What's the deal with Mobil 1?

In reply to LanEvo:

Group III base stocks are definitely common. But in a lot of cases, they perform just as well in UOAs as a comparable Group IV or Group V based oil, so IMO, it's not a determining factor in whether the oil will work well or not.

From what I've read (and I'm not a tribologist) is that the main difference between the "EPA" oils for cars now and the rise of the "competition" oils is that EPA oils no longer have the ZDDP, which is most important for cold starts and even intermittent oil pressure dips. If you can find a Group III/IV/V with ZDDP for a reasonable price, it has some protection features over the EPA oils and will be likely less expensive than the competition oils advertising the addition of ZDDP. Unfortunately, the relationship between the amount of ZDDP and protection from wear is not linear. One of the main advantages of synthetic PAO or other non dinosaur oils is the higher flash point and lower likelihood of coking the rings. In heavy industrial equipment, the uniform molecule size of the "ultra-refined" Group III oils have caused problems with varnish, caused by static buildup and sparking in metal filters. There are other factors at play as well, which you can read ad-nauseum over at Bobistheoilguy.

Last I knew, the 0W30 Castrol Syntec labeled as "European Formula" (often called "German Castrol" since that's where it's made) was an affordable and common way to get what was generally believed by those who follow such things religiously to be a Group IV base oil from local parts stores...Again, not that it necessarily matters from a functional standpoint anymore.

I've used many synthetics over the years. Mobil 1 was the first readily available synthetic I remember, and I've used it with success in many vehicles (except Subarus with the EJ engines. My cars would drink it!). When I bought my Mazda 3, it called for a water-like 0W20, and they were the first to make that weight that you could buy in a store. I used it for a few years until the other brands caught up with no issues.

I also like Castrol Edge synthetic, Rotella T6 5W40 (great for some turbo applications like the Subaru EJ's), and Pennzoil Platinum. Walmart Super Tech synthetic isn't bad, either. From what I've heard, they are just rebranded from other oil companies, and have included Mobil in the past. Not sure how accurate that is now, though.

rslifkin wrote: In reply to LanEvo: Group III base stocks are definitely common. But in a lot of cases, they perform just as well in UOAs as a comparable Group IV or Group V based oil, so IMO, it's not a determining factor in whether the oil will work well or not.

Maybe it didn't come across in my post, but I agree completely. Personally, I use Brad Penn in the racecar.

I just have an issue with the deliberately opaque language they use. Feels dishonest.

I've been using synthetics, mostly Mobil-1 for the last 25 years. I started using Mobil-1 because Auto Palace was giving us quite a bit for our stock car and it was working great so I was buying it for myself. I put a lot of mileage on my cars and even going 10-15,000 miles between changes have used almost no oil right up until I killed them. My Malibu was losing less than half a quart every 10,000 miles even after 400,000 miles.

Easiest way to find out if it's a "true" synthetic is to check it's ACEA (european) rating. It needs to be an A3/B3, A3/B4, or A5/B5 rating.

Most Mobil 1 products are base III now, I think it's the silver cap that still uses base IV.

API ratings are a joke. What do you expect when the rating system is created by the oil companies themselves? The ACEA is controlled by the auto manufacturers and have much higher standards.

LanEvo wrote: I just have an issue with the deliberately opaque language they use. Feels dishonest.

If that's the case, add at least Amsoil to your list, as some of their oils are also Group III base these days, and their FAQ invokes the 'trade secrets' defense when discussing the basestock.

In reality though, are there (or have there ever been) any oils that are actually 100% Group IV/V synthetic? To the best of my knowledge, most (all?) have at least a little conventional base to help hold the additives in suspension. Even going on the historically accepted 'majority' argument, regardless of whether Group III is/isn't considered 'synthetic', as I understand it an oil would be considered a "full synthetic" even with 49% conventional basestock. So really, the term "full synthetic" itself has never been anything more than a deliberately opaque marketing term.

Semi random story. Back before Jeremy Mayfield discovered meth, he was running Cup for Penske, and Mobil 1 was his primary sponsor. During one race, something happened to the oil cooler or dry sump or something, and he finished the race, and won, with the oil temp needle wrapped around to the bottom side of the stop pin on the gauge, like approaching 400 degrees. He had some burns from the dry sump tank behind his seat. Also had the foresight to talk up Mobil 1 in Victory lane, and Mobil used that as advertising for quite a while.

My '86 Shelby GLHS had: "Use only Mobil 1" printed on the filler cap. Naturally, I have used it in everything, including lawnmowers, ever since.

My biggest pieve is the Mobil 1 race car brag. All the Mobil 1 sponsored cars don't use the same Mobil 1 we can get. I use redline in the 996, Rotella syn in the diesel and whatever is cheapest syn on the others.

markwemple wrote: My biggest pieve is the Mobil 1 race car brag. All the Mobil 1 sponsored cars don't use the same Mobil 1 we can get. I use redline in the 996, Rotella syn in the diesel and whatever is cheapest syn on the others.

Agreed. In the case of my Jeep, its needs oil-wise are basically something in the realm of a 5W-40 and ideally synth (oil temps get a little high if you're beating on it). So it gets whatever the flavor of the day is for 5W-40 diesel oil (usually Rotella, last time it got Delo 400).