1993 Volvo 960 wagon. V8 or T6?

I am buying a 1993 Volvo 960 wagon tomorrow.  It doesn't run and I have no idea why.

If I can't figure out the stock inline 6 what should I do?  A T6 twin turbo from an early 2000's s80 bolts up, but i can't find a solid answer for the wiring or ecu.  Will an early 2000 vintage volvo engine work off just the harness with just 12v?

How about a v8? Which is an easier path a 5.0 or maybe a 350?  Same question on wiring?  I would buy a complete donor to scavenge the engine and tranny from.

I will post some pictures after I secure the car.

V8 from a xc90.

Based on my recent acquisition I'm gonna have to say 5.0 all the things!  So far I'm floored by how cheap various parts are.

I'm only here to say I want to be first in line when you sell off the finished product!  

Can I interest you in a red c1500 

EvanB said:

V8 from a xc90.

That would be pretty cool and Swedish.

pimpm3 said:

EvanB said:

V8 from a xc90.

That would be pretty cool and Swedish.

Well, Swedish with a strong Japanese accent.  It's a Yamaha design, apparently.

Nothing from a turbo whiteblock six is going to be a particularly swappable computer, I don't think.  I have a feeling that anything they used in that timeframe is going to expect to see things on the network that you don't have.

On the plus side, if you're steady with a TIG, you can cut down the B628's oil pan to fit on a five cylinder, and use any number of pre-networked, thoroughly-hacked 5 cylinder whiteblock options.  Has been done many times.

Knurled. said:

pimpm3 said:

EvanB said:

V8 from a xc90.

That would be pretty cool and Swedish.

Well, Swedish with a strong Japanese accent.  It's a Yamaha design, apparently.

 

 

When Ford couldn't sell enough second gen SHO Taurii, they found a home for the Yamaha engines in the XC90.

Streetwiseguy said:

When Ford couldn't sell enough second gen SHO Taurii, they found a home for the Yamaha engines in the XC90.

Not sure if joking...  But if not, that's very, very wrong for a few reasons.  The V8 SHO was the 3rd gen, not 2nd.  And the XC90 V8 is a full liter bigger in displacement.  It is a Yamaha design like the SHO V8, however.  And from what I can find, there are a few similarities between the designs. 

In reply to rslifkin :

I guess it depends on if you consider the facelift in '93ish to be a different generation, or not.

It goes back and forth on whether the 4.4l is a bored and stroked SHO 3.4l.  There are a lot of similarities but "it's not related".  Reminds me of when the Ecotec came out, and I was at Saturn, and I took one look, and a second look, and a third look, and said "This here motor is an aluminum Quad 4 without that gawdawful sheetmetal timing chain cover!"  No, no, I was told, it's based on a SAAB engine.  Well maybe, if SAAB started off with Quad 4 blueprints and worked from there.

If I can get the stock 2.9 running I hear a BMW turbo manifold can be adapted to work.  Is there any tuning options for the oem  engine if I add boost?

I imagine Lucky at ARD has some experience.

ARD Tuning

I don't know what ECM the 960 uses, but assuming it's Bosch Motronic 4.x, like most of the FWD White Blocks, it's been cracked for a long time.

In reply to Knurled. :

The facelift also included the addition of the auto trans option and associated bigger engine.  So I've always heard it referred to as a new generation. 

As far as the engine, from what I found described, there are definite differences in the block design (open vs closed deck, etc.) although the bore centers and 60* bank angle (weird for a V8) are common between the 2 engines.  I wouldn't be surprised if Yamaha used some of their knowledge from the SHO V8 on the Volvo unit, but looking at the 2, I'd say it's not the same engine. 

In reply to rslifkin :

While all true, open vs. closed deck doesn't mean they're different engine families.  For instance, Subaru made open and closed deck EJ20s and EJ22s, depending on application.

Bore center, however, is one of those things that defines an engine family, along with a few other hard dimensions.

As opposed to most Challenge builds I say there's more style points in keeping it all Volvo. But my first three cars were Volvo's so I might be a Homer. 

A T6 twin turbo from an early 2000's s80 bolts up, but i can't find a solid answer for the wiring or ecu.  Will an early 2000 vintage volvo engine work off just the harness with just 12v?

Are you sure you need the oem T6 engine management at all? I'd say it's the main reason the t6s arent a big enthusiast motor in the first place. If the later t6 version of the engine uses the same (or swappable) trigger rings for the sensors you can probably run it off your factory ECU and do boost fuel/timing control with your choice of piggyback that costs ~$300. If there were good options for continuously retuning t6 ecus for that money there would probably be a lot more modified t6 cars out there. The basic engine itself seems great and there's nothing that much more proprietary about the tiny stock turbos than any number of other 'tiny twin turbos' platforms that have been modified to take big wheels and make stupid power inside stock or barely larger housings. 

1uz. Research the stock auto trans in the 960 and you'll figure out why quickly. That, or 4.2 stroker turbo Jeep for cheapness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrDgAitsOrE

Stampie said:

As opposed to most Challenge builds I say there's more style points in keeping it all Volvo. But my first three cars were Volvo's so I might be a Homer. 

I think keeping it all Volvo would be rad, but the 960's transmission is kind of scrody, and it's the only whiteblock reardrive transmission that was sold in the US, and then a 5.3/4L60 swap not only looks enticing, but also the easy button.

I won the auction today.  $225 plus fees for a total of $373.  I will post some pictures shortly.

Nice.

Some actual cheap fees for IAAI, too.

Not really. They are about the same as copart.  It is just a cheap car...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RssXIC3QSsA

That volvo V8 seems like a really good idea after listening to vids on youtube.


Not sure why.

FuzzWuzzy said:

Nice.

Some actual cheap fees for IAAI, too.

pimpm3 said:

Not really. They are about the same as copart.  It is just a cheap car...

The Dealer Fees  and the Public Fees ar IAA are not the same.  If I use a dealer, then I have to pay something to that dealer/broker.  We know IAA is all about the money and I think they have figured this out so IAA has essentially made themselves a broker where the state laws allow it.  

The pictures are from the Cleveland IAA and posted on an inside bulletin board.  

Dealer:

Public:

The small print at the bottom remains the same with $59 loading service fee and Internet Bidding Fee is the same on both.  What is different is the big numbers at the top.  

I recently won a car at IAA for $225 but my total payout was $433 or $60 more than dealer rates.  If I used a broker/dealer is would be similar or more because I'd have to pay the broker..  

At a $2,475 winning bid the difference is public pays $125 more

What you don't want to do place a $6,000 public bid.  Public pays $390 more and it just goes up from there.  

$20,000 public bid would pay $2,350 more!!!!!

I suspect that major/national accounts can get even better rates that standard dealer rate.  The only thing I know for sure is that it is not a level playing field.