So I went back to look at pricing/options/details. I didn't realize the Club trim level had this option:
"Buyers can opt for a $3400 performance package that brings 17-inch forged-aluminum BBS wheels, Brembo front brakes, and aerodynamic rocker-panel extensions and rear bumper trim."
That makes it much more interesting (except the damn roll bar issues).
One article I read indicated it's the same 2.0 in the Mazda 3, sans the manifolds to make it a longitudinal engine. Has Mazda left anything on the table with this engine? Or is it going to be like the NC, where you add intake/full exhaust/tune and only end up adding 15-20whp?
I also wonder if it will have a powerful enough ECU, like in the BRZ/FR-S, that the guys at Open Flash Tablet will be able to setup an E85 tune to take advantage of the super high compression ratio?
At 13:1, it's even more stout than BRZ's 12.5:1 and the BRZ responds very well to E85.
This might help with SOME of the questions:
http://www.automobilemag.com/features/lists/1505-10-more-things-to-know-about-the-2016-mazda-mx-5-miata/
http://us7.campaign-archive2.com/?u=3293297053d29d26e037ea32b&id=21b1c73828&e=5fbcf38fc2
That's all I can find so far. Flyin Miata just received a Mazda 3 with the Skyactive engine to play with and are waiting on their ND Development mule (aka first customer car, heh 
).
We don't use customer cars as development mules. If we did, we wouldn't have so many cars in our fleet. We're currently trying for order two NDs to use as development cars. The Mazda3 also belongs to us.
The ability to run E85 isn't reliant on a powerful ECU. Heck, we could program an NC with an E85 map that can be switched via the steering wheel buttons right now. However, you do need enough headroom in the fuel system to be able to run the higher fuel quantities. You also need an engine that can actually take advantage of it.
I would not expect big gains from intake/header/exhaust on any modern car unless it's turbocharged. Modern powertrain engineers are good, and they don't leave much on the table.
As for the $3400 Brembo/BBS option - save your money. For that, I can probably do a Wilwood based system on all four corners and you can pick a good set of wheels. Brembo pricing is silly.
In reply to Keith Tanner:
Sorry, forgot the smiley face there since I wasn't serious about using customer cars as dev mules.
There are some in the industry who do, alas.
Yeah. Ones without FM's reputation.
Keith Tanner wrote:
We don't use customer cars as development mules. If we did, we wouldn't have so many cars in our fleet. We're currently trying for order two NDs to use as development cars. The Mazda3 also belongs to us.
The ability to run E85 isn't reliant on a powerful ECU. Heck, we could program an NC with an E85 map that can be switched via the steering wheel buttons right now. However, you do need enough headroom in the fuel system to be able to run the higher fuel quantities. You also need an engine that can actually take advantage of it.
I would not expect big gains from intake/header/exhaust on any modern car unless it's turbocharged. Modern powertrain engineers are good, and they don't leave much on the table.
As for the $3400 Brembo/BBS option - save your money. For that, I can probably do a Wilwood based system on all four corners and you can pick a good set of wheels. Brembo pricing is silly.
Nice! I wonder if the fuel system will have the extra headroom. Typically the BRZ's are picking up around 15-20whp on corn juice.
Good to know on the brake option. I think you mentioned this before, but this will only have a legal roll-bar for it, if it's setup like the interchangeable one for the NC, right?
z31maniac wrote:
One article I read indicated it's the same 2.0 in the Mazda 3, sans the manifolds to make it a longitudinal engine. Has Mazda left anything on the table with this engine? Or is it going to be like the NC, where you add intake/full exhaust/tune and only end up adding 15-20whp?
Even if you could get 20hp from a intake/exhaust/tune (which I doubt) that is a 12% increase from the 167 crank HP. If you are talking RW HP, then 20 extra horses is about a 20% improvement. Sure, a Hellcat owner might not notice 20 hp, but to an average Miata owner, that would be a very big deal.
Rusnak_322 wrote:
z31maniac wrote:
One article I read indicated it's the same 2.0 in the Mazda 3, sans the manifolds to make it a longitudinal engine. Has Mazda left anything on the table with this engine? Or is it going to be like the NC, where you add intake/full exhaust/tune and only end up adding 15-20whp?
Even if you could get 20hp from a intake/exhaust/tune (which I doubt) that is a 12% increase from the 167 crank HP. If you are talking RW HP, then 20 extra horses is about a 20% improvement. Sure, a Hellcat owner might not notice 20 hp, but to an average Miata owner, that would be a very big deal.
Especially on the earlier NCs, the tune was terrible. A tune alone was 8-10whp, intake not much, basically all of the gains come from the tune and a catless header.
Same thing with the BRZ, catless header + tune is typically netting 15-20whp, throw in E85 and make it 30-40whp.
z31maniac wrote:
Good to know on the brake option. I think you mentioned this before, but this will only have a legal roll-bar for it, if it's setup like the interchangeable one for the NC, right?
Probably. It has a Z-top similar to the NC, which means that we'll probably have to resort to similar measures. If the top allows for tall enough hoops, it may just be a matter of bolting in some rear braces. But until I get some quality time with an ND and tools, that's mostly just informed guessing.
I was invited to drive the ND at Atlanta Motorsports Park last week and had mixed feelings about the car. On one hand I like the looks, I like the fit and finish inside, and I think this is the best handling Miata yet. I really wanted to love this car as I stood in line to get behind the wheel, but after driving it I'm not in love. It's a great car, don't get me wrong, but it didn't move me the way certain other cars have. I wouldn't sell my NB to get a new ND.
What bugs me is that even without the pricey performance package, this is still a $30,000 car. Yet even for that much money, I can't get a tan interior with the Club package. A hard top isn't offered yet, and if it becomes an option in 2017 or beyond, a car spec'd the way I'd want it would probably cost $35,000. And I'd still crave more power.
My desire for power is why I won't get one right now. I had an NA for many years and they are fun to drive at the limit, but I want something more that doesn't require an additional outlay of another $5k to get to a point where it has power. For $35k I can get a barely used C6 Z06 (I know, I know, different cars, used vs new).
I might get one later on though when prices are lower and/or used. I'm just not at the right place to buy new. I don't think the price is unfair though, it's reasonable for what you get, I just see my money going elsewhere.
All the CS autocrossers will have to order the Club Sport package to get the Brembos though. Although in an autocross setting I don't know how much of an advantage it will be over the base brakes with some aggressive pads. Are the BBS wheels wider than the base wheels? if so that will make it a must-have.
drdisque wrote:
All the CS autocrossers will have to order the Club Sport package to get the Brembos though. Although in an autocross setting I don't know how much of an advantage it will be over the base brakes with some aggressive pads. Are the BBS wheels wider than the base wheels? if so that will make it a must-have.
Bigger brakes in autox = disadvantage becuase of higher rotating and unsprung weight. Unless the stock brakes overheat and fade (which in autox is highly unlikely in a new stock car), you will only hurt yourself with larger brakes. Bigger wheels can have this effect too, but it is usually more than negated by the extra tire width.
We have a Brembo car on the way here right now. I'll know more about it soon, but as far as I know the wheels are the same size and the rotors are the same size. So if you're running in a class that requires you to use stock wheels, the Brembo package may offer a couple of pounds less rotating mass, but that's about it.
nderwater wrote:
What bugs me is that even without the pricey performance package, this is still a $30,000 car. Yet even for that much money, I can't get a tan interior with the Club package. A hard top isn't offered yet, and if it becomes an option in 2017 or beyond, a car spec'd the way I'd want it would probably cost $35,000. And I'd still crave more power.
It's a $25,000 MSRP car, actually. For $30k, you can indeed get a GT with a tan interior. Heck, Launch Editions are leaving the lot for less than that in the real world. FYI.
In 1990, you could buy a Mustang GT for about $1000 more than a Miata. And here we are in 2015, the Mustang GT is now $7k more than a Miata. Let's bitch about that instead.
I saw an inflation chart that showed the ND is actually a couple hundred LESS than a new NA
Yup. It's no more expensive than it's ever been.
Logic not allowed when complaining about the best-selling sports car of all time.
Anyways, i saw some numbers that Goodwin was getting out of theirs. Very interesting. 
Goodwin also has a bar/cage being built for one of their cars at Blackbird Fabworx right now
Swank Force One wrote:
Logic not allowed when complaining about the best-selling sports car of all time.
Anyways, i saw some numbers that Goodwin was getting out of theirs. Very interesting.
Oh really? Apparently some guys in Taiwan have figured out how to really get some power out of the header/overpipe setup on the BRZ. The ACE 4-2-1 header has SUPER long primaries and apparently picking up another 12-15whp over the current "best" header setup.
That means a legitimate 205-210whp BRZ (on E85) with intake/exhaust/tune/E85. It's relatively easy to pull about 100lbs out of the car without compromising DD abilities.
Keith, take a look at the ACE BRZ header, those long primaries may help with the Miata as well (of course their's is catless). This is a bit off-topic but so keith can see what I'm talking about.
Typical BRZ header:
The ACE header design:
I saw 166whp out of Goodwin's car with what appeared to be only a catback and a tune.
^Haven't a few tests shown that it might be a bit underrated from the factory?
For instance, what was their baseline number?
That would be more than a bit underrated - factory rating is 155hp, I suspect at the crank...
Their baseline was 141-142 i think. Doesn't seem to be underrated, unless you know something about driveline loss on the car that nobody else does.
Swank Force One wrote:
Their baseline was 141-142 i think. Doesn't seem to be underrated, unless you know something about driveline loss on the car that nobody else does.
That seems pretty inline then.
I just thought I remembered reading based on accel numbers they were thinking it was making a bit more than 155.
