Indian Head gasket compound removal..

Ok guys. My father in his infinite wisdom has used this stuff to seal the chaincase on his Royal Enfield in the hopes of stopping a leak. Being English, it still leaks and we can't get the cover off. Sliding a knife under the seal is problematic because there really isn't enough room between the engine and the cover to get anything in there.

I'm thinking a blowtorch is the only option. The paint is currently all-original so he's really hoping it won't come to that.

Any suggestions?

The Stuff:

The Bike:

The Location: (we need to get that black cover removed)

Unrelated:

http://www.nhmountainhiking.com/pemigewasset.html

And the more important question: will Fire even work on this stuff? It seems impervious to most chemical attacks

Try running it around the block, disassemble it hot. For future reference you want Hylomar or Curil T for that sort of thing. Can we get an exploded view or just a picture of the back of the part? I'm confused how the part attaches to begin with.

EDIT: Being a hardening type sealant, a few heat cycles of the engine might also break it loose.

Heat-cycling the engine won't work, it's a separate oil supply separated from the rest of the engine.

I'll try and find a schematic, but I doubt I can find one online. It fits on somewhat like a Tupperware lid.

I have a Matchless with a stamped steel primary case like that.

"unsealable" is the word you should be using.

Once you get it apart, give up on making it oil-tight. Just lube the primary chain with an oil can before you go for a ride and park it over an absorbent pad when you get home.

To get it apart, I'd be trying a heat gun with some gentle tapping and prying.

Just to upset you, i put together the broken hydraulic pump on my tractor with indian head gasket shellac, and it held.

I had to take it apart a year or two later. As i recall, I did it with thin bladed sharpened putty knives and a hammer.

it's never going to seal, but i'll take the leaker off his hands so he doesn't have to worry about it anymore. that thing is awesome.

eye dropper with mineral sprits along the seam will help soften it but its going to take some prying to get it to pop off. Maybe a psi or two of compressed air? leave bolt a turn or two loose so the cover can't makes its way across the room. As for sealing it after the tounge and groove is cleaned up try butyl tape from the RV store. or thin bead of silicone that allowed to "b stage" slightly cure.

I'll try the heat gun, at least before I resort to fire. I'm guessing the chain works at a high rpm so grease doesn't stick to it very well or something similar, not a problem to re-lube it every time it goes for a ride at this point.

patgizz wrote: it's never going to seal, but i'll take the leaker off his hands so he doesn't have to worry about it anymore. that thing is awesome.

Haha right? He picked it up as part of an Estate sale. He hasn't ridden a bike in 30+ years. I've beaten him in the "get a Moto license" game so I'm a bit more motivate than he is to get the thing running. Way classier than my Ninja 250 cafe! Definitely want to ride a few classic rallies on this bike. It deserves to be ridden a bit.

Trans_Maro wrote: Once you get it apart, give up on making it oil-tight. Just lube the primary chain with an oil can before you go for a ride and park it over an absorbent pad when you get home.

Sounds like an application for a "flowing grease" if it's just lubing a chain, you can get NLGI 00 (think apple sauce) at tractor supply for combine heads IIRC.

Cool I'll look for some as soon as I can get the thing off. I'll have to make sure that doesn't leave any bearings running dry though.

This thing is a pain. My dad mostly gave up on it about 6 months ago, it's just been sitting ever since. I'll see if we can lay it on it's side to give the mineral spirits a chance to work their magic. After that, heat and careful hammering.

My joking solution was to simply weld the thing on so it can't possibly leak and ride it until the interior chain really needs attention hahaha.

Just to preserve your sanity, please stop trying to make it not leak. That will not happen. I've seen British stuff, and Harleys, with fresh engines that contain no lubricant need a diaper on the floor. Give up now. Really.

Beautiful bike. Only thing I can suggest is working it with razor blades. Dried shellac is pretty impervious to any solvents.

I'll try with the razor blades, there just really isn't enough room to get to it. I really need a razor blade at right-angles to the handle, or maybe tack weld an xacto knife to a rod.

I'm really hoping heat will do the trick. There's a warning on the bottle that says not to use Indian Head around heat. I'm hoping it's more than the product simply being flammable before it's dried. I'm gonna borrow a heat gun from my friend tomorrow and see if I can make some 'headway'.

As for British stuff not leaking, I'm only too aware. Weeping seals to keep the dirt on the outside and all that. When I do get it off, I'll be investigating a grease solution for sure. That, or a super soft foam rubber gasket of some sort.

Shellac dissolves in Isopropil Alcohol or Acetone. But I can't see it working with such a thin edge exposed unless you can submerge and soak the seam.

If you still have the can of shellac,smear a few test strips on something and do some experiments to see how hot it needs to get or what will dissolve and contaminate the solution so that it does not go back to solid. ie acetone and transmission fluid.

FYI: the stuff is meant to work in temps up to 375F so it is going to take some serious heat to kill the stuff. The more I read about this stuff the less I want to use it in case the part ever has to come apart.

Once again...long shot on the thin exposed edge, but Loctite does make a product for what you are up against. Called loctite Chisel.Sure sounds promising.

http://www.henkelna.com/product-search-1554.htm?nodeid=8797899325441

Yea, I think I'm going home and throwing mine away.

That locktite chisel looks promising, but it's definitly going to eat away the paint. If I lay the bike down on its side I'll be able to let the stuff soak into the seam hopefully. Definitly worth a shot.

If not, I'm back to the blowtorch

While in college I worked part time in a motorcycle shop and Royal Enfield was one of the brands we sold new. They leaked all three types of lube before they were ever sold.

I don't think stopping the leaks on a '48 model is possible. But I'll buy it leaks and all, if that's a problem.

place drain pan under bike. Go to rite-aid buy a quart or two of 90% Isopropyl Alcohol pour in to chain case it will find the leak and as it does it will soften the indian head and creep around the cover. when you remove the cover blow dry the chain case and go from there.

Doing that will 100% ruin the chain if any solvents get into the rollers. It's probably due for a new one either way, just need to make sure I can get one beforehand.

Didn't get a chance to go to my parents house today. Should have some time tomorrow to give these suggestions a shot

I doubt it will ruin the chain.

Those bikes are low tech, mine just runs plain old 1/2" industrial drive chain.

If you get solvent in it, just soak it in oil.

Or spend the $20.00 for a new one. That's why I run mine a bit dry, I just replace the chain every year and don't worry about it.

Shawn

Ok thanks, I guess I won't worry about it. I'm used to sealed chains, stuff like that. Guess I'm forgetting the bike is nearly 70 years old!

That's half the fun.

Mine is about the most fun you can have with your clothes on, at 50mph...

Trans_Maro wrote: I doubt it will ruin the chain. Those bikes are low tech, mine just runs plain old 1/2" industrial drive chain. If you get solvent in it, just soak it in oil. Or spend the $20.00 for a new one. That's why I run mine a bit dry, I just replace the chain every year and don't worry about it. Shawn

Agreed that a little solvent isn't going to hurt a roller chain. Soak it in some light oil, it will be fine.

Isn't that kind of hard on the sprockets though? I assume those are not off the shelf industrial parts.