Got an update, and not a good one. Things were going well with the truck, until late last week. I noticed during some tuning sessions that I was only getting about 50% throttle, which is 100% the fault of the Lokar cables and bracket I bought. This thing flat out SUCKS.
Let's pop the hood...
Man, that's pretty now. I am not sure if I've showed you guys this, but I scrounged together an air cleaner from some spare Trans Am bits I had kicking around and scored a blue reusebale cotton element on clearance at a PepBoys. The lid was rusty, so I cleaned it and hit it with some clearcoat. I dig the look.
Terrible pic, but this has been where most of the trouble from this swap has happened so far. These trucks came with a conventional throttle cable, but they had kickdown linkage instead of a cable. None of that stuff fits when you install an aftermarket intake, so you're stuck with either modding the rods and linkage or swapping to something like Lokar's setup. It's not cheap, and frankly, it's not great. The cables themselves are nice quality, but the bracket is flimsy and no matter how hard I've tightened it down, it moved on me. When that moves, it changes both the shift points AND the throttle values, so you have to go in and reset everything mechanically and reset idle with the tuner. Talk about a pain! I re-adjusted it for the 52nd time, and went through the process of resetting idle, kickdown, etc.
And that leads me to last weekend. I was still hunting for the right kickdown settings and trying to find the sweet spot between normal shifting and getting it to downshift when asked. Meanwhile, I was trying to deal with a cranking fuel and fuel prime. When you turn on the ignition, stock settings prime the fuel system and splash the intake with some fuel. During cranking, it was providing WAY too much fuel, and I noticed after the last adjustment of the cables that it was just shooting fuel everywhere. This was causing hard starts and a rich mixure on startup that would clear out once it settled in. So I busted out the laptop to change some settings.
But eventually, it stopped starting. Ugh.
I pulled the plugs, and most of them were soaked in fuel, so I hit up the parts store for some new ones.
After installing them, still nothing. I checked for spark, and it had it. The ignition box also has a status light on there that tells you if it's working, and while cranking, it was operating properly. So I disconnected the fuel pump relay to try and clear it out. It sputtered a little once things got lean enough, but nothing. On starting fluid, same deal; it would sorta sputter but no ignition. That got me thinking: how much fuel is in the crankcase?
I pulled the dipstick, and the reading was high and the oil was mostly fuel! And to add insult to injury, the damn dipstick tube snapped flush with the block. WTF.
Next step, compression test. We are likely dealing with fuel-washed cylinders here. Best case scenario is draining the oil and hoping to get compression back with a squirt of oil directly in the cylinders. Worst case: engine rebuild time.
I can't catch a break. 
Lokar bracket tip:
Move the bracket to manifold slot to the other end of travel (moce the cables closer to the throttle body) and use star washers under and above to help keep it from rotating. In addition, setup the stop screw. All of tjose is what i did to solve the issue on the duster. It was my last ditch effort before doing a locating roll pin....
Dusterbd13-michael said:
Lokar bracket tip:
Move the bracket to manifold slot to the other end of travel (moce the cables closer to the throttle body) and use star washers under and above to help keep it from rotating. In addition, setup the stop screw. All of tjose is what i did to solve the issue on the duster. It was my last ditch effort before doing a locating roll pin....
I've got it pretty much dialed in now. I can't get it too much closer to the throttle body due to it hitting the runners, but the set screw is set up better now and it's no longer moving. Eventually, I may make my own bracket out of thicker, stronger steel stock to replace this thing. But I have to get it running first!
Compression tester acquired. I'll post results once I have more info. Would've loved to do a leakdown test, but because of where it is in my yard, getting my air compressor out there is really tough. This will at least give me a clue as to what's going on. Still hoping to be able to save it.
That sucks man. I just bought that exact lokar setup. Hopefully your motor doesn't need a rebuild.
Say it with me: magnum 5.2
Heres to hoping its not berkeleyed.
Whelp...
Compression test averaged 30-60psi on the cylinders that had compression. Re-read that statement: yes, some cylinders had ZERO compression.
Not sure what to do now. I don't want to just give up on the truck, especially since I need a truck for Truck Stuff and I've been searching for one of these for decades. I have few options:
-A Magnum swap is a possibility, but it's A LOT of work. I would need a host of different, non-compatible parts: new intake, headers, torque converter, flexplate, distributor, and likely aftermarket cylinder heads, since Magnum heads are prone to cracking. That adds up to thousands of dollars.
-Ideally, I'd like to find a cheap LA 360 and do a mild refresh: gaskets, bearings, rings, and a mild cam. That would plop right in.
-Of course, I could also rebuild what I have, but I'm fearing severe mechanical damage at this point. At best, I have severe fuel washed cylinders. At worst, the timing chain skipped a tooth or two and valves got introduced to pistons.
LA engines are the best, easiest choice, but they are scarce on the ground around here. Most of them that I see in the yards are 318's and have been sitting out in the weather for decades. And those that aren't are really expensive.
Ugh.
In reply to Tony Sestito :
GRM LA 360 relay? GRM Relay.
I'm sure there's more than a few here that could keep an eye out for something that could help you out and others could help get it headed towards you.
Also, one idea might be to rebuild what you have with a stroker kit. That could potentially be a good article series to write in addition to the EFI install/tuning. Just a thought.
Why assume the timing chain jumped teeth? You had a day's worth of cranking and such with it. I could see an overbore with new pistons in the plan but beyond that seems kind of doom & gloom. Of course, who knows, but still...
Apparently there were pre-Magnum LA 360's that got factory roller cam setups. If you could get a cheap, complete long block, might be a nice thing to build on if you're going to be building a motor. Getting your motor out and apart first might be wise to know what parts you can reuse from your existing toasted 360.
I can keep an eye out down here for la motors.
Are you sure the headers are different? Distributor is interchangeable, and im pretty sure the flexplate and torque converter are the same balance and bolt pattern. The intake is different, but i know some people were redrilling the magnum heads to use la intakes. Thatbwas years ago though.
The timing chain jumping a tooth or two may be a real possibility. These engines are notorious for stretching timing chains, and I had a hell of a time getting timing right while installing the new ignition system and EFI (should've probably mentioned that). During data logs, timing was a bit wonky as well, jumping around a bit, even during "static timing" programming. If the chain was indeed loose, that could cause that for sure. If it jumped a tooth or two, it would also cause low/no compression readings on the gauge.
I am aware of the roller cam LA engines, but they are pretty rare. The roller 360's are pretty much unobtanium at this point. It's easier to find a flat tappet one, and I don't mind that. Going to check out the local yard this weekend to see what they have. They might have a 360 stuffed away somewhere or hiding in an old motorhome.
Plan for now is to pull the timing cover off and see what's going on. The timing cover gasket is leaking anyway, and it will be easier to replace the dipstick tube with it off. If I'm lucky, a new timing set will get me back in business. If not, then that part will already be disassembled.
Dusterbd13-michael said:
I can keep an eye out down here for la motors.
Are you sure the headers are different? Distributor is interchangeable, and im pretty sure the flexplate and torque converter are the same balance and bolt pattern. The intake is different, but i know some people were redrilling the magnum heads to use la intakes. Thatbwas years ago though.
Magnum engines are balanced differently than their LA counterparts. The torque converters and flexplates are different (and balanced) so you need Magnum ones to make things work. And since there are no factory Magnum 727's, you are stuck with aftermarket stuff.
Looks like you are right about exhaust ports and the rest, which is good. If that's the case, might make sense to just go Magnum, granted I can find one with decent, uncracked heads. I was quoted $150 a while back by the local yard for a rebuildable 5.9 Magnum or a bit more for a runner.
In reply to Tony Sestito :
No problem! Its been a LONG minute since I looked at magnum swaps, but ive always said that if the dusters hot rod 360 kicks it, its getting a ring and bearing rebuilt magnum 5.9
Keep up the good fight man.
In-situ ring job with cast iron rings, and no other work if the bearings look OK.
The NH redneck in me is screaming 12v.
Please...
Tony Sestito said:
Whelp...
Compression test averaged 30-60psi on the cylinders that had compression. Re-read that statement: yes, some cylinders had ZERO compression.
I have to ask the dumb questions, just in case. Did you have the throttle wide open when you ran that compression test?
The LA in my 75 Dart had a nylon coated cam gear. That coating failed and caused me to jump time and bend a couple pushrods.
DarkMonohue said:
Tony Sestito said:
Whelp...
Compression test averaged 30-60psi on the cylinders that had compression. Re-read that statement: yes, some cylinders had ZERO compression.
I have to ask the dumb questions, just in case. Did you have the throttle wide open when you ran that compression test?
Yes, full throttle applied while cranking with all the plugs out and a battery charger hooked up. It was cranking as fast as possible.
10001110101 said:
The LA in my 75 Dart had a nylon coated cam gear. That coating failed and caused me to jump time and bend a couple pushrods.
This is also a possibility. I've read over and over that the stock timing sets on these things were terrible and cause stuff like this to happen all the time. It's entirely possible that's what we are dealing with here. I'll be taking the timing cover off to investigate soon. Hopefully, if this is the case, it's a matter of tossing on a new timing set and firing it back up.
Interesting. By which I mean, "oh, crap". But maybe it's an easy fix.
In your shoes, I'd definitely continue researching a 5.9 Magnum swap in case the [edit] 318 is too far gone to be worth fixing. We had a ZJ with a 5.2 Magnum and 46RH, and it was a really sweet combination.
In reply to DarkMonohue :
It's likely just a matter of time before I do a swap at this point. If I can get the current LA 318 running again, that's just putting off the inevitable. It's still a sloppy, 42 year old 318. I'm seeing running Magnum 5.9's around here in junkyards selling for $500-600. Hose it down, replace some gaskets, spray it Chrysler Corporate Blue, get a new intake and torque converter, and slap it in. Running Magnum 5.2's can be had for even less, but I think I want the extra cubes if I'm going through the trouble of swapping engines.
Tony Sestito said:
In reply to DarkMonohue :
It's likely just a matter of time before I do a swap at this point. If I can get the current LA 318 running again, that's just putting off the inevitable. It's still a sloppy, 42 year old 318. I'm seeing running Magnum 5.9's around here in junkyards selling for $500-600. Hose it down, replace some gaskets, spray it Chrysler Corporate Blue, get a new intake and torque converter, and slap it in. Running Magnum 5.2's can be had for even less, but I think I want the extra cubes if I'm going through the trouble of swapping engines.
Copy that. I'd almost certainly retain the factory EFI setup and intake manifold, but there are lots of ways to skin any given cat.
I sometimes go back and forth on replacing the AMC 360 in my J20 with something newer or bigger or both, but it's still very fresh at ~85K, and I can't justify throwing it out.
In reply to DarkMonohue :
Since I just spent all the time converting over to MSD Atomic EFI 2, I plan on just using that system on whatever ends up under the hood. It's simple and easy to use and tune.
In reply to Tony Sestito :
At least you'd likely be able to move to MPI over TBI which has its positives while retaining the Holley stuff to control it.
