered by caulking that you would want there anyway. 

In reply to maschinenbau :

I don't really know what you should use. I would think that some kind of non shrink grout. I have used SpecChem multi-purpose non-shrink grout with succuss but there might be better grouts out there.

I also know nothing about tile.

SpecChem.com: SC Multi-Purpose Grout

https://SpecChem.com/2023-specguide/

Don't fill it with wood. I suspect a tile setting "mud bed" is what's under the existing floor tile. You would normally want some reinforcing mesh in a mud bed but it doesn't really seem possible in this little slot.

I think nonshrink grout or flooring self leveler will likely also do the trick - but follow setting instructions carefully due to the thickness. 
 

edit: I wouldn't just pack setting mortar in there unless it is specifically made to be placed that thick. I would definitely not fill with tile grout. I don't think you suggested that but two different types of "grout" can make this confusing. 

Most grout needs to be wet cured for about 5 days to not crack. We place paper towels that are periodically wetted down and covered with plastic sheeting. You could use a bunch of stainless steel flat head screws into the subfloor to help anchor the grout after it has set up.

We used SpecChem SpecRock quick setting (10 minutes) grout to repair a leaking construction joint in a 4 foot thick concrete floor slab located 4 feet below the water table caused by a misplaced PVC water stop. We cut out a 64 foot long 1.5"wide by 1" deep grove in the concrete around the joint and then beat in a very little moistened dry pack of grout with a 2x4 board eventually soaking it down after about 10 minutes. Its then covered in epoxy floor covering and I have not found out if it worked after placing it almost a year later. The joint is normally under 2 feet of water.

SpecChem SpecRock

Reaches 2000 psi in 1 hour, 5000 psi in 1 day, and 8000 psi in 28 days.

Looking like floor leveler will be the right stuff to fill the gap, as long as I put plastic over the wood subfloor and tub. The gap is more like 1" deep by almost 2" wide. I think I will get a custom piece of marble cut for it. We added some kitchen counters earlier this year, so I have a known good supplier to work with. Perhaps they can provide the niche shelves too. 

This weekend I reinforced the wall framing and hung the cement board and niche. I added framing where the bottom of the slider for the handheld will mount. Also added another stud since the original spacing there was a bit wide.

Quick test fit 

After the last bits of wall patching, I can roll on the Red Guard waterproofing and start tiling.

Looking good!

Drywall patched, cement board mortared, and two coats of waterproofing, ready to start tiling. Niche shelf material ordered last week, hopefully it doesn't hold me up. Still undecided on the floor to tub gap, but it won't affect the wall tiling. 

The Red Guard stuff is pretty weird. It comes out of the tub with a consistency halfway between pepto bismol and silly putty, but rolls and dries like normal paint. Smells like paint too, so I just ran the vent fan all weekend to keep the fumes away. I used a paint brush for the corners, especially dabbing into the lower edge of the CBU boards where they meet the tub lip.

Man, tiling is hard. I have probably 30 or 40 hours just in the tiling work, spread out over several days. Kinda wish I hired this part out, but also I probably saved some serious coin here. Feels good to have this bathroom (at least, the toilet) back in service now that it's all cleaned up. Just need to caulk all the corners, hang the curtain rod, and finally source a strip of marble for the transition to the tub apron. 

Everything works as it should and wife is pretty happy with how it's looking. Feels good.

Looks great!  It will be a nice room.

Looks good! Plus you have the light grout which helps any imperfections blend in. Glad I'm not the only one who took forever on tile. I don't know how many hours my bathroom took me. It was a LOT. 

Open for business! I took the first shower and it feels pretty nice, not gonna lie. Even though this tub is humongous, the curved curtain rod was a good call. So spacious inside. 

With the curtain closed, it's a little dark in there. The only lighting is the vanity. The vent fan above the toilet is old, noisy as hell, and barely moves any air. I'll probably replace the vent fan with a flush-mount light, and install a new better vent fan / LED light combo unit above the tub. I did the same thing in our master bathroom and it's been great. 

Another observation is some creaking noises from the tub when you shift your weight around. The tub came with a felt pad to go under the feet but said a mortar bed was "optional". I didn't see how a mortar bed would work though. The tub has about a dozen feet that are like 3 or 4" tall, so that would be a huge thick slab of mortar to reach the bottom of the tub, which has a complex web of engineered rib gussets. So far I have tried sticking wood shims under any feet that have gaps from below, and that has helped for sure, but access is severely limited. I have one cut hole near the tub drain and a hole in the ceiling below to work from (the hole that started this whole project...lol). 

Internet says you can stack foam board underneath and fill the gap to the tub with spray foam, but may need to open the access hole for more room. It's kinda disappointing after all this work, but at least it looks and feels luxurious. What I should have done was level the original subfloor first and add another layer of thicker material before installing the tub. The original subfloor is pretty flimsy so that was quite an oversight on my part. 

Forgot to follow up. I found a way to fill the gap between floor and tub apron. I got a new vanity sink countertop and just had them cut a custom strip of the same material. It all matches the shower niche shelf and the existing door threshold. Pretty happy with how it turned out. Now we just need to decide between paint or wallpaper. I think original floor tile works well with this combination.

The strip of countertop engineering granite is very thin, but it didn't break. I mortared it in as if it were a giant piece of tile, then caulked the edges. I wish I had grouted the edge between floor and strip, but I caulked it instead. Oh well, it works.

The tub still makes a creaking noise if you shift your weight just right while showering, but shimming the feet from the room below seemed to help a bit. I might still spray-foam the bottom anyway while the ceiling hole is there. Yep, the ceiling hole is still there!

1. Looks good!
    
2. Always paint, never wallpaper.
    
3. Seriously, never wallpaper.