From what I've seen Spec E30s run pretty close to Spec Miatas in terms of time, and on track my lightly prepped FRS is about as fast or slightly faster than either. I have 225 Star Specs + shocks/springs/alignment + headers/tune and that's about it in terms of performance. Otherwise an oil cooler and some bushings round out the total mods list.
I'm basing my times off of NASA Great Lakes race results (best lap times). Not sure on what track an E30 would be 10 seconds faster...
In reply to captainawesome :
I think someone alluded to above but have you thought about a 4 door E46? If you go for a 328 or something I think it's reasonably reliable (no turbo, etc.) and probably pretty cheap overall. It seems to tick most of your boxes I think.
I'm surprised a gutted Spec e30 car with driver weigh just about the same as an FRS in stock form.
I should clarify - I'm not a quick driver by any means, so with a better driver and race tires the FRS should be substantially faster.
bcp2011 said:In reply to captainawesome :
I think someone alluded to above but have you thought about a 4 door E46? If you go for a 328 or something I think it's reasonably reliable (no turbo, etc.) and probably pretty cheap overall. It seems to tick most of your boxes I think.
I'm purposely avoiding newer model BMWs. The e46 328ci I had was lackluster in every way and the 330ci wasn't much different. Hated the clutch pedal feel and characteristics, which from my reading is pretty common for them. Handling was remarkably better than the e30, but I felt like I was driving a boat around. I know that's not a fair comparison, but going from an e30 to an e46 is pretty shocking. Love the look of them, but inside they are outdated by years at this point and the nice examples demand a premium that just doesn't make sense to me(same for m3s).
I occasionally troll around for a 128i instead of the 135i to keep possible maintenance and repair costs down, but just can't pull the trigger. Lack of LSD(same for e46) or any affordable option for one, and a lack of aftermarket support don't help much.
In reply to captainawesome :
Ok, fair enough. Unfortunately not many manual 4 door RWD platforms exist, and for those that are out there they aren't exactly performance oriented (e.g., ATS, etc.). If you can fit the kids in the back of a twin they are a very good choice in terms of consumables and fun factor.
bcp2011 said:From what I've seen Spec E30s run pretty close to Spec Miatas in terms of time, and on track my lightly prepped FRS is about as fast or slightly faster than either. I have 225 Star Specs + shocks/springs/alignment + headers/tune and that's about it in terms of performance. Otherwise an oil cooler and some bushings round out the total mods list.
I'm basing my times off of NASA Great Lakes race results (best lap times). Not sure on what track an E30 would be 10 seconds faster...
I'm going off times I see spec e30's run at carolinas motorsports park(Kershaw SC). Spec e30/spec miata's in race trim both run +/- 1:50 laps.(~1:47 track record in spec miata) I don't think I've seen a stock frs go below 1:59, most struggle to break 2 minutes. Full disclosure, I'm sure the to spec race drivers are considerably better than the frs HPDE guys, and of course are running race tires, but at least here, the gap is significant. (I personally witnessed Mike Skeen run 1:51 in an e30 LEMONS car here too).
cbaclawski said:I'm going off times I see spec e30's run at carolinas motorsports park(Kershaw SC). Spec e30/spec miata's in race trim both run +/- 1:50 laps.(~1:47 track record in spec miata) I don't think I've seen a stock frs go below 1:59, most struggle to break 2 minutes. Full disclosure, I'm sure the to spec race drivers are considerably better than the frs HPDE guys, and of course are running race tires, but at least here, the gap is significant. (I personally witnessed Mike Skeen run 1:51 in an e30 LEMONS car here too).
As you said, I think driver is a big variable, and also on the level of prep for the twins. If they're truly stock, as in stock tires, I'm sure it's significantly slower, but I'm not sure that's the right comp against spec racers, or what the OP is going to run his car at. With not many mods (brakes, tires on stock wheels, and an alignment with camber bolts ($50 bucks) you can go pretty fast. There's a guy with exactly that set up (225 RS4s, XP10s, and camber bolts on an otherwise stock FRS) who ran Autobahn faster than me by close to two seconds, despite me having an extra 20hp or so. Here's a video of him chasing a Viper. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RH6sxjUXuvE
At the same track, here's me at 1:44. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGuzuFbYnyI
On the same day, race results show roughly the same time for E30 (fastest lap): http://racehero.io/events/nasa-gl-abcc-the-clumsy-cow-2018/results/1073744714
And as I said before, I'm *far* from being even a good driver, so with slicks and a good driver I'm sure there's another 2-3 seconds that's pretty easy to be found. So all this is to say that I don't think the OP will be disappointed with the performance of the car vs. his E30 right now.
In reply to bcp2011 :
Fair enough, You're right that spec racer's aren't really a fair comparison to a true stock frs. I also agree that The OP would probably be more than happy with the performance coming from a 4cyl e30. Especially with decent tires and brake pads...
I'm pretty far from a "good" driver myself, I'm sure there is someone out there that would lap me in an FRS even if I was in a Mclaren.
If Toyota/Subaru would just find a way to add 50 hp without adding weight or upsetting the balance, We wouldn't be having this conversation, and probably both have one!
TBH, I think they are sweet little cars, great looking, and surprisingly capable... I've just never personally seen a stock one run even close to a spec e30 or miata (though as previously agreed, lots of variables, and not a fair comparison to begin with)
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