GRM Project Cars 2 - Series 4: Ugly Ducklings

There are some fast bots on this track.  The biggest thing you need to test for is after 5-7 laps what happens to your car.  When I started my car would become a complete mess after 5 -7 laps.  This was with the temps still in the green.  God forbid you overheat the tires it then becomes like driving on ice.  It has been a balance of not taking to much tire pressure out of the car as it really slows you down versus having something that is drivable when the temps and pressures stabilize.  I ended up adding a lot of camber to only the left side of the car and I will probably end up with pressures about 1lb lower all the way around..  I also found that brake balance needs to be adjusted.  something much closer to 50/50 seems to work much better.  It keeps the rear of the car from rotating/sliding the rear tires on corner entry as much and this tends to keep the rear tire temps and pressures down a bit and when things do get hot having to much rear brake makes the car almost undrivable under braking.    

We will see. I guess I will have to try and take it easy for the race, but sliding is kinda thing thing I do....

From the few laps I ran last week, I would have to say the course is not one of the most entertaining for these cars.  It is wide, so that is a plus.  If I can latch onto Dean again, I can intimidate him in all sorts of new and exciting ways with such a wide track...

Opened a new room for you air

Fun race. For once I had a glimmer of hope of getting a win with Sauce in the room. Then I lost it twice in one lap and found myself in 3rd from 1st. I knew from practice I could only get by Dean if he made an error and he didn't. 

Lap one turn one was fun. A mustang pushed air by me and both over ran turn one. I then had to get a little aggressive with the mustang and pinched it off in turn two to keep it behind me. I then just dogged air until I set him up for a pass coming out of the last corner that I completed in turn one. Sauce and TJ had got away a bit but I set sail and got back to them. I got to with in a second of TJ but then air bumped me and I gave it all up. I was resigned to third as air faded fast and I did not think I had time to get to tj and sauce. But a lap or three later I come up on TJ off roading it in the last two corners. I got it down to with in 9 seconds of sauce nut realized I was not going to get him so I slowed to just try and match his speed and keep TJ a couple seconds back. This cooled my tires a bunch so I could just watch TJ and if he got close I would just lay in to it for s couple corners and open it up a little. On the last lap I was a bit lax and let TJ get closer than I should have. He made a dive in the last couple corners but it would not stick and he slid wide behind me and ended up finishing behind me.

Last night was a lot of fun. The first couple of laps I was having issues adjusting to the car actually having grip, which was causing me to turn in a bit early. It about got me pretty badly on lap one when I caught the inside curb on the 2nd to last corner and almost went into the pits. I saved it but lost all the gap I had gained from others dicing it up at the beginning of the race. 

From there it was a game of trying to balance pace with tire temps. Not the easiest thing to do on this track, but that was compounded by TJ being up my trumpets and pushing me hard. After a few laps of riding that edge I got loose in the left hand sweeper and had a minor off which let TJ by. It was interesting following him as we had different lines in some places and also areas where one of us would be faster. 

After several laps of following TJ he ran wide in T1 and I ducked inside. We proceeded to swap inside and outside positions for the next 3 corners, and at the 4th corner he got into a slide and went off track. It wasn't a huge mistake and was about 2 seconds back before another off cost him more dearly. At that point there was a 9 second gap to Dean and about 4 laps left so I settled in and just tried to keep it consistent and clean for the remainder. 

I forgot about that Mustang at the start!  Was that grandma?

I did see him (her?) coming since I looked back when I started braking a bit early into T1 (to try and avoid a pile up).  He just came blasting up toward the inside and fortunately only pushed me out and did not spin me.  Fortunately Dean was out of the way (and got sweet revenge).

Had a few examples of bad visibility again.  Had Dean RIGHT next to me a few times and could not tell he was there.  At the start, I assumed he was near me, but did not see him until he pulled up so close I could see him in the 45 deg left view.

I think one of the issues is that although the car indicator thing shows other cars, it's not obvious at all.  You have to look to see if it shows something rather then it showing you and you being aware.  Anyway, something I that would be nice to improve.

In reply to dean1484 :

I was within a second of you nearly the whole time I was behind you. At the finish, I was no closer than I had been other laps and was just trying to make a dramatic sliding finish for the replay - was not in any danger of passing you at that point.

Did some Monaco practice.

1) The bots, as expected, are not at their best at this track and are fairly slow.

2) The chicane does not have walls like it always seems to in gran turismo.

3) T1 and the chicane are both places where the stewards may have to keep an eye out for track limit abuse.

"Track limit abuse"

Isn't that what you would call Sauce's first lap in the last race?

In reply to aircooled :

LOL. He did abuse the limits a bit, but he was nice to us and kept taking the long way instead of taking short cuts.

In reply to T.J. :

I'm a friendly abuser ​​​​​​

As for Monaco I agree, though T1 will be tough given how hard it is to see the pit exit line, and since no one will be pitting I don't really see pit exit violations as an issue. The chicanes however could be problematic, given that if you brake a bit too late you basically have to cut not to cause a pile up. If you cut make sure you don't gain an advantage. 

e30Matt said:

 If you cut make sure you don't gain an advantage. 

F1 rules apply, if you gain an advantage you will be required to give back any positions.

BradLTL said:

e30Matt said:

 If you cut make sure you don't gain an advantage. 

F1 rules apply, if you gain an advantage you will be required to give back any positions.

Yes, but to further extrapolate it doesn't need to be for position. Even if you have a gap to others (+ or -) and blow your brake point, don't let that have a time advantage. Lift for a period (how long will depend on the scenario) then resume.

I encourage everyone to have the live gap timing as part of their displays, not only is it useful in general but in this type of situation can help gauge what the gap was and what it needs to be after. When you see you've got it wrong glance at the gap, give it up a bit, and in a corner or two if you aren't back to where you were then lift a bit.

Between GT and the few seasons of PC2 we haven't needed official intervention for track limits in years, continue to drive like gentlemen and account for mistakes and that streak will continue  

If someone is chasing me and wants to cut to catch me so we can dice it up have at it. Way more fun than just running laps. 

T1 has the pit exit line and then another 1.5 car widths or so is that bit of curbing. I've been practicing T1 so that I keep at least 2 wheels to the left of or on the curbing. Are you saying to ignore the curbing and the pit exit line entirely? That shaves off at least a second since you can carry more speed all the way up the hill. 

Been experimenting with tire pressures. It's a balance of ultimate pace vs probability of a spin. I've also tried passing AIs as if they were human (ie- no contact and no track limit abuse) and it is tough. Sometimes takes a few laps to get by even if they're running 4-5 seconds slower laptimes. 

Ran some laps, walls seem to be more of a problem than corner cuts. The track feels tighter than it does in other games which makes it fairly difficult in these cars. That said, there is a lot of time available if you're willing to bear the risk. I'll probably be on tonight for more testing if anyone wants to join. 

Lessons learned from last night:

1. The walls are not your friend.

2. He who has to go in reverse the fewest number of times wins. 

3. The AI is woefully slow and difficult to pass. 

e30Matt said:

Lessons learned from last night:

1. The walls are not your friend.

2. He who has to go in reverse the fewest number of times wins. 

3. The AI is woefully slow and difficult to pass. 

4. This track brings out Sauce's inner alien more than most.

Here is Sauce....-

Here is the rest of us.

In reply to T.J. :

You just need to get closer to the walls to go a bit faster. What's the worst that could happen? ​​​​​​

In seriousness, this track has a couple spots to gain or lose huge amounts of time. The biggest is in the bay section turns 13-16. Done right, with the exception of a half lift for 13 you're flat out from the exit of 12 to 15. For 16 you want to hit the curb with your inside tires (all 4 will put you into the wall at exit) and get back on it early. You should need 3rd gear before 17.

The other big thing is don't be afraid of the curbs, especially in T1. They are F1 friendly and don't upset the car too much unless you hit them with all 4 wheels. The exception to that is the chicane after the tunnel, but if you hit that one while turning it will bounce the car to point towards the exit and it's hammer time. 

I keep going back and forth from being excited to dreading this race.

Look at it this way.  It will be just like F1.  Qualify where you want to finish.

We should probably have an agreement to enter the uphill in our starting order to avoid any T1 issues.  I think in general we have been doing this, but we want to make sure the bots don't try anything.

Lap traffic could be very interesting.

Are there any T1 bot issues with this course?  I have to say, I was a bit surprised to get butt slammed by grandma last week... wait... let me rephrase that...

In reply to aircooled :

There are actually a bunch of places that you can pass people on this track.... While they're in the wall. 

I am curious if we should do away with track limits for T1 at the start. If the humans cut inside there is plenty of room and probably less likely to have a repeat of last week with the Mustang.