Mr_Asa
UltimaDork
11/27/22 6:16 p.m.
Stopped to use the facilities. Got in the car, push the button, sounds like it kicked half over and then didn't keep going.
Don't seem to be any of the other typical indicators of a bad battery. Dash is bright, doesn't noticeably dim when trying to crank.
Probably won't need it, but anyone near the Wawa at US19 and Gulf-To-Lake Hwy in Crystal River?
Not fun. Dirty terminal, maybe?
If you were on the other side of the state, we could run over and help.
Tampa people?
Mr_Asa
UltimaDork
11/27/22 6:35 p.m.
So, I let it sit for ~25 minutes and tried it. Wasn't happy turning over, but she got there. Haven't had a scare like that since I lived in Tallahassee.
Ok, anyone know if an ND will give me a warning light if the alternator craps out while driving?
How old's the battery? FWIW, our 2014 Civic Si's battery went without any lights or warning. It was good and then it wasn't.
Mr_Asa
UltimaDork
11/27/22 6:51 p.m.
In reply to David S. Wallens :
Likely original to the car, so probably has a 2017 date code.
This experience is frustrating and im gonna have to think on why (other than the obvious)
In reply to Mr_Asa :
In my experience new batteries just aren't as good. My brand new 2013 Mustang needed a new battery at 6 months. OEMs are trying to save money so batteries are an easy way for them to save.
Sonic
UberDork
11/27/22 8:44 p.m.
I think newer cars are just more fussy with batteries. Our 17 MB E400 wanted a new battery last fall with only 40k miles. It is more integrated now than ever with modern electronics and canbus and it wants a standards voltage. This isn't a 1990 f150.
You're in Florida - 5 years is good for a battery here. I've had reasonable quality aftermarket batteries last less than 3 years. The heat kills them quickly.
The longest lasting battery I've had here was the OEM battery that came with my Focus RS, which lasted 5 years. When it came time to replace it, I ordered another original-spec Motorcraft straight from Ford.
In reply to Sonic :
You are right and I should've considered that too. Modern electronics are ubiquitous in cars and they are hard on the battery.
Mr_Asa
UltimaDork
11/27/22 10:46 p.m.
Thinking on it, I did get to the gas station and shut the engine off, but left it in accessory mode so I could finish listening to something on NPR. The seat heater for me was on. Probably put a decent strain on the battery.
Mr_Asa said:
This experience is frustrating and im gonna have to think on why (other than the obvious)
Thinking on this while I completed my drive home.
I think what's frustrating about this is that there was no warning. It probably isn't completely fair to compare two vehicles that are literally a quarter century apart (and probably not completely smart, considering how drastically different the two are) but my truck never gave me any sort of surprises like this.
Part of that is that I have the better part of two decades to drive the truck and learn all her foibles and idiosyncrasies, but part of that is that I have functioning gauges on the truck (even if they aren't 100% accurate, they give me a feeling of what is going on.) The only time in my quarter million miles of driving that it left me stranded and I didn't know there was an issue beforehand was when the fuel pump went out halfway across the country, coincidentally I don't have a fuel PSI or flow gauge on the truck.
I'm not sure what I can do about this, if there is anything to do. In this particular case, a regular ole voltage gauge would have done the trick.
Another aspect of it being frustrating is that this car is almost an order of magnitude more in cost than the truck. I'm not supposed to have these issues (or others) for another decade or more. Again, not sure if that's fair either, just an initial thought.
Anyways, car started after I got home and parked it. Put the trickle charger on it overnight, I'll see what the voltage is on it before I leave in the morning.
Terminals look good.
Trickle Charger deployed
If the battery is old and has lost some capacity, it doesn't take much to cause a no-start. Especially on something like a Miata that has a tiny battery already.
The battery in my E38 went in a similar fashion. It was getting old and had lost a ton of capacity, but started the car fine, so I hadn't noticed. Until a few short trips (where the car doesn't keep things topped off as well), then the car sat in the garage for 2 days. I had opened the doors a couple times while cleaning stuff. Went to start the car the next day and got a click, followed by all of the electronics rebooting. No start. Threw it on a charger for 30 minutes, it fired right up. Ran the errand I needed to, then bought a new battery.
Mr_Asa
UltimaDork
11/28/22 3:02 p.m.
To wrap this up, I got out there this morning, checked the charger light and it showed fully charged.
No muss, no fuss. I guess now I just have to test the battery later and then try and figure out what I want to do about gauges?
Mr_Asa said:
I guess now I just have to test the battery later and then try and figure out what I want to do about gauges?
If the car is charging the battery properly and the battery is just failing, gauges won't necessarily tell you much until key-on right before the no start (if even then).
Some cars just crank slower and slower to the point you notice when the battery gets weak. But on others, the electronics freak out and reboot when the voltage drops too low, so the resulting no-start becomes the first obvious symptom.
And if the battery has lost a ton of capacity but doesn't have a bad cell or anything, it'll show a normal resting voltage (but will fail on a proper battery tester). That's when you can get the seemingly normal start (maybe cranking slightly slow without being noticed) followed by a no-start (something drew the battery down a little and it no longer had enough juice for a start, or it cranked slightly too long, etc.).
I didn't read everything to the letter, but it's unlikely your alternator is the culprit.
I'd just buy a new battery and move on. 5 years seems to be the threshold these days.
It's a five year old battery. Change it, make sure it's charging when the car is running and move on with life.
You need a new battery, and this was your one warning. The next one will strand you. I know why it's frustrating - we're used to old cars that crank slow and let you know the battery is going out. But with new cars they crank normal until they won't crank because the computer senses low voltage and doesn't want to damage anything. So we're accustomed to a lot more leeway with low / bad batteries.
Replace it now. I recommend Interstate; I've had great luck with their batteries for a long time. Costco carries them, but I get mine for a good price with a commercial account at the local Interstate store.
And some info about extending the life of your battery from our YouTube.
In reply to dculberson :
And I think that's part of the denial–the little to warning most of us get regarding a dead battery.
I've replaced four batteries in the past two years. In the end, my wallet lost and Big Battery always won.
Batteries either get weaker over time, and you don't notice it until you are sitting someplace listening to the radio with the car shut off, and then it won't start, or they just quit working suddenly.
A gauge won't tell you much about that.
dculberson said:
You need a new battery, and this was your one warning. The next one will strand you. I know why it's frustrating - we're used to old cars that crank slow and let you know the battery is going out. But with new cars they crank normal until they won't crank because the computer senses low voltage and doesn't want to damage anything. So we're accustomed to a lot more leeway with low / bad batteries.
Replace it now. I recommend Interstate; I've had great luck with their batteries for a long time. Costco carries them, but I get mine for a good price with a commercial account at the local Interstate store.
I agree, modern batteries don't seem to give you clear signs of impending failure like we were used to. I stopped my F150 long enough to load a few bags of mulch at Walmart, and it refused to restart. Dead, no cranking, nothing. Fortunately, Walmart sells decent car batteries, and I had my basic roadside tool kit, so I was rolling again in a few minutes.
My old auto shop instructor observed that batteries usually lasted just a little longer than the warranty period. Now it seems there is a trend from long pro-rated warranties to typically 36-month free replacement.