Land Rover Defender

Watching an episode of Dallas Car sharks and saw one of these come up for sale. A rag, needing a lot of work. Winning bid was over 30K. Huh?? Then I went on E-Bay and saw them for sale at over (WELL over!) $100K. What is so special about these? With all I read about the problems that come with Land Rovers, this makes no sense.

They're rare over here and hard to find in good shape even in the UK.

Also, DHS recently rounded up and confiscated/destroyed a lot of grey market (re-VINs)Defenders in a nationwide sting, thus further driving up the value of legit US copies. I like my Series, but I could use the extra power found in Defenders. However, I can't see dropping that kind of cash on one.

I remember seeing a Defender 110 (even more rare and valuable than the 90) on eBay that had rolled and caught fire going for $23k.

They're cool, but I will most likely never own one.

Buy a Disco 1, they share a lot of stuff from 94-97. Just without the cool body.

Defenders are cool and they're in limited supply in the US. And they're hugely capable. Prices have been on a steady upward trend for years.

A lot of the luxe stuff that is problematic on the Discos and Rangies just simply isn't on the Defenders.

What will a defender do what an FJ80 or FJ100 won't do?

Is the name plate that important?

z31maniac wrote: What will a defender do what an FJ80 or FJ100 won't do? Is the name plate that important?

What will they do that an FJ80 or 100 do?

Simple.
a) Not be a Toyota
b) Be cool
c) (possibly) Not run

Apis Mellifera wrote: Also, DHS recently rounded up and confiscated/destroyed a lot of grey market (re-VINs)Defenders in a nationwide sting, thus further driving up the value of legit US copies. I like my Series, but I could use the extra power found in Defenders. However, I can't see dropping that kind of cash on one.

Pissed off lawyer went to court and got them returned.
http://jalopnik.com/why-are-the-feds-obsessed-with-seizing-these-peoples-ol-1672381729

You can import ones from europe under the 25 year rule now, but they're all diesels and less desirable than the V8 powered North American ones. European diesel ones from the mid 80's are still selling for $30k-$50k though, depending on the configuration and condition.

Besides diesel availability, what will it do that a Jeep won't do better?

Adrian_Thompson wrote:

z31maniac wrote: What will a defender do what an FJ80 or FJ100 won't do? Is the name plate that important?

What will they do that an FJ80 or 100 do? Simple. a) Not be a Toyota b) Be cool c) (possibly) Not run

convertible too

Just today saw two beautiful Defender 90s on a longbed flatbed being towed behind a nice F350 dually....headed into DC.

Keith Tanner wrote: And they're hugely capable.

For the 1% of owners who will ever take their Defender off-road, lol...

They're rich-guy poser vehicles for the most part. Something you can take to cars and coffee on a nice morning and be the only SUV that gets to park up with the ferraris and other exotics.

You can get V8s from Europe, but they're not as common. Besides, the diesels are the ones you kind of want.

Kenny_McCormic wrote: Besides diesel availability, what will it do that a Jeep won't do better?

"Better"? How about "instead"? That's like asking what a Camaro will do that a Mustang won't do better.

They're more competent out of the box than most Jeeps. Seriously, you'd be surprised at what a stock Defender can do. If you get a 110, you get a lot more space than in any Wrangler. Generally speaking, you see them set up for overland travel more often than you see Jeeps. I mean, this is a company with an official "Guide to driving in Africa" that includes all sorts of plans for bush service. And, well, they're not a Jeep.

irish44j wrote:

Keith Tanner wrote: And they're hugely capable.

For the 1% of owners who will ever take their Defender off-road, lol... They're rich-guy poser vehicles for the most part. Something you can take to cars and coffee on a nice morning and be the only SUV that gets to park up with the ferraris and other exotics.

As a guy who's been involved in Land Rovers for a while, I'm gonna strongly disagree with that one. Defenders are too unpleasant to drive on-road all the time There are a few mall terrain vehicles, but it's a lot lower than 99%. It's pretty rare to see one without battle scars. Of course, I live near ground zero for off-roading.

But if you want to be a brand snob about it, I won't change your mind.

Keith Tanner wrote: You can get V8s from Europe, but they're not as common. Besides, the diesels are the ones you kind of want.

I wish my disco was a diesel.

As for the Defender, I would love to have one, there is something about their bare bones appearance and capability that make me tingle in inappropriate places

Hmm, I'm suddenly wondering if one of my friends in the UK can store this thing for a few years: https://www.gumtree.com/p/land-rover/snatch-landrover-v8-armoured-military-110-defender-tum-truck-utility-cav100-army/1144254937

That one is probably going to come in at about $10k including shipping - I'm almost tempted to do a bit of importing on the side: https://www.gumtree.com/p/land-rover/land-rover-defender-90-200tdi-/1143074979

They're status symbols in the US because of the huge trouble and expense of importing them there, and they look classy and tasteful which further boosts their appeal to old-money types. They're great for overland type use or as a work truck, but in sheer offroad capability they're actually not as good as a similarly set up Wrangler or Samurai. They do weigh a metric berkeleyton after all - that's not good for offroad performance. The sheer size of them limits where they can go as well.

I remember me and some buddies were going offroading for fun one day and we were driving up a steep and VERY slippery hill. All the Samurais went straight up, a 1L LWB model had some trouble but he made it up as well. Then an old Vitara made it up, and we all joked that we were having an exclusive Suzuki-only party at the top. Then the first non-Suzuki made it up, an old Ford Ranger.

Two Defenders struggled at the bottom, one eventually made it up IIRC and the other backed off after sliding backwards and nearly rolling into a gully.

Keith Tanner wrote:

irish44j wrote:

Keith Tanner wrote: And they're hugely capable.

For the 1% of owners who will ever take their Defender off-road, lol... They're rich-guy poser vehicles for the most part. Something you can take to cars and coffee on a nice morning and be the only SUV that gets to park up with the ferraris and other exotics.

As a guy who's been involved in Land Rovers for a while, I'm gonna strongly disagree with that one. Defenders are too unpleasant to drive on-road all the time There are a few mall terrain vehicles, but it's a lot lower than 99%. It's pretty rare to see one without battle scars. Of course, I live near ground zero for off-roading. But if you want to be a brand snob about it, I won't change your mind.

My guess is there's a strong regional disparity at play here. The highest concentration of Defenders I've ever seen has been in and around the DC area. When my GF was living in Alexandria I used to see 2 or 3 of them regularly that lived there, all flawless without a scratch on the paint. Ain't nowhere to go wheelin in metro DC, but there sure are a lot of people with money and big egos to fluff.

My neighbor has two of them- a 90 and a 110. I've driven both, they actually drive a lot like a TJ Wrangler if it was, you know, better Not to mention they look cool as hell and have those sweet sideways jump seats in the back.

I'll bet there are a lot of poseur Jeeps, G-wagens and Land Cruisers in DC as well - if you can't drive off-road, then anything with ground clearance and all wheel drive is going to be for impressing other people only.

GameboyRMH wrote: They're great for overland type use or as a work truck, but in sheer offroad capability they're actually not as good as a similarly set up Wrangler or Samurai. They do weigh a metric berkeleyton after all - that's not good for offroad performance. The sheer size of them limits where they can go as well.

2015 Land Rover Defender 90: 3739 lbs, 153" long x 71" wide.
2016 Jeep Wranger: starts at 3879 lbs, 164" long x 74" wide.

FYI. The 110 is, of course, bigger and heavier - but so is the Wrangler Unlimited.

We've already had the "which is better offroad" discussion in this forum, which basically showed itself to be Mustang vs Camaro.

Seems to be a rather obvious business opportunity here.

Do a Wheeler Dealer search in Europe for cars that you can bring back. Get enough containers, put on boat, wait. Sell for profit.

makes me glad that my disco has earned a few of it's scratches..

The Defender is like the forbidden fruit. Tell someone they can't have something, and it's all they will want.